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Old 09-16-2008, 01:57 AM
 
3,007 posts, read 3,253,292 times
Reputation: 2001

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bianca.G View Post
No such thing as a good gang. All are bad and no good . I don't see illegal in a gang worse than a citizen in a gang.
True enough, except that it does point up the human cost of being lax in border control. These gang members import their special brand of savagery, which they learned from civil wars fought in their countries, and teach it to American kids. We have enough "citizen gangs" to deal with; we don't need any new outsiders.

I do wish that we would take off the kid gloves with criminals in general, but particularly with those who are not citizens. I see their status as just another potential way for us to gain the upper hand.
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Old 09-16-2008, 05:22 AM
 
3,859 posts, read 9,170,029 times
Reputation: 2728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bianca.G View Post
No such thing as a good gang. All are bad and no good . I don't see illegal in a gang worse than a citizen in a gang.


Really? Well I do. You see the gang members who are American are low life scum but they have a right to be here. The illegal alien gang members are not only low life scum but they have no right to be here.

As we have all said-deport ALL illegal aliens and crime will automatically drop. We will have more law enforcement resources to use to clean up and catch our own crimminals who have a right to be here. No illegal alien gang members here means more resources to be used on our own American gang members.
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Old 09-16-2008, 06:53 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,690,207 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bianca.G View Post
No such thing as a good gang. All are bad and no good . I don't see illegal in a gang worse than a citizen in a gang.
They are worse. One simply for the fact that these people make use of the open borders to commit their crimes. They often hightail it back into Mexico where they are protected. They can machete-hack passengers on a bus in Honduras one day and be in the USA the next. They are controlled from foreign countries, often from the out-of-control prisons in those countries.

Also the societal problems that create these gangs make them far more violent than our domestic gangs. The hispanic gangs are much more violent than gangs we've ever before seen in this country. None of these hispanic gangs involve hispanics with deep roots in the USA.
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:15 AM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,686,811 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
THE GANG FORMED IN AMERICA. IT IS AN AMERICAN GANG.

It may have started some 20 years ago among El Savadoran immigrants, but it grew in AMERICA.

It formed to protect itself from the Black and Mexican gangs in AMERICA.

And from HERE it got exported. NOW they are spread all over.

MS-13 shouldn't even be part of the illegal immigration discussion. Its an American problem. Its a GANG issue, not an ILLEGAL issue because of the VERY SMALL PERCENTAGE of illegals who are actually in gangs.

Its just easier to pretend America was this perfect place before the Latin-Americans arrived.
And its a lot easier to put out your hate of illegal immigrants, when you pretend they are all carrying ak-47s killing "innocent" Americans.
Deport every single illegal immigrant, and you'll still be stuck with the gang problem. So don't kid yourself that they are the same thing.
How can you say that this is not a part of the illegal immigration problem?

Do you have your head stuck firmly in the sand somewhere? Geezus amc, over 7/8 of the membership of MS-13 is illegal. If the b*stards couldn't get into the country to begin with, then this gang would be a non-factor in the present criminal element of the U.S.

You have this rabid need to make everything into a race issue. I'm sure that somewhere along the line, someone told you that once race is thrown into any argument, rhetoric becomes moot and logical discussion flies right out the window. God knows it's your method of attempting to hijack each and every debate, no matter what the tone of the thread may be.

I'm tired of trying to logically reach someone whose very demeanor suggests the child in the sandbox hoarding all of the toys. "This is MY topic. YOU all are are racists, bigots, and xenophobes. ONLY I know anything about ALL THINGS Latin American BECAUSE I, YES I, AM the ONLY TRUE PERSON OF LATIN AMERICAN heritage and you GRINGOS know NOTHING except your own RACIST, BIGOTTED, AND XENOPHOBIC VIEWS. That you should presume to attempt to smear any of Latin American descent proves it!"

America has a crime problem. America has a gang problem. I'm sorry if it offends you to find out that the FBI and numerous other law enforcement agencies in the U.S. as well as the world, consider MS-13 to be the most dangerous gang in America and it is rapidly spreading across the world. Yes, everyone knows that this gang began in L.A. twenty or so years ago, but it was begun by Salvadorans and it's membership is entirely Latin American with the vast majority of those members consisting of illegal immigrants from Central American countries and no matter how much huffing and puffing you do, you cannot change fact. Frankly, your little temper tantrums in defense of MS-13 are getting tiresome and I am quickly losing the inclination to attempt to get you to see the fallacy of your line of thought regarding this situation.

America grows enough of her own criminal element. We do not need to import more. If all illegal aliens were deported tomorrow, we would still have gang activity, but with somewhere between 13,000 to 20,000 MS-13 members out of the way, our law enforcement agencies would be better equipped to get a handle on our homegrown gang members. In addition, we wouldn't be dealing with gang members who come from Central America with gorilla military training and the smuggled weaponry that they bring with them. God knows, the weaponry gang members have available to them in this country is deadly enough without adding more into the mix.

No gang on American soil is as well organized or is as big a threat to Americans as MS-13. So sorry you're offended by the truth--but it is in every single link I've posted.

You'd have a better chance of understanding just what kind of threat this organization is if you would get past your need to remind us all that there are other gangs, American gangs, in the U.S.--yeah, we get it. There are also Asian gangs, Russian gangs, Mexican gangs, Ukranian gangs, etc. But they are not nearly the threat that MS-13 is at this time in U.S. history. If you don't agree, that's fine. I really don't care. I think that I will just look to the FBI rather than amc760 to judge just how dangerous MS-13 is. I'll also go along with their statistics regarding the ethnic make-up of this gang. They tend to be in more of a position of authority to garner this information than you are.
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:24 AM
 
3,859 posts, read 9,170,029 times
Reputation: 2728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
How can you say that this is not a part of the illegal immigration problem?

Do you have your head stuck firmly in the sand somewhere? Geezus amc, over 7/8 of the membership of MS-13 is illegal. If the b*stards couldn't get into the country to begin with, then this gang would be a non-factor in the present criminal element of the U.S.

You have this rabid need to make everything into a race issue. I'm sure that somewhere along the line, someone told you that once race is thrown into any argument, rhetoric becomes moot and logical discussion flies right out the window. God knows it's your method of attempting to hijack each and every debate, no matter what the tone of the thread may be.

I'm tired of trying to logically reach someone whose very demeanor suggests the child in the sandbox hoarding all of the toys. "This is MY topic. YOU all are are racists, bigots, and xenophobes. ONLY I know anything about ALL THINGS Latin American BECAUSE I, YES I, AM the ONLY TRUE PERSON OF LATIN AMERICAN heritage and you GRINGOS know NOTHING except your own RACIST, BIGOTTED, AND XENOPHOBIC VIEWS. That you should presume to attempt to smear any of Latin American descent proves it!"

America has a crime problem. America has a gang problem. I'm sorry if it offends you to find out that the FBI and numerous other law enforcement agencies in the U.S. as well as the world, consider MS-13 to be the most dangerous gang in America and it is rapidly spreading across the world. Yes, everyone knows that this gang began in L.A. twenty or so years ago, but it was begun by Salvadorans and it's membership is entirely Latin American with the vast majority of those members consisting of illegal immigrants from Central American countries and no matter how much huffing and puffing you do, you cannot change fact. Frankly, your little temper tantrums in defense of MS-13 are getting tiresome and I am quickly losing the inclination to attempt to get you to see the fallacy of your line of thought regarding this situation.

America grows enough of her own criminal element. We do not need to import more. If all illegal aliens were deported tomorrow, we would still have gang activity, but with somewhere between 13,000 to 20,000 MS-13 members out of the way, our law enforcement agencies would be better equipped to get a handle on our homegrown gang members. In addition, we wouldn't be dealing with gang members who come from Central America with gorilla military training and the smuggled weaponry that they bring with them. God knows, the weaponry gang members have available to them in this country is deadly enough without adding more into the mix.

No gang on American soil is as well organized or is as big a threat to Americans as MS-13. So sorry you're offended by the truth--but it is in every single link I've posted.

You'd have a better chance of understanding just what kind of threat this organization is if you would get past your need to remind us all that there are other gangs, American gangs, in the U.S.--yeah, we get it. There are also Asian gangs, Russian gangs, Mexican gangs, Ukranian gangs, etc. But they are not nearly the threat that MS-13 is at this time in U.S. history. If you don't agree, that's fine. I really don't care. I think that I will just look to the FBI rather than amc760 to judge just how dangerous MS-13 is. I'll also go along with their statistics regarding the ethnic make-up of this gang. They tend to be in more of a position of authority to garner this information than you are.

Awesome post, Kele!
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:27 AM
 
Location: San Diego North County
4,800 posts, read 7,686,811 times
Reputation: 3010
Quote:
Originally Posted by nicolem View Post
Awesome post, Kele!
Thank you.

However, I'm afraid it's an exercise in futility, rather like jamming my hand repeatedly into a meat grinder and expecting different results each time.....
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Old 09-16-2008, 07:34 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kele View Post
Thank you.

However, I'm afraid it's an exercise in futility, rather like jamming my hand repeatedly into a meat grinder and expecting different results each time.....
Methinks you have a titanium hand---------and, the meat grinder's blades shatter
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Old 09-16-2008, 12:27 PM
 
Location: Center of the universe
24,757 posts, read 32,891,787 times
Reputation: 11780
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luiso View Post
The Mayor of Newark had been turning a blind eye to growing illegal gang members and crime .

Only when this happens does he step up to the plate.
Sharpe James, the old mayor, who was just sent to jail, yes, you could say that about him.

Current Mayor Cory Booker is trying to change things in Newark, and that includes dealing with gangs and crime.
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Old 09-16-2008, 04:14 PM
 
1,818 posts, read 2,733,980 times
Reputation: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by chattypatty View Post
True enough, except that it does point up the human cost of being lax in border control. These gang members import their special brand of savagery, which they learned from civil wars fought in their countries, and teach it to American kids. We have enough "citizen gangs" to deal with; we don't need any new outsiders.

I do wish that we would take off the kid gloves with criminals in general, but particularly with those who are not citizens. I see their status as just another potential way for us to gain the upper hand.

Most of the gangs are already here, they are way past border patrol.
For years none of the states seemed to get a handle on it, and they have just kept growing. They will not be stopped now. It is the same as drugs
they are not making much a dent doing something about Meth, that hurts everyone not just themselves. Too little has been done for too many years, and now all of these problems are coming home to roost.
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Old 09-16-2008, 04:22 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyone View Post
Most of the gangs are already here, they are way past border patrol.
For years none of the states seemed to get a handle on it, and they have just kept growing. They will not be stopped now. It is the same as drugs
they are not making much a dent doing something about Meth, that hurts everyone not just themselves. Too little has been done for too many years, and now all of these problems are coming home to roost.
Meth from what I have heard is starting to fade in popularity.........people are wising up that it is an evil drug.
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