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Old 09-24-2008, 01:20 PM
 
7,020 posts, read 9,909,669 times
Reputation: 1094

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
Forgive me if I hold more faith in those with doctorates in economics who sit on international trade boards than I do with a random poster on the internet. My "assumptions" are based on a semester's worth of study on NAFTA and manufacturing economics of the U.S. and Mexico. Unless you have an MBA I wasn't aware of, your casual observations on NAFTA aren't worth a damn. You can Google all you want, but you still have zero experience in working with these actual issues.

The U.S. economy of 2008, even in its current state, is still a much stronger engine than that of 1993. Face it, you are out of your league in trying to talk about economics.
Gee just think, when you join the real world instead of basing your opinions on one semester of text book scenarios, then you just might be able to have a reason to ASSume you know anything about MY EXPERIENCES or how the real world works.

You are out of your league by thinking I'd be impressed with your textbook analogies. BTW, my son is a graduate of Lake Forest Academy and a current economics major at SLU. I'm more inclined to be impressed with him than someone stalking me on a message board in the hopes of getting me banned. Sorry, you lose AGAIN.

You are now officially a member of my ignore list. I hope you enjoy sharing that status with your other personality and anchor baby/illegal contemporaries. [Al Pacino Scarface Voice]Say hello to your little friends!
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:33 PM
 
1,818 posts, read 2,737,812 times
Reputation: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
I think what sassyone means is that someone who risks everything to make a dangerous journey to the U.S., just to work 12 hour+ days for little pay to eke out a living for themselves is far more admirable than a U.S. citizen who collects welfare benefits while adding nothing to the U.S. economy. It's a matter of work ethic, and something I've seen stronger in Mexican migrant workers than most American citizens, including myself.
Thank you, that was exactly what I meant.
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:39 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,911 posts, read 30,162,897 times
Reputation: 17736
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyone View Post
Thank you, that was exactly what I meant.
Ya, and the American is breaking no laws while the Illegal Alien is breaking 1-6 of em. Ya that's something to admire.
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:41 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,049,243 times
Reputation: 2878
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
I think what sassyone means is that someone who risks everything to make a dangerous journey to the U.S., just to work 12 hour+ days for little pay to eke out a living for themselves is far more admirable than a U.S. citizen who collects welfare benefits while adding nothing to the U.S. economy. It's a matter of work ethic, and something I've seen stronger in Mexican migrant workers than most American citizens, including myself.

Speak for yourself. With the exception of those on welfare (which hardly equates to the entirey of the US) just where do you see lazy americans? I see the elderly working as cashiers at dollar stores. I see people like my dh who, while a salaried white collar employee worked a minimum of 70 hours a week for over a year. No work ethic? My mil is 67 and has no hopes of being able to retire till well after 70, and she is an RN.
Americans do have work ethics, americans will do the 'dirty jobs', americans do take pride in their accomplishments. However, what americans won't do is work as scab labor and americans will not work in dangerous work environments for substandard pay. And that is the only thing the illegal has over the american worker. No standards, no morality, and no sense of legality. You want to talk about a sense of entitlement? Don't look to the american welfare queens, look to the laraza crowd.
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Old 09-24-2008, 01:55 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,834,008 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
Speak for yourself. With the exception of those on welfare (which hardly equates to the entirey of the US) just where do you see lazy americans? I see the elderly working as cashiers at dollar stores. I see people like my dh who, while a salaried white collar employee worked a minimum of 70 hours a week for over a year. No work ethic? My mil is 67 and has no hopes of being able to retire till well after 70, and she is an RN.
Americans do have work ethics, americans will do the 'dirty jobs', americans do take pride in their accomplishments. However, what americans won't do is work as scab labor and americans will not work in dangerous work environments for substandard pay. And that is the only thing the illegal has over the american worker. No standards, no morality, and no sense of legality. You want to talk about a sense of entitlement? Don't look to the american welfare queens, look to the laraza crowd.
How true! Now, more than ever, I see elderly people working. Most are not working simply to alleviate boredom; they are working because they have to. To add insult to injury, many have lost their hard-earned money in 401(k)ís due to corporate corruption. It's breaks my heart to see some of these elderly people being forced to work, while our tax dollars are supporting illegal aliens. Our government has even reduced benefits for Medicare to accommodate illegals. It's a dirty shame!
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Old 09-24-2008, 02:28 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,633,512 times
Reputation: 2983
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
I think what sassyone means is that someone who risks everything to make a dangerous journey to the U.S., just to work 12 hour+ days for little pay to eke out a living for themselves is far more admirable than a U.S. citizen who collects welfare benefits while adding nothing to the U.S. economy. It's a matter of work ethic, and something I've seen stronger in Mexican migrant workers than most American citizens, including myself.
I'll agree with you...there are good and bad people in all countries, and "good" Mexicans are certainly more admirable than "bad" Americans. Unfortunately, such concepts as international law, security, and the mechanics which drive an economy, have little latitude for including people's individual 'goodness' or 'badness', or even their work ethic. Illegal immigration is a matter of law, not morals or 'beliefs'. If civil law were strictly a matter of morality, most of our lawyers would be disbarred, "good" people would be rich, and "bad" people would lose out..but that's not the way laws work.

I'm sure MOST of us would gladly trade a busload of "bad" Americans for a busload of "good" Mexicans any day of the week...unfortunately, though, that is not possible under the law. We cannot get rid of our unproductive citizens, even though we might want to....so the comparison becomes rather pointless.

Bad Americans are still citizens, and "good" foreigners are not....and though we take in PLENTY of foreign citizens. LEGALLY, all the time, we don't have room for everyone. And that's a matter of law, which is what determines who's legal and who's not.
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Old 09-24-2008, 02:40 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,673,551 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus89 View Post
Forgive me if I hold more faith in those with doctorates in economics who sit on international trade boards than I do with a random poster on the internet. My "assumptions" are based on a semester's worth of study on NAFTA and manufacturing economics of the U.S. and Mexico. Unless you have an MBA I wasn't aware of, your casual observations on NAFTA aren't worth a damn. You can Google all you want, but you still have zero experience in working with these actual issues.

The U.S. economy of 2008, even in its current state, is still a much stronger engine than that of 1993. Face it, you are out of your league in trying to talk about economics.
I would put more credence in your opinions if you also felt that at least our southern border needed to be closed/locked along with the mechanisms installed to toss the illegals out----------lock, stock and barrel.

Trust me: kidacarus89; we (the USA) has enough problems without subsidizing (sp) those criminals from Mexico, etc.
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Old 09-24-2008, 02:53 PM
 
1,818 posts, read 2,737,812 times
Reputation: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
How true! Now, more than ever, I see elderly people working. Most are not working simply to alleviate boredom; they are working because they have to. To add insult to injury, many have lost their hard-earned money in 401(k)ís due to corporate corruption. It's breaks my heart to see some of these elderly people being forced to work, while our tax dollars are supporting illegal aliens. Our government has even reduced benefits for Medicare to accommodate illegals. It's a dirty shame!
The ones I have talked to say, they are working because their medicare is taken out of their social security, and they have to work.
You did post something good though, you pointed out that the elderly will work doing odd jobs, what about the rest of the Americans, that won't settle except for the most money for the least amount of work.
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Old 09-24-2008, 03:00 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,049,243 times
Reputation: 2878
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyone View Post
The ones I have talked to say, they are working because their medicare is taken out of their social security, and they have to work.
You did post something good though, you pointed out that the elderly will work doing odd jobs, what about the rest of the Americans, that won't settle except for the most money for the least amount of work.
Sassy, no american or legal immigrant in their right mind is going to agree to work in a packing house for example for $5 an hour as was the case at the Kosher plant recently raided in Iowa. Illegals will and by doing so they are undercutting american and legal immigrants wages, job opportunities, and standard of living. Not everyone is going to be a white collar worker, and not every american born blue collar worker is a lazy f***.

As far as the elderly go, they are working because money that should be going to them are now going to the millions of anchors that are purposefully being born for the american benefits that they bring. Add in the wic, food stamps, housing allowances given to the mothers of these anchors and that quickly adds up --- not to mention the added expense to the school system plus the strain and unpaid medical bills at hospitals (who then overcharge seniors).
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Old 09-24-2008, 03:04 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,834,008 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by sassyone View Post
The ones I have talked to say, they are working because their medicare is taken out of their social security, and they have to work.
You did post something good though, you pointed out that the elderly will work doing odd jobs, what about the rest of the Americans, that won't settle except for the most money for the least amount of work.
Now you are generalizing. There are plenty of hard-working legal citizens in this country. Are you begrudging them for expecting to be paid a sustainable wage? If illegals were able to live off of their meager earnings, they wouldn't be forced to live 15-20 per 2-bedroom apartment. Are you suggesting legal citizens should be satisfied with a similar lifestyle?

There are also many legal citizens, including myself, who have "earned" the right to not have to work like a dog. Your attitude is unfair and unfounded.
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