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Old 10-25-2008, 10:28 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,036,601 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
You tell stories?
Honestly, I didnt really get the moral of your story. Kids were misbehaving, parents were talking to grandparents in Spanish, kids spoke English, hello in chinese...I dont get it.

To tell you whether or not I think your imagining it, let me ask you, where do you live?
How about you answer this question then;

Are spanish speaking immigrants learning english at the same rate as other non english speaking immigrants and if so, why the special accomadations made to them and only to them? I am not talking about enclaves, nor am I talking about the dmv...I am talking about Home Depot. I am talking about self checkout lanes at grocery stores and other shops. I am talking about any voice menu that only has two options - english and spanish. Why the accomadation? Why don't chinese or russian or sudanese get the same accomadation? Especially since the spanish speakers don't need it anymore then the others do?

 
Old 10-25-2008, 10:44 PM
 
Location: Southern California
15,088 posts, read 16,938,924 times
Reputation: 10273
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
How about you answer this question then;

Are spanish speaking immigrants learning english at the same rate as other non english speaking immigrants and if so, why the special accomadations made to them and only to them? I am not talking about enclaves, nor am I talking about the dmv...I am talking about Home Depot. I am talking about self checkout lanes at grocery stores and other shops. I am talking about any voice menu that only has two options - english and spanish. Why the accomadation? Why don't chinese or russian or sudanese get the same accomadation? Especially since the spanish speakers don't need it anymore then the others do?
Basic numbers. There's a lot more customers who speak only Spanish than there, say, customers who speak only Chinese. If you were in the business to make money, which most businesses are in business to do, then you will make any and every reasonable accommodation for the customer. And if Home Depot doesn't do it, then Lowes will do it. A business could take a stand and say they are not going to allow any alternate languages in our stores, websites, advertising, instruction manuals, etc. But it is practically guaranteed that knowing one could increase profits by doing so (or reduce profits by not), whatever philosophical reservations that exist will evaporate.
 
Old 10-25-2008, 10:59 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,036,601 times
Reputation: 2873
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEETC View Post
Basic numbers. There's a lot more customers who speak only Spanish than there, say, customers who speak only Chinese. If you were in the business to make money, which most businesses are in business to do, then you will make any and every reasonable accommodation for the customer. And if Home Depot doesn't do it, then Lowes will do it. A business could take a stand and say they are not going to allow any alternate languages in our stores, websites, advertising, instruction manuals, etc. But it is practically guaranteed that knowing one could increase profits by doing so (or reduce profits by not), whatever philosophical reservations that exist will evaporate.
Of course the businesses are doing it to make money -- and no doubt make it easier for illegal day laborers to get supplies
But the point is....if amc is correct and spanish speaking immigrants (both legal and not) have an actual desire to speak english and learn english at the same rates that other non english speaking immigrants do --- then why only spanish everywhere, and not just home improvement stores? Why would there be a need to do this if they are learning english just as other non spanish speaking immigrant groups do?
 
Old 10-25-2008, 11:07 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,996,951 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMario View Post
I know both Spanish and English, but prefer to speak Spanish to Hispanics. We usually feel more bonded and cohesive speaking the language of our mother country. I am in no way trying to offend non-Spanish speakers, and I do not see this as a big deal. It is a free country, and we are allowed to speak other languages. Now, If I approach a white person then I would speak to them in English. If I have to do a presentation in school, I do it in English. But please do not tell me what languages I can and cannot speak during my spare time.
Exactly.

From the story, we know those two coworkers speak English at work, and were only talking in Spanish in a personal discussion between themselves. How controlling is that, to try and dictate how people talk in their own time.
 
Old 10-25-2008, 11:09 PM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,996,951 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
How about you answer this question then;

Are spanish speaking immigrants learning english at the same rate as other non english speaking immigrants and if so, why the special accomadations made to them and only to them? I am not talking about enclaves, nor am I talking about the dmv...I am talking about Home Depot. I am talking about self checkout lanes at grocery stores and other shops. I am talking about any voice menu that only has two options - english and spanish. Why the accomadation? Why don't chinese or russian or sudanese get the same accomadation? Especially since the spanish speakers don't need it anymore then the others do?
Because Spanish speakers don't stick in enclaves. Theyre all over the place.
And Spanish speakers didnt force businesses to offer a Spanish translation, the businesses chose to do it to gain the Latino market.
So whine to them. Though I doubt they'll listen because your annoyance is a small price to pay for all the Spanish speakers out there being consumers.

You only notice Latinos not speaking English because they are so much more widespread, larger in numbers, and dont stick to enclaves. You either haven't been, or choose not to acknowledge all the ethnic enclaves full of foreign language speakers.
 
Old 10-25-2008, 11:49 PM
 
Location: mass
2,905 posts, read 6,421,420 times
Reputation: 4967
Quote:
Originally Posted by elousv View Post
She may be a citizen, but not an American in my eyes.
I wish I could give negative rep points.
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
Really, people speaking their native language to one another doesn't bother me. I sincerely hope they keep more of their language then just the words for bodily functions and cuss like my family did! Is it rude....depends on the situation.
But what is beyond the pale, is the pandering government agencies and private corporations go to make it easier, hell better for a spanish speaking immigrant to not learn English. There is no reason that The Home Depot has all signs in English and Spanish. There is no reason why I should have to pick English or Spanish at the self checkout line at the grocery store. There is no reasons that want ads in the paper should be wriiten in Spanish only. None. And this is where I draw the line. Keep your culture alive on your own time, when functioning in public you must learn English the way the Sudanese do, the Koreans do, the Vietnamese do, the Russians do, and the Polish do. Because some cities out west have a 'Las' or a 'Los' in front of them does not make this a Spanish speaking country.
you have a point here. But as mikeetc states in the next quote, these are private companies trying to capture a market.

I have never heard a Spanish person complaining that the signs at the grocery store were in English, not Spanish. It's not Spanish people putting up these signs, it's non Spanish speakers who want to get the Spanish customers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MIKEETC View Post
Basic numbers. There's a lot more customers who speak only Spanish than there, say, customers who speak only Chinese. If you were in the business to make money, which most businesses are in business to do, then you will make any and every reasonable accommodation for the customer. And if Home Depot doesn't do it, then Lowes will do it. A business could take a stand and say they are not going to allow any alternate languages in our stores, websites, advertising, instruction manuals, etc. But it is practically guaranteed that knowing one could increase profits by doing so (or reduce profits by not), whatever philosophical reservations that exist will evaporate.
This is the real reason companies are doing it, not because people are demanding it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HillScoggin View Post
Why does every recording say "press 1 for english" when it should be "press 1 for spanish" I am speaking the language that around 98 percent of the nation speaks. I should not be the one having to press buttons to hear the language that is the language used by most of us
I agree, you shouldn't have to press anything for English. If you need a language other than English, press a number for that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gonzalosalcedo09 View Post
What bothered me is that she spoke Spanish to me the first time she saw me, while she spoke English to everyone else, just because I look Hispanic, and I don't even look all that Hispanic.
If it bothers you, continue to answer her in English. Or say to her, in Spanish, "I don't like to talk Spanish when there are other people around that don't understand it because I think it's incredibly rude" She may get the message and stop.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ibarrio View Post
Anyways, in big cities (NYC, LA) you hear all sorts of different languages. If you hear Russian, Arab, Chinese...etc...it is "culture" If you hear Spanish then it is illegals refusing to assimilate...
so true!
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
No, if you start seeing all signage in russian, arabic and/or chinese that is a sign of refusal to assimilate. If you start hearing radio stations that are only russian, arabaic, chinese that would be a sign of a refusal to assimilate.
There are plenty of places where the signs are in russian, arabic, and chinese. NOT English, and NOT Spanish. I have been in several areas where I felt like I left the US, and Spanish was not the language I was hearing!
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
You don't see stories of police departments/social services/hospitals/governmental agencies/schools needing to learn any of the above mentioned languages --- only spanish.
There are translators of many tongues at hospitals. And I bet plenty of police officers wish they spoke a second language at times.
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
Bottom line, when an immigrant group demands that the country to which they are immigrating to learn their native tongue, that is a refusal to assimiliate.
I have yet to meet a Spanish person demanding people learn to speak Spanish and not English.
The girl the OP mentioned may have just been being a smart a$$. I don't believe she was actually suggesting that the OP learn Spanish.

Here in America, when we are kids, we always ask each other "what nationality are you" and I have yet to meet a kid that says "American" because it is understood that we are asking what each other's ethnic background is. We are fascinated with it. Most kids know at an early age what their ethnic makeup is, even if it's like, 7 different nationalities!

When I was a kid, my cousins and I would play and pretend we were speaking French like our Memere (grandmother) She spoke French with her mother and sister, and none of her 8 kids speak French today. It is a shame. After her mother and sister died, I never heard her speak French again, until my father in law, who speaks 3 languages, spoke to her in French. She hadn't spoken French in years, and I was so proud of her as he asked her a question and she didn't miss a beat, she answered him right back.

It sometimes annoys me, seeing random signs in Spanish, or having to press "1" for English, but I believe that if people speak a second language, they should do everything in their power to make sure their kids learn it as well. My husband speaks a second language, and is not teaching it to our kids. After taking 7 years of French, 5 years of Spanish, and 1 year of Russian, and not being fluent in any of them, I am pretty pi$$ed about him not making the effort. And the kids will be to, when they realize the opportunity he screwed them out of.
 
Old 10-25-2008, 11:58 PM
 
Location: Canton
3 posts, read 4,198 times
Reputation: 11
Looking at the future, it would be wise to have your children learn to speak Spanish. In the near future we will be pursuing economies in Mexico, latin America, and South America. Where traditional Hispanic languages are spoken. If you kids will be working in these regions, and that is highly probable as the area opens up, they would benefit from being able to speak the language. Also, as business in these areas brings more people from these countries to America, speaking a second language would be a plus to your kids in finding a job. It's not a matter of patriotisim to only speak American English. Most colleges require some study in a second language. You child can get a scholorship if they can speak and learn another language.

The hispanic language is not the only language that will lend itself to helping your child in their career. Chinese, Russian, German, French, all the romance languages will assit anyone in the business world. It a global economy that is growing along the road to progress and stepping backward into time is not going to happen. Keep moving forward if you want to keep up, or there will be many people in other countries, speaking their language and English that will be avaliable to take your childrens career from them.
 
Old 10-26-2008, 12:04 AM
 
Location: southern california
55,237 posts, read 72,427,088 times
Reputation: 47455
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Exactly.

From the story, we know those two coworkers speak English at work, and were only talking in Spanish in a personal discussion between themselves. How controlling is that, to try and dictate how people talk in their own time.
personal conversations should take place in private or out of ear shot. a common complaint by many is to use language (not just spanish) to have a private conversation. not polite and usually not office policy. i speak spanish that is not the issue the issue is manners.
 
Old 10-26-2008, 12:15 AM
 
Location: California
3,172 posts, read 5,996,951 times
Reputation: 332
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckleberry3911948 View Post
personal conversations should take place in private or out of ear shot. a common complaint by many is to use language (not just spanish) to have a private conversation. not polite and usually not office policy. i speak spanish that is not the issue the issue is manners.
Whispered:
"Juanita, did you still want to talk about our husbands and kids?"
"Yeah"
"Meet me in the bathroom in 10 minutes"
"Roger that"


Yeah, okay, whisperings considered rude too. This is hardly and immigration issue or even an assimilation issue. The people already speak English, and choose to speak Spanish to each other, in a non-work related way. So what?
I think its dumb trying to make this an immigration issue.
 
Old 10-26-2008, 12:34 AM
 
Location: Southern California
15,088 posts, read 16,938,924 times
Reputation: 10273
Quote:
Originally Posted by amc760 View Post
Whispered:
"Juanita, did you still want to talk about our husbands and kids?"
"Yeah"
"Meet me in the bathroom in 10 minutes"
"Roger that"


Yeah, okay, whisperings considered rude too. This is hardly and immigration issue or even an assimilation issue. The people already speak English, and choose to speak Spanish to each other, in a non-work related way. So what?
I think its dumb trying to make this an immigration issue.
HA!!HA!! Now that is funny...

There is a guy at work who speaks in Spanish when he is on the phone with his Mom - fair enough, I figure. He also does it when he's speaking to a chica he's trying to hook up with - a guy's gotta do what a guy's gotta do....

Now if he were plotting to blow us up...
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