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Old 11-18-2008, 08:19 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,881,481 times
Reputation: 6517

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
Did he say he was the daughter when he used her name/social security number?

Could I not put my child's name on the title/deed of my home? Is that illegal? What if I wanted my child to be a joint owner or the sole owner of the property? My children have bank accounts, and I used their names and social security numbers to get them, and they didn't sign a thing. Have I broken the law?

I find it odd that he was able to do this if it was illegal. I have bought a home, and it seems that if the bank is loaning you money, all i's are dotted and t's crossed. I cannot see how he could get away with illegal crap when banks/loans/lawyers are involved.

This woman is clearly vindictive. Apparently once she found out they were illegal, she decided to go for broke. Now she is bitching that she is back with her mother. What, paying rent broke her? She just has a scapegoat to blame for her troubles, and a legitimate reason to retaliate.


And no to all of you, the house should be sold and any profits should go to the child whose name is on the paperwork. That child is an American, if she was in fact born here, so why should she lose out on something that would be hers if her parents died?

That child, if born here, my friends, is just as American as YOU or I., no matter what the status of her parents.
1. a child or minor can not enter into a legal contract such as joint ownership of a home. Now as in child stars the parents are acting custodians of their assets. The father used the child to buy a home when he himself could not. He is an illegal. Chances or odds are that he did not pay taxes or atleast all the taxes on his income. That must be addressed as it would be with any tax evader.
2. I firmly believe that it is more than reasonable to expect a criminal to pay the legal fees involved with prosecuting them for their crimes.
3. As an illegal he should have no issue being exposed. Why? He knew the risks when he entered illegally. He is caught let him like all criminals bare the shame of their crimes.
4. The child is the victim in this story. Her parents are criminals. That is the real shame and sadness to the story.
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Old 11-18-2008, 09:08 PM
 
2,516 posts, read 7,548,358 times
Reputation: 2394
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
Did he say he was the daughter when he used her name/social security number?

Could I not put my child's name on the title/deed of my home? Is that illegal? What if I wanted my child to be a joint owner or the sole owner of the property? My children have bank accounts, and I used their names and social security numbers to get them, and they didn't sign a thing. Have I broken the law?

I find it odd that he was able to do this if it was illegal. I have bought a home, and it seems that if the bank is loaning you money, all i's are dotted and t's crossed. I cannot see how he could get away with illegal crap when banks/loans/lawyers are involved.

This woman is clearly vindictive. Apparently once she found out they were illegal, she decided to go for broke. Now she is bitching that she is back with her mother. What, paying rent broke her? She just has a scapegoat to blame for her troubles, and a legitimate reason to retaliate.


And no to all of you, the house should be sold and any profits should go to the child whose name is on the paperwork. That child is an American, if she was in fact born here, so why should she lose out on something that would be hers if her parents died?

That child, if born here, my friends, is just as American as YOU or I., no matter what the status of her parents.
no, you probably didn't break any law unless you opened the accounts in your children's names to hide your own assets. bank accounts are personal property. real property is governed by a different body of law.

when you "put your child's name" on a deed, that is a legal conveyance. it is a contract to transfer ownership of real estate, and minors lack the legal capacity to enter into contracts; thus, they cannot own real estate in their own names. (that's what trusts are for.) furthermore, the house in this case was subject to a mortgage, which is also a contract. the lender now holds a note collateralized by property supposedly "owned" by a two-year-old, but signed by an adult whose name was not on the deed. see the problem?

what he did was illegal, twice over, and that is without reaching the issue of the attempted sale to ms. griffin.

btw, what's wrong with being vindictive toward someone who was willing to engage her in a fraudulent real estate conveyance without her knowledge? you do realize that if his illegal purchase of the house were to be challenged by the seller or the lender, then the validity of her purchase from him could also be called into question. even if she ultimately prevailed in court, it would come at great expense of money, time, and peace of mind while in litigation. this kind of thing can happen to anyone, and i don't fault her in the least for exposing him for the criminal that he is. in fact, i applaud her.

Last edited by katenik; 11-18-2008 at 09:47 PM..
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Old 11-19-2008, 02:14 AM
 
956 posts, read 2,646,247 times
Reputation: 576
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
That child, if born here, my friends, is just as American as YOU or I., no matter what the status of her parents.
So, if I'm born on Mars, does that make me a Martian?
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Old 11-19-2008, 12:55 PM
 
Location: mass
2,905 posts, read 6,418,148 times
Reputation: 4967
Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
But don't forget -- the child is also just as much Mexican as her parents. She is also a citizen of their country and can go home with her parents. It's just like when Americans give birth in other countries, their kids are still American even if the other country gives birth citizenship.

Nothing prevents the parents from taking their child home with them when they go.
Sure they can take her back, but the fact of the matter is that once born here, you are a US citizen, and even if your parents are criminals and you are sent back with them, once you are 18 you can come right on back, and then apply for green cards for your immediate family.

Quote:
Originally Posted by katenik View Post
no, you probably didn't break any law unless you opened the accounts in your children's names to hide your own assets. bank accounts are personal property. real property is governed by a different body of law.

when you "put your child's name" on a deed, that is a legal conveyance. it is a contract to transfer ownership of real estate, and minors lack the legal capacity to enter into contracts; thus, they cannot own real estate in their own names. (that's what trusts are for.) furthermore, the house in this case was subject to a mortgage, which is also a contract. the lender now holds a note collateralized by property supposedly "owned" by a two-year-old, but signed by an adult whose name was not on the deed. see the problem?

what he did was illegal, twice over, and that is without reaching the issue of the attempted sale to ms. griffin.

btw, what's wrong with being vindictive toward someone who was willing to engage her in a fraudulent real estate conveyance without her knowledge? you do realize that if his illegal purchase of the house were to be challenged by the seller or the lender, then the validity of her purchase from him could also be called into question. even if she ultimately prevailed in court, it would come at great expense of money, time, and peace of mind while in litigation. this kind of thing can happen to anyone, and i don't fault her in the least for exposing him for the criminal that he is. in fact, i applaud her.
I just would like to know how he got away with it. It seems like there would be another guilty party, for one the original real estate agent, if they knew he was committing a crime.

Thinking back to my home purchase, I can't see one step of the way where I could have gotten away with using my child's name and social security number.

Other heads should be rolling on this one, in addition to the father who used his daughter's identity information.

Vindictiveness is an ugly trait, esp. when the person getting revenge may be breaking the law herself. I wonder when she started putting the signs on the law, while she was still a tenant or after she moved. If it was after she moved, I would consider that trespassing and maybe even harassment. Sure she has cause, but being vindictive and vicious is not an admirable quality, in my book.

Considering she now lives with her mother and cannot afford to live elsewhere, she may look at the bright side and be thankful that she didn't buy the house, she may well have lost it if she got it in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Full-Blooded American View Post
So, if I'm born on Mars, does that make me a Martian?
Only if they offer you citizenship!!!
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Old 11-19-2008, 01:00 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
Sure they can take her back, but the fact of the matter is that once born here, you are a US citizen, and even if your parents are criminals and you are sent back with them, once you are 18 you can come right on back, and then apply for green cards for your immediate family.



I just would like to know how he got away with it. It seems like there would be another guilty party, for one the original real estate agent, if they knew he was committing a crime.

Thinking back to my home purchase, I can't see one step of the way where I could have gotten away with using my child's name and social security number.

Other heads should be rolling on this one, in addition to the father who used his daughter's identity information.

Vindictiveness is an ugly trait, esp. when the person getting revenge may be breaking the law herself. I wonder when she started putting the signs on the law, while she was still a tenant or after she moved. If it was after she moved, I would consider that trespassing and maybe even harassment. Sure she has cause, but being vindictive and vicious is not an admirable quality, in my book.

Considering she now lives with her mother and cannot afford to live elsewhere, she may look at the bright side and be thankful that she didn't buy the house, she may well have lost it if she got it in the first place.



Only if they offer you citizenship!!!
That angers me as well..........the enabler(s) on the portion of your of post that I bolded need to be punished as well.
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Old 11-19-2008, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Phoenix, AZ
11,456 posts, read 8,133,032 times
Reputation: 5674
Quote:
Could I not put my child's name on the title/deed of my home? Is that illegal?
Yes---Children are not allowed to enter into a contract without parent co-signature. It was designed that way so people could not exploit kids.
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Old 11-19-2008, 04:58 PM
 
2,516 posts, read 7,548,358 times
Reputation: 2394
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommytotwo View Post
Sure they can take her back, but the fact of the matter is that once born here, you are a US citizen, and even if your parents are criminals and you are sent back with them, once you are 18 you can come right on back, and then apply for green cards for your immediate family.



I just would like to know how he got away with it. It seems like there would be another guilty party, for one the original real estate agent, if they knew he was committing a crime.

Thinking back to my home purchase, I can't see one step of the way where I could have gotten away with using my child's name and social security number.

Other heads should be rolling on this one, in addition to the father who used his daughter's identity information.

Vindictiveness is an ugly trait, esp. when the person getting revenge may be breaking the law herself. I wonder when she started putting the signs on the law, while she was still a tenant or after she moved. If it was after she moved, I would consider that trespassing and maybe even harassment. Sure she has cause, but being vindictive and vicious is not an admirable quality, in my book.

Considering she now lives with her mother and cannot afford to live elsewhere, she may look at the bright side and be thankful that she didn't buy the house, she may well have lost it if she got it in the first place.



Only if they offer you citizenship!!!
he 'got away' with it because his realtor was complicit in the fraud, as was the mortgage broker, no doubt. these cogs in the wheel don't care, because they collect their commissions upon closing, and aren't left holding a potentially worthless promissory note.
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Old 11-19-2008, 10:55 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,200,288 times
Reputation: 4611
Giffen started out as the victim, at the end a detailed sob story was given about the illegal.
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