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View Poll Results: Do you think illegals come to the USA, for slave wages that they are paid?
Yes 9 50.00%
No 9 50.00%
Voters: 18. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-13-2008, 03:52 PM
 
Location: John From Scranton
858 posts, read 1,666,042 times
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Default Why do illegals come to the USA? Is it for slave wages that they are paid?

What I said is factually true. The other point to be made is that with the slave wages also come the human rights abuses, like what was seen in the recent raids where women were worked all hours. I really believe once a person starts doing illegal deeds nothing stops them from continuing. Is THIS the kind of America that YOU want?

I can understand people wanting to better their lives, but do it legally, that is the only option, there is not other way around the law, the law is in place for a reason, and the laws need to be enforced plain and simple and all the "illegals", need, I mean "HAVE" to be rounded up and sent back to their country!!
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Old 12-13-2008, 04:36 PM
 
47,586 posts, read 33,792,412 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John From Scranton View Post
What I said is factually true. The other point to be made is that with the slave wages also come the human rights abuses, like what was seen in the recent raids where women were worked all hours. I really believe once a person starts doing illegal deeds nothing stops them from continuing. Is THIS the kind of America that YOU want?

I can understand people wanting to better their lives, but do it legally, that is the only option, there is not other way around the law, the law is in place for a reason, and the laws need to be enforced plain and simple and all the "illegals", need, I mean "HAVE" to be rounded up and sent back to their country!!
Yes, the USA takes in by far more legal immigrants than any other nation in the world, so those who come illegally feel they should get around our laws on legal immigration -- for whatever reason it is they are doing so.

Maybe they believe they because of their ethnicity should not be required to wait in line with others. Or they have criminal pasts and cannot pass a background check.

Often they believe they should be able to come and stay long enough and then demand "their rights" which is to be handed USA citizenship simply for having broken our laws.

On the other end though, any one who employs illegals should be punished to the full extent of the law. They too believe they are "entitled" to ignore the labor and wage laws. They are entitled to dirt cheap servants and save money by not paying into social security or workman's comp for their cheap workers. And very often they pay no overtime, no minimum wages.
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Old 12-13-2008, 04:50 PM
 
Location: John From Scranton
858 posts, read 1,666,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by malamute View Post
On the other end though, any one who employs illegals should be punished to the full extent of the law. They too believe they are "entitled" to ignore the labor and wage laws. They are entitled to dirt cheap servants and save money by not paying into social security or workman's comp for their cheap workers. And very often they pay no overtime, no minimum wages.
You are 100% right! I have a landscaping biz, and I'll tell you what..... It makes me sick in the summer time.. SICK!! I been trying to build up my biz, for the last 2 years. And I drive from job to job and see nothing but illegals working for a larger comp, doing the work for 5 bucks an hour under the table. I have to pay my guys a min, of 12, an hour or forget it I wont have any worker's. What a joke!
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:06 PM
 
Location: Pa
19,817 posts, read 10,774,995 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John From Scranton View Post
You are 100% right! I have a landscaping biz, and I'll tell you what..... It makes me sick in the summer time.. SICK!! I been trying to build up my biz, for the last 2 years. And I drive from job to job and see nothing but illegals working for a larger comp, doing the work for 5 bucks an hour under the table. I have to pay my guys a min, of 12, an hour or forget it I wont have any worker's. What a joke!
I have a friend in swoyersville faces the same problem...
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:38 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 9,436,794 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John From Scranton View Post
You are 100% right! I have a landscaping biz, and I'll tell you what..... It makes me sick in the summer time.. SICK!! I been trying to build up my biz, for the last 2 years. And I drive from job to job and see nothing but illegals working for a larger comp, doing the work for 5 bucks an hour under the table. I have to pay my guys a min, of 12, an hour or forget it I wont have any worker's. What a joke!
I've talked to alot on people with Landscaping Services in SoCal who are having the same trouble. I had a "Small Engine Repair Shop". I repair Landscaping equipment.
Hang in there, don't give up, something has to give soon.
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Old 12-13-2008, 07:51 PM
 
Location: John From Scranton
858 posts, read 1,666,042 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkfarnam View Post
I've talked to alot on people with Landscaping Services in SoCal who are having the same trouble. I had a "Small Engine Repair Shop". I repair Landscaping equipment.
Hang in there, don't give up, something has to give soon.
It is very hard to say the least.. Times are hard as it is. Right now its winter time here so the money I made over the summer has to carry me over. I been seeing more and more different trades falling in the same boat as us. And to top it off if they get hurt when their working. We have to pay with our tax money for them to see a Doc, and get fixed up!
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Old 12-13-2008, 08:25 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,157 posts, read 25,723,002 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John From Scranton View Post
It is very hard to say the least.. Times are hard as it is. Right now its winter time here so the money I made over the summer has to carry me over. I been seeing more and more different trades falling in the same boat as us. And to top it off if they get hurt when their working. We have to pay with our tax money for them to see a Doc, and get fixed up!
Tell me about it!

I am an auto alignment tech by trade who is paid flat rate (piece work)---------and, I am down an honest 30% average in hours since January.
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Old 12-13-2008, 09:05 PM
 
8,972 posts, read 10,339,415 times
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Originally Posted by malamute View Post
Yes, the USA takes in by far more legal immigrants than any other nation in the world, so those who come illegally feel they should get around our laws on legal immigration -- for whatever reason it is they are doing so.

Maybe they believe they because of their ethnicity should not be required to wait in line with others. Or they have criminal pasts and cannot pass a background check.

Often they believe they should be able to come and stay long enough and then demand "their rights" which is to be handed USA citizenship simply for having broken our laws.
Once again, I see a very real connection here to 'culture'..(and as they say, 'culture is everything').

The USA is a "First World" culture..it's an artificial construct, based on laws, and one ALL of us (as the products of immigration) have had to LEARN...and what that means is 'The Law" is 'sacred'...it's what makes our society work, it enables us to overelook our 'diversity' and work within the system. Our laws, being more-or-less "fair", and being written by "us", also have a MORAL dimension. In American culture, breaking the law is WRONG...and it's immoral...and lawbreakers are stigmatized. In a First World culture, we're forced to learn to "trust strangers" (since our society is MADE UP of them).

In Third-World cultures, the laws aren't written "by the people"..they're imposed on them from above. In those societies, one doesn't obey the law because it's "right"..he obeys only to evade punishment. The law there has no 'moral dimension', and laws may be broken without 'guilt'. Since the system has no moral dimension, breaking the law there isn't seen as "wrong"..it's just not always smart. In the Third World, you don't "trust strangers"...you trust family and friends. Everyone else (including 'the cops') is a potential enemy.

Bring a large group of "third-worlders" into the US.....give them NO training in our laws, or in the the 'theory' of why we HAVE our laws, or the "fairness" behind them, and these new folks never learn our system...so they simply continue on as they did before, 'back home'...where society is inherently unfair, where the rich abuse the poor, where "nobody helps you, so you'd better help yourself", and where 'the law' is basically regarded as a cynical joke, because it's stacked against the 'common man'.

If you're a new legal immigrant, assimilation can be a long, difficult progress. If you're not only NEW, but ILLEGAL, then instead of assimilating, you're going to try to stay 'under the radar', and assimilation will be virtually impossible. Illegal immigration has a very steep price.....and a large mass of resentful, angry, unassimilated 'outsiders' is one of the prices we pay.

Last edited by macmeal; 12-13-2008 at 09:18 PM..
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Old 12-14-2008, 01:00 PM
 
94 posts, read 77,931 times
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Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
If you're a new legal immigrant, assimilation can be a long, difficult progress. If you're not only NEW, but ILLEGAL, then instead of assimilating, you're going to try to stay 'under the radar', and assimilation will be virtually impossible. Illegal immigration has a very steep price.....and a large mass of resentful, angry, unassimilated 'outsiders' is one of the prices we pay.
It doesn't matter if you're legal or illegal. With the massive amount of immigrants we're taking in from Latin America, neither group has to assimilate because there are so many areas of this country where you don't even need to learn English to survive.

I still can't figure out why allowing in so many immigrants who are rapidly outbreeding us and changing our way of life, as while as having a detrimental affect on our crime rates and social services, is cheered on & why nothing has been done to stop it.
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Old 12-14-2008, 01:12 PM
 
Location: San Diego
17,177 posts, read 13,106,460 times
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Originally Posted by thegeist View Post
It doesn't matter if you're legal or illegal. With the massive amount of immigrants we're taking in from Latin America, neither group has to assimilate because there are so many areas of this country where you don't even need to learn English to survive.

I still can't figure out why allowing in so many immigrants who are rapidly outbreeding us and changing our way of life, as while as having a detrimental affect on our crime rates and social services, is cheered on & why nothing has been done to stop it.

Because the people benefitting from illegal labor don't care. Everyone else that is affected by them does.
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