U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Illegal Immigration
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 01-23-2009, 10:14 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,041,525 times
Reputation: 2873

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
Its not about being "fair". Very little is "fair" in politics.
I repeat, its not about being fair, and rewarding people you feel are less deserving than a group of people across the planet, its about controlling our illegal problem.
Weere not going to deport them all.
I interpret it as giving the illegal Mexicans, Guatemalans, Chinese, Indians, Russians, Koreans, etc a chance to pay a fee and start an immigration process(which is what? 5-10 years? Is that really "circumventing" the process?). Not pay a fine, and get sent back to their countries. Maybe I'm wrong.
How did you interpret it?
I interpret it the same way as you do, but I disagree that it is a good solution to the illegal immigration problem. To the illegals that are told to pay a fine but they can live and work here legally until their paperwork comes through in about 5+ years is not in any way a deterrent to future illegal immigration. Nor is pumping up 'our neighbors' economies when ours is failing so drastically.
If we were talking about several hundred thousands of illegals in the US I might be inclined to agree with you. But we are not. We are talking millions -- how much noone really knows, but the consensus seems to be around 12-20 million. Plus with the thought of amnesty in the works it is a safe bet that there are even more people coming over the border in order to get in on that deal. That is one hell of a lot of people, most of whom have not much to offer us in terms of their eduction or skills. We already have too many people who are classified as the working poor -- do we really need to bring in more? Can we (the US government) support them? How about our infrastructure?
I don't blame the illegal -- I have said it before that they are no doubt very nice people individually. I do blame the politicians who place personal power and gain over the good of the people they are sworn to represent. I do blame the business owner who has sold out their neighbors for more profit.
Having said all that, you must agree that the illegal immigrants do themselves no favors by 'demanding' anything. It comes off as entitled and arrogant.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 01-23-2009, 10:25 PM
 
Location: Sugar Land, TX, USA
759 posts, read 2,839,754 times
Reputation: 232
Having residency is just as good as being a citizen to an illegal. They will flood the country once this BS is passed. they did not want to follow the process that people from everywhere else in the world that wants to come to America went through...so they break the law and now want to be given preference. WTF is this country coming to just take a look at Europe and the influx of moslum immigrants and what that has done to france, Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, the UK. all these countries are broke both financially and socially...in the next 20 years Civil War will break out in Europe. Will be be next?

Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
[i][b][i][b]
Back of the line for citizenship, not residency.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-23-2009, 10:54 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles, CA
1,636 posts, read 2,900,558 times
Reputation: 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by camping! View Post
I interpret it the same way as you do, but I disagree that it is a good solution to the illegal immigration problem. To the illegals that are told to pay a fine but they can live and work here legally until their paperwork comes through in about 5+ years is not in any way a deterrent to future illegal immigration. Nor is pumping up 'our neighbors' economies when ours is failing so drastically.
If we were talking about several hundred thousands of illegals in the US I might be inclined to agree with you. But we are not. We are talking millions -- how much noone really knows, but the consensus seems to be around 12-20 million. Plus with the thought of amnesty in the works it is a safe bet that there are even more people coming over the border in order to get in on that deal. That is one hell of a lot of people, most of whom have not much to offer us in terms of their eduction or skills. We already have too many people who are classified as the working poor -- do we really need to bring in more? Can we (the US government) support them? How about our infrastructure?
I don't blame the illegal -- I have said it before that they are no doubt very nice people individually. I do blame the politicians who place personal power and gain over the good of the people they are sworn to represent. I do blame the business owner who has sold out their neighbors for more profit.
Having said all that, you must agree that the illegal immigrants do themselves no favors by 'demanding' anything. It comes off as entitled and arrogant.
"Demanding" is word used by anti-illegals.
I could just as easily say they are "demonstrating". Or "Lobbying". "Peacefully marching".
You know what's more arrogant, and comes off more as entitled? Riots by immigrants in Europe.(cue Arizonabear coming in to say "they know better than to riot in America" menacingly).
They are using the American example of peaceful assembly to influence the government.


But yeah, anti-illegal/immigrants like to paint a different picture. Taking pictures of a few Mexican flags, dwelling for years on a couple of incidents, taking pictures of rebellious teens being rebellious, making up stories, showing the same 5 pictures over and over and over.

It doesn't bother me that they march. It's good to see peaceful marches. Reminds me of how free this country is, and how civilized we are.

If some anti-illegals/immigrants had their way, and these peaceful marches were broken up by police in riot gear, and ICE agents arresting brown people randomly on suspicion of being here illegally, causing bedlam, then that wouldn't be very American.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-23-2009, 11:02 PM
 
8,180 posts, read 11,041,525 times
Reputation: 2873
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
"Demanding" is word used by anti-illegals.
I could just as easily say they are "demonstrating". Or "Lobbying". "Peacefully marching".
You know what's more arrogant, and comes off more as entitled? Riots by immigrants in Europe.(cue Arizonabear coming in to say "they know better than to riot in America" menacingly).
They are using the American example of peaceful assembly to influence the government.


But yeah, anti-illegal/immigrants like to paint a different picture. Taking pictures of a few Mexican flags, dwelling for years on a couple of incidents, taking pictures of rebellious teens being rebellious, making up stories, showing the same 5 pictures over and over and over.

It doesn't bother me than they march. It's good to see peaceful marches. Reminds me of how free this country is, and how civilized we are.

If some anti-illegals/immigrants had their way, and these peaceful marches were broken up by police in riot gear, and ICE agents arresting brown people randomly on suspicion of being here illegally, causing bedlam, then that wouldn't be very American.
Oh, I think it is far more then a few who are demanding. And chanting 'yes we can' in Spanish is hardly the anti illegals making a mountain out of a molehill. It reminds me of a rebellious teenager saying that they didn't ask to be born, and now the parent has to take care of them.....well, in the case of illegals no we don't.
Still, didn't answer the gist of my post which was when is enough enough? How many thousands of people are coming through the border every day hoping to make it in time for the amnesty party? How many more people are dying every day waiting for their visa to come through?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-23-2009, 11:03 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,714,475 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
"Demanding" is word used by anti-illegals.
I could just as easily say they are "demonstrating". Or "Lobbying". "Peacefully marching".
You know what's more arrogant, and comes off more as entitled? Riots by immigrants in Europe.(cue Arizonabear coming in to say "they know better than to riot in America" menacingly).
They are using the American example of peaceful assembly to influence the government.


But yeah, anti-illegal/immigrants like to paint a different picture. Taking pictures of a few Mexican flags, dwelling for years on a couple of incidents, taking pictures of rebellious teens being rebellious, making up stories, showing the same 5 pictures over and over and over.

It doesn't bother me that they march. It's good to see peaceful marches. Reminds me of how free this country is, and how civilized we are.

If some anti-illegals/immigrants had their way, and these peaceful marches were broken up by police in riot gear, and ICE agents arresting brown people randomly on suspicion of being here illegally, causing bedlam, then that wouldn't be very American.

Heavens no. Handcuff the illegals to each other and march them back across the border. Let them peacefully march in their own countries for what they want.

Last edited by andreabeth; 01-23-2009 at 11:17 PM..
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-23-2009, 11:19 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,714,475 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
Sounds good to me.
Isn't the second item what is meant by "Immigration Reform"?
It doesn't say anthing about mass deprtations. It says giving those in good standing a chance to redeem themselves. I'm wondering if that means granting legal residency while they go through a hopefully improved and expedited process.
I like every one of these points, and it's not nearsighted either. Helping our neighbor in it's already improving economic development is a good long term goal to keep to slow illegal immigration from there.

I don't understand how this makes Obama a Republican.
It would seem to me that if you are in the US illegally, you are automatically NOT 'in good standing'. Unless you have a very loose definition of 'good standing'.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-23-2009, 11:51 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
"Demanding" is word used by anti-illegals.
I could just as easily say they are "demonstrating". Or "Lobbying". "Peacefully marching".

You know what's more arrogant, and comes off more as entitled? Riots by immigrants in Europe.(cue Arizonabear coming in to say "they know better than to riot in America" menacingly).
They are using the American example of peaceful assembly to influence the government.


But yeah, anti-illegal/immigrants like to paint a different picture. Taking pictures of a few Mexican flags, dwelling for years on a couple of incidents, taking pictures of rebellious teens being rebellious, making up stories, showing the same 5 pictures over and over and over.

It doesn't bother me that they march. It's good to see peaceful marches. Reminds me of how free this country is, and how civilized we are.


If some anti-illegals/immigrants had their way, and these peaceful marches were broken up by police in riot gear, and ICE agents arresting brown people randomly on suspicion of being here illegally, causing bedlam, then that wouldn't be very American.
There is a HUGE difference between U.S. citizens marching (peacefully or otherwise), and illegal aliens protesting our government for anything. US citizens have a “right” to petition our government; illegal aliens don’t. Likewise, my son has a right to expect lunch money from me; the neighborhood kids don’t.

Apparently you can’t differentiate between legal residents of this country, and foreign interlopers. And yes, it is the height of arrogance.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 07:18 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,646,709 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
"Demanding" is word used by anti-illegals.
I could just as easily say they are "demonstrating". Or "Lobbying". "Peacefully marching".
You know what's more arrogant, and comes off more as entitled? Riots by immigrants in Europe.(cue Arizonabear coming in to say "they know better than to riot in America" menacingly).
They are using the American example of peaceful assembly to influence the government.


But yeah, anti-illegal/immigrants like to paint a different picture. Taking pictures of a few Mexican flags, dwelling for years on a couple of incidents, taking pictures of rebellious teens being rebellious, making up stories, showing the same 5 pictures over and over and over.

It doesn't bother me that they march. It's good to see peaceful marches. Reminds me of how free this country is, and how civilized we are.

If some anti-illegals/immigrants had their way, and these peaceful marches were broken up by police in riot gear, and ICE agents arresting brown people randomly on suspicion of being here illegally, causing bedlam, then that wouldn't be very American.
Tough!

I do not like the idea of profiling either: that stated; if carried out diplomatically...........I am OK with it. Besides, many illegal aliens including Mexicans are indeed 'White' so all people at those putative 'illegal immigrants' rights' marches need to be asked about their status here in the USA.

We are starting to discuss core survival of the USA now-----------the hell with what Mexico/Central America (our biggest sources of illegals) think.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 09:30 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,824,744 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
It would seem to me that if you are in the US illegally, you are automatically NOT 'in good standing'. Unless you have a very loose definition of 'good standing'.
Absolutely! Their mere presence violates our laws; not to mention, the other crimes they commit in their quest for a better life. It reminds me of a burglar being caught inside a house, and being released, because he hadn’t actually left the house with the goods. The fact that he broke into the house, in and of itself, is a crime.

IMO, there is no difference between Obama’s immigration agenda, and the shamnesty Bush tried unsuccessfully to pass. I wonder if Obama’s proposal will also allow gang members to simply ‘renounce’ their gangs to qualify for a path to citizenship. What a joke.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 01-24-2009, 09:38 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,646,709 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Absolutely! Their mere presence violates our laws; not to mention, the other crimes they commit in their quest for a better life. It reminds me of a burglar being caught inside a house, and being released, because he hadn’t actually left the house with the goods. The fact that he broke into the house, in and of itself, is a crime.

IMO, there is no difference between Obama’s immigration agenda, and the shamnesty Bush tried unsuccessfully to pass. I wonder if Obama’s proposal will also allow gang members to simply ‘renounce’ their gangs to qualify for a path to citizenship. What a joke.
And I repeat: watch the economy-------------if it tanks much further, there will be hell to pay for those still here illegally.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies > Illegal Immigration
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2018, Advameg, Inc.

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top