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Old 03-11-2009, 02:39 PM
 
Location: CITY OF ANGELS AND CONSTANT DANGER
5,409 posts, read 11,106,575 times
Reputation: 2244

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yes of coruse. i was waiting for that "degree" thing. yes profiling is not rape. but it is damaging. and rape is not murder. would i rather be raped or murdered? howabout neither. my point is that i am not the problem. and thanks for the suggestions of reflection and introspection, but i been doing that for years. stuff like this forces you to think about these issues and not only how they pertain to the self.

the police, they have all the power. i know this. they say jump i ask how high. i need to survive here. ive learned not to intervene in certain situations also. i have seen police brutality up close. it was unwarranted. i spoke up and was almost arrested for obstruction. at this point i know better.
they have the power. there aint nothing we could do about that.

i dont mean to vilify all cops. i know cops. my family is cops. my special friends have been cops. there are good ones. but some of the practices they engage in are not very fair or just, and i do question how much safer they a make our communities. but i do understand how jaded they get. one of my cousins hates black people now after having worked 77th in south central. he gives NO ONE the benefit of the doubt anymore. as a cop in LA you see the worst, thus you expect the worst.

me, i have no record, aside from minor traffic citations. but because of where i live im subject to this form of harrassment.
my part of the city is under siege by the thugs, and the thugs with badges.

this is LA. its a police state in many ways.

in the end, it takes its toll. im not preffering one or the other (rape v. constant detentions). i wish i didnt have to deal with any of these inconveniences. but i see the effects it has all around.

it has scared my kids. i remind them that the cops are our friends. once they are older i will have to explain that NOT ALL the cops are our friends.

this isnt just about me. its also about my family. urban living makes you smarter in a certain way, but it also taxes your psyche and that of your family. its the life i live.

but i still LOVE LA. just not the thugs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
I realize it happens. I can't say I'd 'like it', obviously. But it happens for a reason, and there are many people to 'blame' for it, if you're trying to assign blame.

I wrote a long piece on here months ago. My wife (Indian) was assigned to attend traffic school. The instructor was a 'hard boiled' looking white guy who, it became evident, was a cop. Also present in the class was a rather 'surly-looking' young Hispanic guy.

After the lunch break, each person was asked to comment on their 'ticket'. There was a VERY interesting discussion between the 'surly' guy (who admitted he'd done jail time, twice...HAD been a gang member..and HAD once lived in a gang area)....and the "cop" (who admitted they DID profile people, and who told the young guy that he FIT the profile in many ways).

Turns out that the guy had moved on with his life, but got "profiled" on visits back to the old neighborhood. The cop admitted it...they DO profile guys fitting his description, in THAT neighborhood. The young guy admitted he WASN'T profiled in his 'new' neighborhood.

VERY frank discussion, which my wife found VERY interesting (having been 'profiled' herself a number of times)....and I don't know what you could say about all this...but she DID say the young guy seemed less 'grumpy' after the discussion, as if the 'chip' was off his shoulder.

Profiling CAN'T be totally 'fair'...but it does happen, for a wide variety of reasons. I can't disagree with you that it's demeaning and annoying.

I can only conclude by advising you to consider 'degree'. Being raped, being mugged, and being 'pulled over' MAY be three different things that happen to people, MOSTLY through no fault of their own. But be honest..there IS a slight difference in the severity of these things..don't you agree? I'm sure I'd rather be profiled twice a month, than raped or beaten or mugged once a YEAR.
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Old 03-11-2009, 02:54 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,655,184 times
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Can't argue with you, "the one". I've had a few cops in my life, and at least a COUPLE of them I'd have to call 'scary' people. One actually sat at my dining room table (had responded to our complaint about being ripped off at a bank ATM), and there was a PALPABLE feeling that he DISLIKED me, DISLIKED my wife, HATED being there, and would have been HAPPY to beat me to a pulp, if he'd had an excuse. It was a demeaning, scary situation..(he was about 6'5", which didn't help).

I'm afraid that's just the way life is, and I'm sure LA is light-years worse. "Andy Griffith and Barney" just wouldn't make it in the LAPD, I think it's safe to say. WHY, exactly? Many MANY reasons.......
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Old 03-11-2009, 03:14 PM
 
Location: CITY OF ANGELS AND CONSTANT DANGER
5,409 posts, read 11,106,575 times
Reputation: 2244
yes many reasons.

its a stressful job.

sometimes i see why things happen. other times im left shaking my head.

in the meantime im just trying to protect myself and the kids.

even tho i feel like a liar, i still tell them the cops are the good guys. hopefully by the time they are able to drive they wont go thru the same things (might have better chances at winning the lotto).

i worry about my kids. there is a correlation between profiling and age. younger cats get it more.

i guess what irks me the most is that i thought i was past all this stuff. im a grown man. heading to mid life. i thought having survived the neighbor'hood i didnt have to be looking over my shoulder anymore.

im glad at the changes occuring in my area, but some stuff never changes.

such is life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
Can't argue with you, "the one". I've had a few cops in my life, and at least a COUPLE of them I'd have to call 'scary' people. One actually sat at my dining room table (had responded to our complaint about being ripped off at a bank ATM), and there was a PALPABLE feeling that he DISLIKED me, DISLIKED my wife, HATED being there, and would have been HAPPY to beat me to a pulp, if he'd had an excuse. It was a demeaning, scary situation..(he was about 6'5", which didn't help).

I'm afraid that's just the way life is, and I'm sure LA is light-years worse. "Andy Griffith and Barney" just wouldn't make it in the LAPD, I think it's safe to say. WHY, exactly? Many MANY reasons.......
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:24 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,864,905 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by the one View Post
mac, i am not fixated on the color of my skin. it just becomes apparent when certain incidents occur.

as for why it happens to me? or other individuals? well the police always have justifications.

i was wearing a beanie.
i was wearing a hooded sweater, even if it is a stripped RL cashmere, gay as hell sweater.
i drive an older model grey/light blue asian(toyo,honda) car... those are constantly stolen and used to do dirt apparently.
my passenger looked at them.
they thought i was going to give them "attitude" (they didnt tell me this, but a cop friend of mine who intervened on my behalf via the radio tole me this). <thats the short version
it was 3am and they said i waited at a light too long.
"you fit the description"

its crazy.

you would think that having baby seats and kids in the backseat would make them think twice about me, but it dont.

in all these incidents, even the times they have me get out the car (which they do only in certain parts of the city) i have had utmost respect for the cops. its hard to. but i do. when they ask me about warrants. drugs. jail time. i tell them IM NOT THE ONE. its a hassle.


first thing i do is surreptitiously glance their name in order to adress them as officer whatever.
i be serious with them. and even try to sound educated. i even started wearing glasses so they think im a geek.
no back talking. i keep my hands where they can see them. no sudden movements.

i dont want to give them any reason to shoot me. this is LA. that happens quite abit.

you learn how to deal with this stuff.
it dont make it any more palatable.
but i deal with it.

audits and studies of CHP(CA hiway patrol) have found that black and brown men are stopped and detained at a higher rate than white folk. even tho the chances of finding drugs and guns is higher in the white folk they pull over.

i just read an article today in the LA times about a highway city in TX, tehana, where motorists, mostly black motorists were being took for their money and belongings in exchange for "charges" being dropped.

Driving through Tenaha, Texas, doesn't pay for some - Los Angeles Times

profiling happens. what can i do to avoid it?
sure i could move. or go straight from work to home. not go out. not visit with friends. lock myself in doors because my neighborhood is the way it is. but thats not the life i want to lead. id rather adress the problems in my neighborhood.
yall are lucky you dont see/feel this. i live it. and its not my fault.

trying to place the blame on those profiled is ridiculous.

next time that girl gets raped i will question why she was wearing such a short skirt. or the next time an old man gets mugged i will ask him why he was out alone...


ya, its my fault
My comments were not intended as an indictment. Obviously, this is the norm in your area, and you must suffer due to the behavior of others. Thatís unfortunate. Best wishes.
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:46 PM
 
Location: CITY OF ANGELS AND CONSTANT DANGER
5,409 posts, read 11,106,575 times
Reputation: 2244
it happens quite a bit. unfortunately. thats one of the reasons i drive less. but my concern really is for my kids now.


and thank you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
My comments were not intended as an indictment. Obviously, this is the norm in your area, and you must suffer due to the behavior of others. Thatís unfortunate. Best wishes.
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Old 03-11-2009, 06:00 PM
 
8,973 posts, read 14,655,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
My comments were not intended as an indictment. Obviously, this is the norm in your area, and you must suffer due to the behavior of others. Thatís unfortunate. Best wishes.
Very profound words here, in just one cryptic post. "Suffering due to the behavior of others"....It happens. It happens to SOME degree to almost all of us. It's part of the human condition, and while it's not FAIR.....it is a predictable occurrence, especially when people see themselves on different 'wave lengths'.

I agree with "the one" that it's not fair at all....yet, as Benicar says, it happens, partially due to bureaucratic 'clumsiness' (the cops don't KNOW you..or me..or anyone else), but LARGELY due to the 'misbehavior of others'. Exactly why, as 'The One' noted, that it MOSTLY happens to young males.

That's the 'way it is', and LA is a particularly rough environment.
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Old 03-12-2009, 05:30 PM
 
Location: escondido,ca
194 posts, read 401,923 times
Reputation: 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob_builder View Post
If you actually believe most people think that, I feel sorry for you.
Everyone knows Hispanics make up the majority of illegals, but for you to state that most people think most Hispanics are here illegally, well that just pretty must discredits everything else you've stated on this site. Your entitled to your opinion even if it is utterly ridiculous, and yes, those are just your opinions, no facts what so ever.
Sorry but they are facts, look it up sometime, there are over 40 million hispanic immigrants (legal) in the united states, then there are estimates of up to 12 million illegals in the country (not all hispanic) So let's say that 10 out of the 12 million illegals are hispanic, that would make 40 out of 50 million hispanics in america LEGAL citizens, therefore causing a big problem with the OP's ignorant calls for profiling.
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Old 03-12-2009, 06:09 PM
 
Location: escondido,ca
194 posts, read 401,923 times
Reputation: 121
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgewalker View Post
Whatever...you're totally wrong, but whatever...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ridgewalker View Post
So they aren't really law abiding citizens are they!

It's very simple, they are here illegally! Why is that so hard to understand?
If they want to legally migrate have them fill out the proper forms to do so and get in line with everyone else.

They are a drain on all of our resources and we can no longer afford to let them slip thru the cracks. They have to be rounded up and given the boot! That is unless you want to see America turn into a 3rd world cesspool...is that your goal? I guess you think all the drug wars taking place on the border are a good thing?
If entering the country illegally is the only crime many of these people have committed, I think they should be given the chance to redeem themselves and become legal citizens, particularly the one's who have steady employment,own businesses,have children and grandchildren here, then they could legally pay taxes and become an asset to their communities, if they aren't already. As for the few bad apples who come here and end up on welfare or become criminals, they should be deported, but we dont need to start randomly profiling people to do it. As for the drug wars on the border...why do you think they happen on the border? Because the illegal drug trade in the united states is one sector of the economy that is alive and well. Whether you want to admit it or not, the illegal drug consumption in america is the single drivning force behind the drug wars in Mexico. We've had the same wars here for years, just on a smaller scale and mostly concentrated in the inner cities. Also,what is the corelation between immigration and 3rd world cesspool? I don't get it
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Old 03-12-2009, 06:47 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,725,501 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
If entering the country illegally is the only crime many of these people have committed, I think they should be given the chance to redeem themselves and become legal citizens, particularly the one's who have steady employment,own businesses,have children and grandchildren here, then they could legally pay taxes and become an asset to their communities, if they aren't already. As for the few bad apples who come here and end up on welfare or become criminals, they should be deported, but we dont need to start randomly profiling people to do it. As for the drug wars on the border...why do you think they happen on the border? Because the illegal drug trade in the united states is one sector of the economy that is alive and well. Whether you want to admit it or not, the illegal drug consumption in america is the single drivning force behind the drug wars in Mexico. We've had the same wars here for years, just on a smaller scale and mostly concentrated in the inner cities. Also,what is the corelation between immigration and 3rd world cesspool? I don't get it
What are you going to do with the next 20 million that show up to await the next serial amnesty?
How much do you think someone who has not completed HS and has no job skills is going to be paying in taxes?

Last edited by andreabeth; 03-12-2009 at 08:13 PM..
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Old 03-12-2009, 07:10 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,725,996 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheeto View Post
If entering the country illegally is the only crime many of these people have committed, I think they should be given the chance to redeem themselves and become legal citizens, particularly the one's who have steady employment,own businesses,have children and grandchildren here, then they could legally pay taxes and become an asset to their communities, if they aren't already. As for the few bad apples who come here and end up on welfare or become criminals, they should be deported, but we dont need to start randomly profiling people to do it. As for the drug wars on the border...why do you think they happen on the border? Because the illegal drug trade in the united states is one sector of the economy that is alive and well. Whether you want to admit it or not, the illegal drug consumption in america is the single drivning force behind the drug wars in Mexico. We've had the same wars here for years, just on a smaller scale and mostly concentrated in the inner cities. Also,what is the corelation between immigration and 3rd world cesspool? I don't get it
Not just no-------------hell no!

We owe those insolent losers: Hispanic or not; nothing----------let them go home and redeem themselves there.
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