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Old 10-28-2009, 05:59 AM
 
Location: San Diego
32,798 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17687

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Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
California has had bilingual education/dual immersion schools for a very long time now. As a matter of fact, I was part of the first generation that started from Kindergarden with bilingual education. The school is not Spanish only, most schools are dual immersion which means that both learn the opposite language at the same time. If you dont want your child to learn Spanish, you can opt out.

Personally, I dont think that children need five or six years of bilingual education. It should be cut down to 2-3 years, no more. They should then be placed in English only programs to give them a more intense level of exposure to the language.
imo dual language in public schooling only detracts from assimilation. They aren't going to speak English at home as many Parents refuse to learn English. If a Parent wants their child to learn another language they should have to pay for it at a private institute imo. I have no problem with classes in other languages but the basic principles should be taught in a common language.
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Old 10-28-2009, 07:00 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00 View Post
You already blew your free government chance to learn Spanish if you went to public school. I became more or less fluent (certainly proficient) from high school Spanish and lots of practice and also gained a functional level of French. If you putzed around high school and didn't take advantage of those opportunities, it's your own fault.
What is your point? I have no desire/need to learn Spanish so it is irrelevant to me.

Frankly; it would behoove Mexico to make English instruction mandatory since the odds are higher than 50/50 that if that nation implodes courtesy of the drug wars we will wind up with probably the northern tier of Mx states.
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Old 10-28-2009, 01:32 PM
 
23 posts, read 57,056 times
Reputation: 35
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Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
If your info is correct: that is flat disgusting; this is the USA not some Latin American country.

ESL should be banned and English immersion only for foreign students.
Thanks to the laziness and general ineptitude of California politicians and leadership and other government employees, immigrants are able to get away with a LOT of ish because there is no crackdown or monitoring out here.

Prop 227 was passed some years ago for English only instruction but the proposition is a joke. At first dual-language or two-language instruction was slipped into a few grades to help "transition" dual language children to English only class instruction but since lazy school district employees refused to get off their 400-lb behinds and monitor the school curriculum more dual language instruction was added to school curriculum instead of being phased out.

At first only a few schools participated in this type of language immersion, then more "charter" schools were created (with taxpayer funding) that were primarily two language (meaning 95% Spanish and 5% English) and NOW in the past few years two language instruction was added to even more PUBLIC schools and more charter schools created.

Then a few educators came up with the brilliant idea to test a new "model" - Spanish language ONLY instruction till the 4th grade and then start English instruction (yeah right). According to the "experts" children should be proficient in BOTH languages by 6th grade.

The simple catch, however, is that most two language schools tend to speak Spanish almost entirely with a few English words thrown in for measure. If most of the students are primarily Spanish speaking then the school personnel sees no "need" to worry about kids who don't come from Spanish language backgrounds. A few public schools in Chinatown also do the same. If the student body is over 75% Asian, these two-language programs primarily speak the mother tongue most of the time and throw in a few English words and call it "dual language" instruction. Also kids who are not from Spanish language backgrounds will be up sh-t's creek with Spanish first programs if they do not come from a Spanish background where the language will not be reinforced once they leave the school grounds. This means that these students will fall further and further behind in a Spanish first program.

By the 6th grade they will be neither proficient in English nor Spanish but that is not the point. As long as Spanish speaking children are served, then to hell with children who are not a part of this demographic.
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Old 10-30-2009, 04:09 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,409,314 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
imo dual language in public schooling only detracts from assimilation. They aren't going to speak English at home as many Parents refuse to learn English. If a Parent wants their child to learn another language they should have to pay for it at a private institute imo. I have no problem with classes in other languages but the basic principles should be taught in a common language.
I respect your opinion 1ATP. To some extent, I am against bilingual education. I have no problem with a transition course but all other courses should be taught in English. Like math, for example. I dont know if it was because I was a "guinea pig" but my Spanish teachers were horrible. My parents did a much better job at teaching me Spanish at home. Of course, I do think that the teachers are much more well prepared than they were back then. I still think that bilingual education should be limited to even two years.
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Old 10-30-2009, 07:04 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,615,542 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
I respect your opinion 1ATP. To some extent, I am against bilingual education. I have no problem with a transition course but all other courses should be taught in English. Like math, for example. I dont know if it was because I was a "guinea pig" but my Spanish teachers were horrible. My parents did a much better job at teaching me Spanish at home. Of course, I do think that the teachers are much more well prepared than they were back then. I still think that bilingual education should be limited to even two years.
You sound like a textbook example of English immersion judging by your fluency.
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