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Old 04-03-2009, 07:40 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,297,320 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
The Americans settlers coming into California were trying to sell land to other Americans. Thus, much of the ad print concerning California was more Europhilic in nature. Obiviously Californians would not sell British heritage. Also, in many of those old films many of the British people, as you described, were caricatures. In the end, the good ol' American boy was the hero. Americans, since the mid 1850s (like most of Europe), became extremely nationalistic. By WWI, nationalism was in full force. However, California having been just acquired very recently, needed a marketing mystique. That mystique would be link to Spain. Hence, why today, Santa Barbara has Moorish architecture in downtown (the original downtown looked more like a western film set, most of downtown's Santa Barbara's Spanish buildings were built after the quake that destroyed the town.) Marketers in Santa Barbara wanted to create a Spanish playground in California.

Actually no. Latin America and Mexico were trying to be on par with European countries during the 1800s-early 1900s. Hence why they sought independence. Argentinians, even though White, were not Spanish...they were Argentinians. Americans in California had an obsession with Spain. Not with the Mexico. See the distinction? Wanting to erase or downplay a past (California) whereas Latin Americans were still continuing a racial/cultural legacy, but were nationalistic. Slight nuance, but helps frame the debate. BTW tell a Mexican person that Castillian Spanish is better. It won't be pretty.

Okay...the last paragraph is really odd and off base on so many levels. Americans say Mexico as lower. Thus, any association with Mexico is "bad" (qualitative term). This affected the frame work with the immigration debate. You use the term "illegal" like it's a moral absolute. It's not. Man makes laws. Laws are existent in all societies (rejecting laws is also done on behalf of Europeans...it's not just a non-European thing). By even your stating that they reject Europeans by rejecting laws is somewhat showing a Europhile/ Western-phile bias. Mexico is technically apart of the West (not industrialized, but still Western in culture and tradition). Thus, your statement is a contradiction. Previous associations about Mexico frame some of the debate.
Just to clarify, Mexico is an industrialized country, where cars, airplane parts, computer parts, tv's, nuclear reactors, and many other things are manufactured, it is also more technified than other latin american countries like Brazil because of it's free trade policy and proximity to the USA, chile comes after Mexico and then Brazil in terms of access to technology and technology usage, however, development has been more chaotic in Mexico than in Chile, or some regions of Brazil, the latter being soooo big that it has clusters of firstworld cities and societies with high income and education levels, and other completely chaotic cities full of corruption unefficiency and poverty.

regards
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,622,458 times
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Back on topic:

Especially with this deepening recession/depression; that is all the more reason to close/lock at least our southern border, cancel birthright citizenship, really bear down on forced deportations of illegal aliens, etc.
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:47 PM
 
Location: Sacramento
13,755 posts, read 23,220,542 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travelling fella View Post
Hello people, this thread is to describe the feelings that this issue produce in you.
Well, from my personal perspective, the illegal immigrant impact is significant.

I moved from the midwest to California a couple of years ago for one single reason, to provide an adequate day program for my significantly handicapped adult daughter. The program in Ohio was very poor, unless the person had a reasonable degree of ability to be independent, and our daughter doesn't.

The program in California is great, but in the process of being reduced due to budget cuts. A major reason the state is in such dire financial circumstances is due to the support cost of illegal immigrant dependent children.

As a consequence, we have already seen the program have to shut down for two full weeks in December, and now another cutback is being discussed for April.
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Old 04-03-2009, 07:47 PM
 
Location: The world, where will fate take me this time?
3,162 posts, read 10,297,320 times
Reputation: 1423
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Back on topic:

Especially with this deepening recession/depression; that is all the more reason to close/lock at least our southern border, cancel birthright citizenship, really bear down on forced deportations of illegal aliens, etc.
I don't know if you noticed my dear AB, a thread that I started regarding 30 agreements that were signed today by the Mexican chancellor Patricia Espinosa and Janet Napolitano about the orderly repatriation of Mexican nationals, as well as education to communities with high emigrant rates about the risks and consequencies of illegal border crossing, I'm wondering why so far nobody has commented anything.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/immig...ion-group.html
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:04 PM
 
1,117 posts, read 1,747,253 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Yeah, but as FormerCaliforniaGirl pointed out, her neighborhood is "icky" because of "illegal" Hispanics (of which she really does not know the legality of these people). So she moved out of state because of "illegals" (again she doesn't know the legal status).This is very common. California has also a history of white flight (Compton, anyone?).
AGAIN....let me correct you. I didn't move out of my once-lovely San Diego neighborhood because it was "icky". I moved out because it was DISGUSTING beyond reason. And it was becoming a public health hazard.

And yes, I do have very very strong convictions that most of the Mexicans living in my old neighborhood were in this country illegally. I know of two households for sure (because the slumlord owner of the house admitted to me that he was renting to illegals....they admitted it to him).

Yes, I'm one of those "white flight" people you speak of. That's what happens when unwelcome, uninvited people who have no legal right to be in this country, invade a community and turn it into a slum.
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:09 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,077,957 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FormerCaliforniaGirl View Post
AGAIN....let me correct you. I didn't move out of my once-lovely San Diego neighborhood because it was "icky". I moved out because it was DISGUSTING beyond reason. And it was becoming a public health hazard.

And yes, I do have very very strong convictions that most of the Mexicans living in my old neighborhood were in this country illegally. I know of two households for sure (because the slumlord owner of the house admitted to me that he was renting to illegals....they admitted it to him).

Yes, I'm one of those "white flight" people you speak of. That's what happens when unwelcome, uninvited people who have no legal right to be in this country, invade a community and turn it into a slum.
Convictions are not fact.

How many chickens are we talking about? There are certain numbers that are allowed on a property (varies from city to city, but still).
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:11 PM
 
1,117 posts, read 1,747,253 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Again the original question, to which I responded related to why Californians have a hatred to illegal immigrants, specifically Hispanics.
With regard to your insistence that Californians hate illegal immigrants, specifically Hispanics..let me set you straight. Here's an analogy for you:

If somebody came into your house, robbed it, vandalized it, kicked your dog, and peed on your roses, you'd be pretty PO'd right?

Now, if that person who did all those rotten things to you was Chinese, would you be PO'd because the person was Chinese, or would you be PO'd because the person robbed your house, vandalized it, kicked your dog, and peed on your roses?

Think about it.
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:11 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,077,957 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by Travelling fella View Post
Just to clarify, Mexico is an industrialized country, where cars, airplane parts, computer parts, tv's, nuclear reactors, and many other things are manufactured, it is also more technified than other latin american countries like Brazil because of it's free trade policy and proximity to the USA, chile comes after Mexico and then Brazil in terms of access to technology and technology usage, however, development has been more chaotic in Mexico than in Chile, or some regions of Brazil, the latter being soooo big that it has clusters of firstworld cities and societies with high income and education levels, and other completely chaotic cities full of corruption unefficiency and poverty.

regards
I guess I meant developed...technically industrialized denotes a high middle class and relatively low wealth gap. Mexico is def. a high mid/high income nation.
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:13 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,077,957 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Back on topic:

Especially with this deepening recession/depression; that is all the more reason to close/lock at least our southern border, cancel birthright citizenship, really bear down on forced deportations of illegal aliens, etc.
With what cash and resources?
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Old 04-03-2009, 08:14 PM
 
1,117 posts, read 1,747,253 times
Reputation: 966
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Convictions are not fact.

How many chickens are we talking about? There are certain numbers that are allowed on a property (varies from city to city, but still).
In the neighborhood where I lived, NO chickens were allowed. It was against the zoning laws. It was NOT a rural area.

And there were dozens and dozens of chickens.
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