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Old 04-10-2009, 09:27 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,798 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17687

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Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
Food Stamps and WIC program are not the same thing. I don't know who told you that.
How are they lying?
Illegals don't benefit from any of the programs they mentioned.
They are eligible for WIC and School lunch, and those appear to be in place to help children that are living in this country. Kind of a humanitarian thing.

I don't doubt there is some kind of strain on hospitals by illegal immigrants. But the articles were pretty specific in what claims they were challenging.
Most of the stuff you guys are attacking are asterisks and footnotes they include themselves. They're covering their asses and aren't trying to just make crazy claims like people on your side. They include sources and explain how they're coming to their conclusions.

But how do you feel about the claim that illegals are still paying into the system through taxes payed during purchases, taken off their paychecks, renter's tax?

From an article back in '05:

The people who are mostly contributing to that file were illegal immigrants.

The New York Times > Business > Illegal Immigrants Are Bolstering Social Security With Billions

The article is clearly sympathetic to illegals, but how do you feel about the actual numbers being brought up?
If they qualify for free meals they also for free Y daycare even if the mother or father doesn't work. This means they get to do whatever during the day even if it isn't work. A few false documents and, bingo, easy street. That sounds fair. My kid's schools is loaded with these types. The most abuse comes from the ones bused in from S East San Diego. You won't see them at the parent-teacher conferences because they don't have an interpretor. Pay your way people!! What a scam. If it is free and tax payer funded they WILL figure it out and abuse it.

I volunteer at 3 schools in Bay Park and it makes me ill seeing this scam first hand.
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:29 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 5,709,656 times
Reputation: 1285
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
Yeah, it's very limited coverage intended for emergency use. And yes, it used by women having babies a lot. Unfortunate.
What do you think about the claims that illegals are paying into the system I just asked you about?
You haven't a clue, have you? The ER is the main conduit that illegal aliens use to gain access to the US healthcare system. They are well aware that they cannot be turned away from an ER irrespective of immigration status or ability to pay. Every patient must be assessed no matter how minor the complaint so they use the ER like everyone else uses a family doctor. Around half of all hospital admissions originate in the ER. If an illegal alien goes to an ER with a heart attack, he needs to be admitted, either to that hospital or transferred to another hospital when his condition is stable enough. Once a heart attack is diagnosed, he is not simply discharged to the street. A hospital has to care for him. This costs money. Who do you think pays for this? I am sorry, but being forced to provide 'free' care to a large population of people who are in the US illegally is a tremendous problem and your attempts to trivialize it are unwarranted. I am going to end my participation in this discussion here as it is not worth the annoyance.

Quote:
Hospitals in California are expected to receive a large portion of the money earmarked by the federal government for facilities whose finances are strained by the cost of providing emergency room care for illegal immigrants.

Hospitals can begin applying today for the funds under a four-year, $1-billion program announced Monday by the Department of Health and Human Services.

<snip>

Emergency rooms are, by default, the medical provider for many of the estimated 8 million to 12 million undocumented immigrants living and working in the United States. Under the law, hospitals participating in federal insurance programs, such as Medicare, must provide emergency care to anyone, regardless of ability to pay.

The Los Angeles County health department estimated that in 2003 the annual bill at public hospitals for uninsured illegal immigrants reached $340 million.
Hospitals to Get Funds for ER Care - Los Angeles Times

Last edited by andreabeth; 04-10-2009 at 09:54 PM..
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:36 PM
 
Location: Missouri
3,640 posts, read 4,308,847 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
If they qualify for free meals they also for free Y daycare even if the mother or father doesn't work. This means they get to do whatever during the day even if it isn't work. A few false documents and, bingo, easy street. That sounds fair. My kid's schools is loaded with these types. The most abuse comes from the ones bused in from S East San Diego. You won't see them at the parent-teacher conferences because they don't have an interpretor. Pay your way people!! What a scam. If it is free and tax payer funded they WILL figure it out and abuse it.

I volunteer at 3 schools in Bay Park and it makes me ill seeing this scam first hand.
And...not one person or family should be getting any free meals at schools. Their damn parents are able to feed them, if they really cared to that is. This goes for the whites and any other idiot who thinks it is up to the government to pay their damn way.
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:37 PM
 
Location: Missouri
3,640 posts, read 4,308,847 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
He knows but refuses to accept any truth. You do realize that he is never going to change. He loves illegals, but only and especially Mexican illegals.

Last edited by Anonymous Political Junky; 04-10-2009 at 09:54 PM..
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Old 04-10-2009, 09:50 PM
 
Location: central Oregon
1,856 posts, read 2,025,508 times
Reputation: 2377
WIC and food stamps are not the same thing. WIC is given to pregnant women to buy healthy food for herself before and after the baby is born IF she chooses to breastfeed. If the woman chooses not to breastfeed then the voucher is used to buy food for the baby. Of course, it has been 26 years since I used WIC, but I'm sure it's basically the same now. How do illegals use WIC, food stamps and medicaid? They have an anchor baby. They go to the nearest welfare office and apply for food stamps. Since fs are based on family income AND family size everyone in the household is counted and enough food stamps are given to feed the family. Clients are told about WIC and encouraged to apply. As for medicaid... same as above... they have an anchor baby that qualifies for medical. I'm not sure if the parents then qualify for medical. I do know when my son was a baby and he qualified for state medical I also qualified... but then we are US born citizens. Medicaid wants to ensure that the parents remain healthy to take care of the child. The media might say that illegals qualify for NOTHING. However, I have been there and seen it with my own eyes. (When someone with a newborn and a couple toddlers walks in to the welfare office and speaks only Spanish it's a good bet they aren't here legally.) And this was all over 25 years ago! I can only imagine how bad it is NOW.
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Old 04-10-2009, 10:27 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,798 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17687
Quote:
Originally Posted by tulani View Post
WIC and food stamps are not the same thing. WIC is given to pregnant women to buy healthy food for herself before and after the baby is born IF she chooses to breastfeed. If the woman chooses not to breastfeed then the voucher is used to buy food for the baby. Of course, it has been 26 years since I used WIC, but I'm sure it's basically the same now. How do illegals use WIC, food stamps and medicaid? They have an anchor baby. They go to the nearest welfare office and apply for food stamps. Since fs are based on family income AND family size everyone in the household is counted and enough food stamps are given to feed the family. Clients are told about WIC and encouraged to apply. As for medicaid... same as above... they have an anchor baby that qualifies for medical. I'm not sure if the parents then qualify for medical. I do know when my son was a baby and he qualified for state medical I also qualified... but then we are US born citizens. Medicaid wants to ensure that the parents remain healthy to take care of the child. The media might say that illegals qualify for NOTHING. However, I have been there and seen it with my own eyes. (When someone with a newborn and a couple toddlers walks in to the welfare office and speaks only Spanish it's a good bet they aren't here legally.) And this was all over 25 years ago! I can only imagine how bad it is NOW.
That is exactly what the programs were set up for. US Citizens pay taxes to ensure that when they fall on hard times they are taken care of, not for an Illegal Alien with a good 100 yard dash time in their third tri-mester that considers it winning the 3rd World Lotto.

{PSSST No one said the word Mexican but the usual respondents will use that as a primary key}
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Old 04-11-2009, 12:52 AM
 
Location: central Oregon
1,856 posts, read 2,025,508 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
That is exactly what the programs were set up for. US Citizens pay taxes to ensure that when they fall on hard times they are taken care of, not for an Illegal Alien with a good 100 yard dash time in their third tri-mester that considers it winning the 3rd World Lotto.

{PSSST No one said the word Mexican but the usual respondents will use that as a primary key}
Well, I, er, did say "speaking Spanish". I should re-phrase that and say "when you don't hear them speaking English, it's a good bet they aren't here legally."
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Old 04-11-2009, 02:28 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
1,030 posts, read 1,254,753 times
Reputation: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
Evidence? Any?
their stated goal is to disprove conservative media.
Media Matters for America - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Media Matters: Caught in Another Lie!

but sure, they are unbiased... really....
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Old 04-11-2009, 02:30 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
1,030 posts, read 1,254,753 times
Reputation: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by antialphabet View Post
HA!
And your side doesn't cherry pick evidence?
Do you have any evidence that the Media Matters study is wrong? Any?

considering that 100% of illegal aliens have broken the law, then they are all criminals, right???
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Old 04-11-2009, 02:38 AM
 
Location: San Antonio, TX
1,030 posts, read 1,254,753 times
Reputation: 244
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
Oh honestly!

This article consists of a number of carefully worded 'myths' that they then go on to supposedly 'debunk, all the while missing the forest for the trees.



The food stamp program now goes by the moniker WIC.



*

What part of 'immigrants of any status who are otherwise eligible may receive WIC' (food stamps) do you fail to understand? It sure sounds to me like illegal aliens can get WIC, how does it sound to you?

Illegal aliens are 'not eligible' for Medicaid? Guess what? They may technically not be eligible for Medicare/Medicaid, but both programs end up paying out hundreds of millions each year to hospitals and health care providers to help cover the costs of caring for illegal aliens who do not bother to pay their bills.

The good people at Media Matters emphatically state that illegal aliens are not eligible for benefits from federal programs, then they put this in one of their footnotes:



The Federal Reimbursement Program is part of the Medicare Modernization Act (2003).



Medicare/Medicaid end up coughing up millions to help pay for the unreimbursed care that hospitals are forced to provide to illegal aliens, but illegal aliens do not benefit from these programs. Got it.

http://tinyurl.com/c96etj (broken link)

Unless my memory fail me, legislation was recently passed that will also give illegal aliens access to SCHIP.

Let's take a second look at the 'truth', as defined by Media Matters.

The Truth: Some believe that undocumented immigrants benefit from federal programs such as food stamps, Medicaid, SCHIP, and welfare. In fact, undocumented immigrants are ineligible to receive these benefits; anyone seeking to obtain them must provide proof of legal status.

You know, if illegal aliens can get WIC, it would seem to me that they benefit from that federal program. And while they technically are not eligible for Medicare/Medicaid, they sure as he11 benefit from these programs, because if Uncle Sam did not step in and prop up the hospitals that are overrun with illegals with US taxpayer dollars, I strongly suspect they would be closing their doors, leaving the illegals (and everybody else) with no ER at all.

This section of your article is nothing but disinformation and half truths. Go ahead. Prove me wrong.
wonderful post. I want to add that if illegals can't get benefits then why were they protesting in Georgia, when Georgia was passing a law making recipients show proof of residence???

Independent Conservative Blog Archive Georgia Passes Anti-Illegal Alien Bill. Many Latinos Protest By Not Working.
The bill addresses criticism that illegals are draining state coffers by requiring adults seeking many public services to prove they are U.S. citizens are in the country legally.

now, why would georgia have to pass this bill if illegals couldn't get benefits???
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