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Old 10-26-2010, 07:20 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
Reputation: 2130

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opyelie View Post
I am sure I not only speak for myself but for a few other posters on this forum when I say that I would like to see you just ONCE come "out of the shadows" and actually state your position on illegal immigration AND your "solution".

Until you can come up with something more than constant jibes and nitpicking snipes against what others are proposing as possible solutions or at the least improvements, you really don't have a "task" here at all.

Please don't take this as a personal "attack", I'm genuinely interested to see what you propose as so far I've only ever seen you post rebuttals against what others have posted.
I would like him to share his views on illegal immigration with the rest of us and what he thinks we should do with those already here also. I would like to know what drives his views also. Of course we can't force him to do that but his complete refusal to makes me wonder why he is here. We already know the laws. Many of us disagree with them but we will do the democratic thing and seek changes to them. Every time we express our disdain for any that are illegal immigration related he just pops in and says "well its the law". Yeah, well laws can be changed and we aren't dishonoring them in the meantime. Unlike the illegal aliens who don't like our laws and just thumb their noses at them and break them anyway.
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:35 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,099,406 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
I've already given good arguments against using foreign labor where there are enough Americans to fill jobs in our own country. Why would anyone even need to present an argument for protecting American jobs for Americans? Lining the pockets of the greedy employers for more profit with cheap foreign labor is not a good one.
You have an overly negative attitude. Consider it from the perspective of improving our morals through well regulated Commerce. Such a public policy scheme could engender the moral of creating private sector jobs; rather than for some to feel it a burden to have to pay more in taxes to subsidize couch potatoes. In other words, if some complain about paying taxes to subsidize couch potatoes, they are welcome to create jobs to induce has been couch potatoes to quit being poor on the same at-will basis as employment relationships via a prevailing, market based wage by participating in the market for labor.

Being market friendly it would be mostly self-regulating and as easy to administer as minimum wage laws are now.
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:42 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,152,437 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
You have an overly negative attitude. Consider it from the perspective of improving our morals through well regulated Commerce. Such a public policy scheme could engender the moral of creating private sector jobs; rather than for some to feel it a burden to have to pay more in taxes to subsidize couch potatoes. In other words, if some complain about paying taxes to subsidize couch potatoes, they are welcome to create jobs to induce has been couch potatoes to quit being poor on the same at-will basis as employment relationships via a prevailing, market based wage by participating in the market for labor.

Being market friendly it would be mostly self-regulating and as easy to administer as minimum wage laws are now.
No, I have a very patriotic attitude towards my country and my fellow citizens. I will always put them first, not foreingers.
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:44 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,099,406 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Private business in our country does not have the right to hire illegal foreigners. What part of that don't you get?
The power you describe has not been delegated to the federal government. We have our Ninth Amendment, a federal doctrine, and state at-will employment laws to consider.

US customs and naturalization was a power delegated and ceded to the general government of the Union, for obvious reasons. Even the several States of the Union are denied and disparaged in their States' right impair in the obligation of Contracts. An employment contract is a Contract.
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Old 10-26-2010, 08:45 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,099,406 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
No, I have a very patriotic attitude towards my country and my fellow citizens. I will always put them first, not foreingers.
Massive deficits are not helping anyone but the suppliers for our wars on abstractions. We could be lowering our tax burden via market friendly means.
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Old 10-26-2010, 09:17 PM
 
3,204 posts, read 2,384,142 times
Reputation: 1544
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
Massive deficits are not helping anyone but the suppliers for our wars on abstractions. We could be lowering our tax burden via market friendly means.

Or we could employ the "couch potato" citizens, as you call them, and let the illegals fight for better conditions in their own country. Our own citizens can lower our tax burden once illegals are no longer able to pull wages down for our own citizens.
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Old 10-26-2010, 09:52 PM
 
Location: deep in the south
233 posts, read 389,830 times
Reputation: 117
Quote:
Originally Posted by danielpalos View Post
You have an overly negative attitude. Consider it from the perspective of improving our morals through well regulated Commerce.


I get it now...........our "new morality" should be teaching us that it is ok to lie, cheat and steal as a way of getting employment. Nope, not me thanks, I'll stick to the way I was raised that says illegal is illegal and if you break the law you pay the price whatever that may be, which in this case should be deportation by the fastest cheapest means possible. Explain to me please how this lying, cheating and stealing improves our morality, you have me quite confused with this statement.
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Old 10-26-2010, 10:57 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,099,406 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by Isitmeorarethingsnuts? View Post
Or we could employ the "couch potato" citizens, as you call them, and let the illegals fight for better conditions in their own country. Our own citizens can lower our tax burden once illegals are no longer able to pull wages down for our own citizens.
FDR's form of socialism could provide jobs through public works projects. Other than that, how do you propose to eliminate a "natural" unemployment rate and form of poverty in the US? In the US, the government cannot tell private individuals who they can and cannot form at-will relationships that result in employment with, because it could be considered an infringement of our Ninth Amendment guarantee to government that is limited to its delegated powers.
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Old 10-26-2010, 11:01 PM
 
Location: US, California - federalist
2,795 posts, read 3,099,406 times
Reputation: 479
Quote:
Originally Posted by mollies mom View Post
I get it now...........our "new morality" should be teaching us that it is ok to lie, cheat and steal as a way of getting employment. Nope, not me thanks, I'll stick to the way I was raised that says illegal is illegal and if you break the law you pay the price whatever that may be, which in this case should be deportation by the fastest cheapest means possible. Explain to me please how this lying, cheating and stealing improves our morality, you have me quite confused with this statement.
Improving our morals through well regulated Commerce could entail true witness bearing to Capitalism, if not Religion via market friendly transactions instead of the coercive use of force of the State.
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Old 10-26-2010, 11:18 PM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,611 posts, read 10,950,538 times
Reputation: 3083
daniel, this has ZILCH to do with Illegal Immigration - why don't you take it to the Politics forum instead?
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