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Old 05-27-2009, 06:45 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,823,428 times
Reputation: 3028

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellem View Post
This counter-argument is getting really old, and weakening by the post. What other reason other than the fact that they are here illegally ( that well could be fixed by legalizing them ) would support treating them any different than the U.S. Justice System treats anyone else.

Even though it might not look like it, I do really try to come up with new and exciting arguments. I would like to be afforded the same courtesy. In most threads someone has to reply, but... "They here illegally"

I don't know if someone watched Jon Steward's show a few nights ago where the only reason the English guy would cite was: but.. "He is gay". This seems awfully like it.
Do you actually NOT comprehend the difference between legal and illegal? Or, is there a total disconnect with reality? I realize you are young, but you must learn that you will have laws, rules, and regulations throughout your life – at school, work, driving, etc., etc., etc.

If you enter this country without permission, you are in violation of our laws. I can’t help how sick you are of hearing it -- they are ILLEGAL! ILLEGAL! ILLEGAL! No amount of fanciful delusions is going to change their status to legal; nor will they be granted the coveted “path to citizenship” anytime in the foreseeable future. You can either accept it, or continue to live in denial.

If you don’t want to face reality, get off the computer and play a game on your PlayStation. This is the REAL world, and in this world we have laws. If you obey them, all is well. If you violate them, there are consequences, and they range from a simple fine to arrest and imprisonment. If you’re an illegal alien, you risk arrest and deportation. It’s just that simple.
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Old 05-27-2009, 06:54 PM
 
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
804 posts, read 1,175,567 times
Reputation: 137
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
1.That will only be true until the next crop of illegal shows up to await their amnesty
Very true, that's why I think amnesty is not the way to go. A path to citizenship would be much better, not one that just targets illegals here and now, but to set the bar for the ones to come. If you set it at a college degree before you are 21, the kids that are finishing HS back at their countries know that once they finish college they would be able to come.

Or at least some, finish high school minimum, so the level of the immigrants that are going to make the next crop would be better. It's a lot easier to defend deporting someone who is an illegal because he didn't want to bring himself to the level required (provided that the level is attainable) that someone who is an illegal because he doesn't have any family to sponsor him. ( Since, there is nothing they can do about it)

Quote:


2.The majority are not going to earn enough to pay much, if anything, in taxes. They are still going to require government assistance. Why do you think 3 families live in a two bedroom apartment now? Making them legal is not going to suddenly catapult them into the middle class.
Maybe the ones crossing the border with low education will not be able to attain good jobs, but there do is a minimum of 5 + change/ hr. While it's not a luxury wage by any means and individual would be able to get at least something around $12K a year, enough to pay for their own food and shelter. I have yet to meet someone who lives like that. Specially if the families are unrelated. I have lived in what you could call a similar situation but thats nothing new to me, back in my country is rare for a young professional to own his own house. On my house there were 12 people, provided that the houses are a lot bigger ( I only had to share with my room with my younger brother).

I do have heard about people, specially that just got here. Or that due to SS requirements have poor job stability having to live in suboptimal conditions. Since they may be making enough to pay for nicer accommodations but they might lose their job the next day so they cannot risk it.

But on the other hand, here is people from all over the rest of the world who come and overstay their visa. I know that my experience is not the most common, but I know of a lot of illegal aliens who hold college or other advanced degrees yet they are working as ground-crews, maintenance, delivery, or other occupations that I used to know as sub-employed ( As when the individual is employed, but not at the level of their training ) By giving these individual the ability to work, they would be catapulted into the middle class.


Quote:
3.They are not going to pay. Most will earn so little that they will be on Medicaid which means everyone else pays.
Again this is one of the reasons I don't like to speculate on short timeframes, but in this case your guess is as good as mine. Will they pay or not, I think yes, you think not. Long term though, since their kids have been better educated than themselves will have more opportunity at having better incomes.
Quote:
4. A level playing field is good.
And I think U.S. citizens even get the upper hand since they are more likely to be educated.

Quote:
5. Give me a break.
I know that the example was a little out there, but please say what you don't agree with, since the comment is not really helpful. I think it's much easier to gain public support to deport an illegal alien who is a criminal (not related to immigration) than to gain public support to deport someone who is not.

Quote:
6. What are we supposed to do until the economy magically springs back to life? Are they all going to be collecting unemployment?
Why do people like to refer to the economy recovering a magic, I would like to say it's due to the hard work of a lot of people more than just pure luck.
They are going to be working, again maybe not making as much as they could but at least getting along. Would you support cutting any kind of unemployment benefits to newly legalized individuals? Those that cannot weather the down time, well, are welcome to return where they came from.

Quote:
Look, I can see no benefit in granting citizenship by whatever means to millions of poorly educated, unskilled illegal aliens. This is a great deal for them and a real bad deal for American citizens.
Would you support a proposal that grants a path to citizenship to well educated and skilled illegal aliens? where would you set the bar at? High school, +2 years of college, bachelors, technical training?
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Old 05-27-2009, 08:15 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,643,200 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Do you actually NOT comprehend the difference between legal and illegal? Or, is there a total disconnect with reality? I realize you are young, but you must learn that you will have laws, rules, and regulations throughout your life – at school, work, driving, etc., etc., etc.

If you enter this country without permission, you are in violation of our laws. I can’t help how sick you are of hearing it -- they are ILLEGAL! ILLEGAL! ILLEGAL! No amount of fanciful delusions is going to change their status to legal; nor will they be granted the coveted “path to citizenship” anytime in the foreseeable future. You can either accept it, or continue to live in denial.

If you don’t want to face reality, get off the computer and play a game on your PlayStation. This is the REAL world, and in this world we have laws. If you obey them, all is well. If you violate them, there are consequences, and they range from a simple fine to arrest and imprisonment. If you’re an illegal alien, you risk arrest and deportation. It’s just that simple.
You know that and I know that: but; in the fantasy world of the pro illegal apologists-----------they will never accept defeat.
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