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View Poll Results: Do You Support Passage of the DREAMAct?
Yes, they were brought here are innocent children 37 24.03%
No, they are nothing more than the 2nd generation of illegal alien criminals 117 75.97%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 154. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-08-2009, 05:40 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,640,026 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Yes. Of course. We should also try to abolish the whole in-state out-state tuition as well... Anything to increase educational attainment is a good thing.
Irrelevant: being an American has certain perks.

And since more people want to move here (even legally) than we have room for............we can pick and choose whom we let in. If that enrages la raza and/or DREAMies----------tough!
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Old 12-08-2009, 07:24 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,822,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanengland View Post
For those who say no...... i understand where you are coming from but please understand me. i'm from England and was unwillingly moved here when i was 12 but since then i have grown custom to the American life, i have many friends and a typical life. however i have limited options for higher learning and all i'm asking for is a chance. because i know i can give something back to this country if i'm just given a shot.
I realize you had no control over moving here. My family relocated from PA when I was a child, and I was forced to leave my friends and the only home I had known. After all, children follow their parents.

However, you are now old enough to realize your parents violated our laws, and you are not a legal resident. Return to England, then, follow the law if you wish to return. You won’t even have to learn a different language. You must understand that you are not entitled to the benefits and privileges reserved for U.S. citizens, nor would I be entitled to the same if I chose to live in England illegally. A life based on deception will bring you no happiness.
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Old 12-08-2009, 07:30 AM
 
Location: Maryland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Yes. Of course. We should also try to abolish the whole in-state out-state tuition as well... Anything to increase educational attainment is a good thing.
Should we also rescind our laws requiring foreign visa holders to pay higher tuition rates? After all, if we shouldn’t require illegal aliens to pay out-of-state rates, why should we penalize foreigners who are following the law? Why not let taxpayers subsidize the educations of anyone who chooses to attend our schools?
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Old 12-08-2009, 09:38 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,080,559 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Should we also rescind our laws requiring foreign visa holders to pay higher tuition rates? After all, if we shouldn’t require illegal aliens to pay out-of-state rates, why should we penalize foreigners who are following the law? Why not let taxpayers subsidize the educations of anyone who chooses to attend our schools?
Those aren't laws. Tutions are not dictated by the government. Tuition is regulated by the universities. Foreigners should not have to pay out of state tuition.

Look, seeing how tuition is rising faster than just about anything...tuition help is needed.

Also, increasing educational attainment should be priority number one. Period. This would greatly help this community.
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Old 12-08-2009, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Houston
3,567 posts, read 3,823,975 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seanengland View Post
For those who say no...... i understand where you are coming from but please understand me. i'm from England and was unwillingly moved here when i was 12 but since then i have grown custom to the American life, i have many friends and a typical life. however i have limited options for higher learning and all i'm asking for is a chance. because i know i can give something back to this country if i'm just given a shot.

This post dosen't make sense to me at all. You can move back to the U.K. any time. You would even get a free education over there, have the same standard of living or even a higher standard of living. Probably a higher one, since you can't have a decent live here if you're illegal. That's the second person in one week who claims to be here illegally and coming from Europe. I think that's total BS.

I also think it's a total disgrace that Americans got to pay out-of-state tuition and illegals do not in some states. It's outrageous.

Last edited by XodoX; 12-08-2009 at 09:57 AM..
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Old 12-08-2009, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,822,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Those aren't laws. Tutions are not dictated by the government. Tuition is regulated by the universities. Foreigners should not have to pay out of state tuition.

Look, seeing how tuition is rising faster than just about anything...tuition help is needed.

Also, increasing educational attainment should be priority number one. Period. This would greatly help this community.
Pardon me, I meant policies. I think we all know the government doesn’t regulate tuition fees. However, they are involved in the decision-making policies of public institutions. After all, they are subsidized by taxpayers.

In any case, the government does require foreigners who attend our primary and secondary schools to pay for their education; whereas, taxpayers are forced to foot the bill for illegal aliens. How can anyone possibly condone this?

We reward lawbreakers, while penalizing those who play by the rules. I’m surprised anyone enters this country legally. Why follow the law, since only the lawbreakers are rewarded?

It’s more than enough that taxpayers are forced to pay for illegals to receive a K-12 education. If they want to attend college, let them pay for it.
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Old 12-08-2009, 10:44 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,080,559 times
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Pardon me, I meant policies. I think we all know the government doesn’t regulate tuition fees. However, they are involved in the decision-making policies of public institutions. After all, they are subsidized by taxpayers.

Not truly involved. It does depend on the university system. For example the majority of funding for the UC system is private funding. A slight portion comes from the state.

In any case, the government does require foreigners who attend our primary and secondary schools to pay for their education; whereas, taxpayers are forced to foot the bill for illegal aliens. How can anyone possibly condone this?

Not to mention the fact that they majority of illegal immigrants pay income taxes, and all pay sales taxes...one view is that we misallocated resources away from education. We need to appropriate funds for cheaper education so we can reduce the debt burden of the future middle class.

We reward lawbreakers, while penalizing those who play by the rules. I’m surprised anyone enters this country legally. Why follow the law, since only the lawbreakers are rewarded?

It's not a reward. The children were too young to know. They got into college (which is better than the majority of people) and wish to find methods to NOT disrupt their lives. It's pretty simple. I think that if they obtain a degree or some other form of post secondary education, they should be able to contribute to our nation.

It’s more than enough that taxpayers are forced to pay for illegals to receive a K-12 education. If they want to attend college, let them pay for it.

College is never free. Even for the poorest people, college is still VERY expensive.
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,893,897 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarah8cas View Post
Okay just because some people are brought here at a young age does not mean that they are going to be or are criminals!!! they got here because of their parents searching for a better life, i mena im sure ur parents would have taken u out of a country for a better life. but now that they are here, they only know and have grown to only know the "american life". they shouldn't be punished because it was not their choice. i do not speak for the criminals or those with bad backgrounds, but for those looking to succeed in life. so for those misjudging the world, not everyone is a criminal just because they are not citizens. they are just here for a better life.Read more: Should the Dream Act Be Passed?
Your point? Well how many tax dollars have been diverted to take care of those whose parents are criminals? Dollars that might have been used for other purposes? Just as the child of the illegal had no choice in the matter nor do any legal citizens. We didn't give a head nod and say ok we will assume the burden. No It was forced upon us.
Children of other crimes suffer the consequences for their parents BAD decision making. The father commits tax fraud and is caught. The assets are siezed and now Johnny born with a silver spoon is Johnny living on welfare with his mom while dad does his prison time.
Mean while folks want, no demand special consideration for illegals and their children. Legal citizens who want to bring the adult children of their spouse to live here fight an up hill battle. How can we justify helping the children and adult children of illegals but make it very difficult for us to help the children of legals?
Gunther was brought here by his parents who over stayed their VISA.
Gunther is a victim of his parents not our laws. We should not be made to feel guilty nor required to facilitate Gunther.
Sung Li was born here a child of illegals. That is not our fault nor our problem. Her parents own this and should make it right. No we owe nothing to the children of illegals, nor should we forsake our own in favor of illegals.
I am not a gambling man. I hate to loose and dont take it well at all. But if I were to gamble. Who will be a better citizen an honest citizen?
The child of an illegal who lived a life of lies, was taught how to cheat the system,grew up in an enviroment of deceit or the child of a legal whose parents taught them the value of fair play, honor and obeying the law?
I will bet all day every time on the child of the legal.
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:19 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,822,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Not truly involved. It does depend on the university system. For example the majority of funding for the UC system is private funding. A slight portion comes from the state.
Irrelevant.

Not to mention the fact that they majority of illegal immigrants pay income taxes, and all pay sales taxes...one view is that we misallocated resources away from education. We need to appropriate funds for cheaper education so we can reduce the debt burden of the future middle class.

The “majority” pay income taxes? Really? Do you have evidence to support your assertion, other than a report from an illegal alien peddler? Would the HUGE percentage paid in cash be included in the majority? Any amount they may pay is negligible compared to the tax-funded services they receive.

It's not a reward. The children were too young to know. They got into college (which is better than the majority of people) and wish to find methods to NOT disrupt their lives. It's pretty simple. I think that if they obtain a degree or some other form of post secondary education, they should be able to contribute to our nation.

To allow the children of illegals to receive preferential treatment over foreigners residing in this country legally, is in fact rewarding illegals for ignoring our laws. Their parents bring them here illegally, and we reward them with a tax-funded K-12 education, and in-state college tuition. That's not a bad deal for illegals. If they want to “contribute” to a country, let them contribute to their countries of origin. Again, if they want to attend college, let them pay.

College is never free. Even for the poorest people, college is still VERY expensive.

Yes, college is expensive. How does that obligate us to subsidize the college education of illegal aliens?
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Old 12-08-2009, 11:21 AM
 
Location: Pa
20,310 posts, read 18,893,897 times
Reputation: 6517
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Irrelevant.

Not to mention the fact that they majority of illegal immigrants pay income taxes, and all pay sales taxes...one view is that we misallocated resources away from education. We need to appropriate funds for cheaper education so we can reduce the debt burden of the future middle class.

The “majority” pay income taxes? Really? Do you have evidence to support your assertion, other than a report from an illegal alien peddler? Would the HUGE percentage paid in cash be included in the majority? Any amount they may pay is negligible compared to the tax-funded services they receive.

It's not a reward. The children were too young to know. They got into college (which is better than the majority of people) and wish to find methods to NOT disrupt their lives. It's pretty simple. I think that if they obtain a degree or some other form of post secondary education, they should be able to contribute to our nation.

To allow the children of illegals to receive preferential treatment over foreigners residing in this country legally, is in fact rewarding illegals for ignoring our laws. Their parents bring them here illegally, and we reward them with a tax-funded K-12 education, and in-state college tuition. That's not a bad deal for illegals. If they want to “contribute” to a country, let them contribute to their countries of origin. Again, if they want to attend college, let them pay.

College is never free. Even for the poorest people, college is still VERY expensive.

Yes, college is expensive. How does that obligate us to subsidize the college education of illegal aliens?
Well said and exactly right. Especially your last statement. Our resourses should be used to help Leagal citizens first and always.
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