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Old 09-01-2009, 10:16 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 4,153,091 times
Reputation: 1274

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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Thus, it's a punishment. The penalty is that they are not allowed to gain access to cheap education due to their parent's actions. You feel no "moral problem with stuffing them in the same shipping container and sending it south".
Illegal alien students have already had access to 12 years of education, I feel no obligation to provide them with more.
We have been over this many, many times. Their parents placed them in this situation. I did not place them in this situation. My neighbor across the street did not place them in this situation. Their parents brought them to the US knowing full well that what they were doing was illegal. The concept of acting like an adult and accepting responsibility for one's behavior seem to be foreign to many illegal alien parents. Nonetheless, the fact of the matter is that they have no one to blame except themselves for their illegal children's situation and no amount of finger pointing can change that.



Quote:
First off, roughly 20% of illegal immigrants aren't from the "south". The second largest group is "west" of followed by "north" and then "east".
So what? 80% of them are from the south. The ones who are from other areas of the world should be returned to their respective homelands.

Quote:
Secondly, you have no problem treating them like freight. There people. This the part I don't understand. Regardless of how they came here, they are people. Not "aliens" (though originally mean the same as immigrants, denotes how people dehumanize illegal immigrants...or rather undocumented immigrants).
Oh yes! We are soooooo dehumanizing! They attend our schools for free, get free interpreters and lawyers whenever needed, they can walk into any ER and get thousands of dollars worth of care for which they will never pay a dime, they have activists and ethnic advocacy groups constantly on the prowl to make sure their 'rights' are not infringed upon and anytime things do not go their way all they need do is shout 'racism!' and more often than not they will get what they want. Give me a break!


Quote:
Thirdly, those obtaining a college education to serve as role models and show that it is possible with hard work to succeed is better than simply not allowing them an education.
They can get a college education in their own country and serve as a role model there.

Quote:
They would (and do) contribute back to the communities they are from.
They can contribute to the communities in the country that they are from. (hint; it's not the US)

Quote:
They help in the inner city, poor rural areas.
They can help in inner city and poor rural areas in their own countries.

Quote:
They serve to inspire those to pursue their dreams.
They can serve to inspire those to pursue their dreams in their own country instead of heading to El Norte to feast at the trough of the Blue Eyed Devils.

Quote:
But, you'd rather waste money and deport them all in "shipping containers". It's illogical at best.
It's not wasted money.

Quote:
How the F U C K does it directly affect you? I'll tell you...it doesn't. Pulling resources for billingual education? Interesting since billingual education is such a small percentage of the total budget. Are you sure it's not poor district planning (many districts over run on operation costs)? Poor district investments? (many inland districts bought school site lands and now are selling at a loss). Like most people, you probably didn't think about those things. You probably said "oh, it's the immigrants". It's a shame in this nation that people don't take the time to realize what's going on. Also, putting your children in private school was a choice. I went to public school and turned out fine. In fact, I went to an inner city school. The school had IB (a lot of public schools have IB or AP...I was in GATE at a public school, plus my parents tutored me during the summer. I got better grades than neighbors that went the private school route. 4.45 GPA, full IB diploma). If you are complaining about spending money on tuition for private schooling, that's not the fault of illegal immigrants. That's your perogative.

Who are you to decide what should be an acceptable school environment for someone else's child?

Quote:
Let me get this straight, you'd rather not educate the poor undocumented immigrants and create an underclass that has a higher risk of reliance on welfare?
I am not going to do anything that
a) encourages the ones we have to stay and
b) encourages even more to sneak in.


Quote:
1) Drop your life, redesign your plans
2) Hope that there are spots
3) Realize that you are a cog in a machine that creates a highly educated, yet highly indebted class of people (I'm 55k in the hole)
4) Appease *******s that hate those that are different from them
Why not? For once in their lives, why shouldn't they do something the legal way? You know, the way everybody else is expected to apply for student visas, etc.?

Quote:
I pay taxes. My parent's pay taxes. My brother and sister in law pays taxes. My parents were making high 5 figures to six figures (90k-110k depending on whether my dad worked summers)...brother is making 150-200k. We feel that it's our part in society to aid those that are less fortunate in creating a better society.
Good for you.

Quote:
You exemplify all that America should strive not to be. We should realize our problems and try to fix them, not ship it away. They are here now, and the problem needs a long term solution. To you, choosing to pay for private school is a problem directly due from illegal immigration and not out of your skewed belief. The illogic, ignorance, and lack of compassion is not what America should stand for.

When ever someone commits a crime or breaks a law, they are taking a chance. They might get away with it or they might not. When illegal madre and padre packed up the kids and headed for the US, they took a chance. I suspect alot of them believed that another amnesty was right around the corner, all they had to do was hang out for a few years. However they years have gone by and there has not been another massive shamnesty. Their tactic now is to use their kids as the reason why they must be allowed to stay. Let's say we do grant the DREAMboats their wish and give them citizenship.......................

What is the very first thing the citizens Dreamies are going to do as soon as they can, that1guy?

Answer: They are going to sponsor illegal madre and padre for citizenship. This exactly what madre and padre have been counting on! They will be very well rewarded for breaking the law. And they in turn can sponsor additional illiterate, unskilled family members. If we gain one DREAMie with at least two years of post HS schooling but also get 5 family members who are never going to carry their own weight, to me that is not a very good deal.

Last edited by andreabeth; 09-01-2009 at 11:16 PM..

 
Old 09-01-2009, 10:35 PM
 
Location: Some Beach... Somewhere...
3,141 posts, read 1,917,839 times
Reputation: 2366
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Thus, it's a punishment. The penalty is that they are not allowed to gain access to cheap education due to their parent's actions. You feel no "moral problem with stuffing them in the same shipping container and sending it south".


No, it's not punishment. Punishment is dealt to the offender, in this case, their parents. The children of such criminals are subject to consequences of their parents behavior. Denial of benefits for US citizens is not a punishment for any action of the children, merely consequences of their parents criminal behavior. Likewise with deportation. If a bank robber is caught, convicted, and subsequently imprisoned, are his children being 'punished' by the state because Daddy can't be there for birthday parties? Should Daddy be let out so the kids are happier? No, it's a result of his law breaking that they're blowing out candles alone. Let's not confuse issues. Put the blame where it lies, on the parents for making the choice to break the law.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
First off, roughly 20% of illegal immigrants aren't from the "south". The second largest group is "west" of followed by "north" and then "east". Secondly, you have no problem treating them like freight. There people. This the part I don't understand. Regardless of how they came here, they are people. Not "aliens" (though originally mean the same as immigrants, denotes how people dehumanize illegal immigrants...or rather undocumented immigrants). Thirdly, those obtaining a college education to serve as role models and show that it is possible with hard work to succeed is better than simply not allowing them an education. They would (and do) contribute back to the communities they are from. They help in the inner city, poor rural areas. They serve to inspire those to pursue their dreams. But, you'd rather waste money and deport them all in "shipping containers". It's illogical at best


So by your own admission 80% are from SOB. A fine place to start then. We'll get to the others as we catch them and start enforcing our sovreign laws. They are, by definition, aliens - a term generally accepted. Let's not play PC games and try to soften the reality to make it more digestible and less accurate. And as law-breakers they are illegal aliens, not undocumented. I have no problem with them obtaining a college education - on their own dime and according to the laws of the nation where they obtain it. I don't deny them an education, I just don't feel I should contribute to it financially. In. Any. Way. And shipping them home is not a waste of money. Providing benefits to law breakers while ignoring their transgressions is a waste of money and only encourages others to break the law. Shipping containers seem an efficient way to package them for transport, and is certainly no different than the way many of them arrive - packed like sardines in vans or trailers, nor is it different from how many choose to live here, 25 to a townhouse.

"[sic]There people. This the part I don't understand. Regardless of how they came here, they are people."

Waa-waa-waa!! Guess what? We are people, too, who are working hard to keep our nation and society one in which we feel safe to live. If a burglar breaks into your house and announces he's taking up residence there, and you are now obligated to shelter him, feed his family, teach his children, and care for him when he's sick... what is your reaction? Oh yeah, he also decides that he's entitled to any inheritance your ancestors left you. And he doesn't like much how you're decorated, so he'll just change that around to suit his cultural mores. How do you feel now?

As to where they came from, well Life's Not Fair. Nothing is going to make it fair. Stop advocating throwing my money at their problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
How the F U C K does it directly affect you? I'll tell you...it doesn't. Pulling resources for billingual education? Interesting since billingual education is such a small percentage of the total budget.


I've already cited clearly how it affects me and will not restate the facts. Go back and reread if it's unclear. You're certainly free to disagree. Lowering yourself to vulgarity when cornered speaks volumes. Please refrain from doing so as it no doubt upsets some of our audience. Let's keep this mature.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Are you sure it's not poor district planning (many districts over run on operation costs)? Poor district investments? (many inland districts bought school site lands and now are selling at a loss).


Are you sure that it is?

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Like most people, you probably didn't think about those things. You probably said "oh, it's the immigrants". It's a shame in this nation that people don't take the time to realize what's going on.


I did, and do think about these things. That's how I am aware of what's going on and have stated it succinctly here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Also, putting your children in private school was a choice. I went to public school and turned out fine. In fact, I went to an inner city school. The school had IB (a lot of public schools have IB or AP...I was in GATE at a public school, plus my parents tutored me during the summer. I got better grades than neighbors that went the private school route. 4.45 GPA, full IB diploma). If you are complaining about spending money on tuition for private schooling, that's not the fault of illegal immigrants. That's your perogative.


Yes, putting my child in private school is my choice. I find it distrubing that a school I'm already paying for has been removed as an option. I would find it even more disturbing to have my toddler come home and greet me with "Hola, Papa! ¿Cómo estás?" I'm thankful that I can do what I am to solve the problem in our case and feel for those who cannot, and must deal with the consequnces of our government failing to enforce our immigration policy either at the border or within society.

As for your educational background, what does that have to do with the discussion? Were your parents criminal invaders? If not, your citing your situation is irrelevant. Shall I bring up where I went to school? Would that make my case stronger here? I don't think so.

"I went to public school and turned out fine."

That's open to debate but I'll try to stick to the current topic.

My complaint lies not with the money I spend on private tuition as I could choose to do that in any case. The complaint lies with spending my hard earned tax dollars to provide for the children of criminal aliens who are brought here and dumped into our social support systems while those same parents are contributing nothing to our society in proportion to what they take out. I don't want them sheltered, fed, educated, nor provided with medical care on my tax dollars.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Let me get this straight, you'd rather not educate the poor undocumented immigrants and create an underclass that has a higher risk of reliance on welfare?


I'd rather our elected representatives enforce existing laws. I'd rather the borders be secure. And yes, I'd rather not educate the children of criminal illegal aliens. Barring all that, I'd rather send them back across the border as expeditiously as possible, whether that is in a shipping container, a bus, or through the desert from whence they came.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
1) Drop your life, redesign your plans
2) Hope that there are spots
3) Realize that you are a cog in a machine that creates a highly educated, yet highly indebted class of people (I'm 55k in the hole)
4) Appease *******s that hate those that are different from them?
1) They sure redesigned their plans once they become aware that there is a teat in America to suckle at.
2) Life is about probablilities.
3) Everything has it's costs. Again, what does your educational debt have to do with this? Shall I talk about my student loans? (Grad school sure is expensive and I went to one of the costliest school in the nation. It's paying off.)
4) No, I don't want to be appeased. I just want them gone with no welfare system in place here to lure them back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
I pay taxes. My parent's pay taxes. My brother and sister in law pays taxes. My parents were making high 5 figures to six figures (90k-110k depending on whether my dad worked summers)...brother is making 150-200k. We feel that it's our part in society to aid those that are less fortunate in creating a better society.


Many of us pay taxes. And the burden is proportionately higher the more you make. The story about your parents is beautiful, and you tell it so well. But what the hell does it have to do with this? Do you want to whip out W2s or arm wrestle dollar-for-dollar?

Does reading the Socialist Bible keep you up at night? If you want to aid those less fortunate, then spend your money to do so. Do not spend mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
You exemplify all that America should strive not to be. We should realize our problems and try to fix them, not ship it away. They are here now, and the problem needs a long term solution. To you, choosing to pay for private school is a problem directly due from illegal immigration and not out of your skewed belief. The illogic, ignorance, and lack of compassion is not what America should stand for.


Au contraire. I think I exemplify that which made America great and made it a place where the standard of living is so high that people worldwide are drawn to it. You don't advocate fixing problems, you advocate magnifying problems by giving my money to criminal underachievers and creating a welfare state in which tax dollars are used to reward criminal behavior. You are right in that I choose to pay private school tuition, no argument there. I wish I didn't feel the need to and know many who do not have the choice that I do. Many children of real US citizens are denied a good education in our public school system due to the pressures of having to educate and provide for the needs of illegals and anchor babies.

Lack of compassion? Boo-Hoo-Hoo! Spend your charity dollars on whom you wish to, but do not spend mine.
 
Old 09-02-2009, 04:09 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 3,562,469 times
Reputation: 783
Quote:
Originally Posted by Workin_Hard View Post

No, it's not punishment. Punishment is dealt to the offender, in this case, their parents. The children of such criminals are subject to consequences of their parents behavior. Denial of benefits for US citizens is not a punishment for any action of the children, merely consequences of their parents criminal behavior. Likewise with deportation. If a bank robber is caught, convicted, and subsequently imprisoned, are his children being 'punished' by the state because Daddy can't be there for birthday parties? Should Daddy be let out so the kids are happier? No, it's a result of his law breaking that they're blowing out candles alone. Let's not confuse issues. Put the blame where it lies, on the parents for making the choice to break the law.

So you don't know the meaning of punishment. A punishment does not have to be given to the offender. People get punished all the time for crimes they did not commit. This is what you are advocating. Denial of benefits due to an action is...guess what? A punishment. If you send a person to jail, your logic would follow that this is not a punishment. Your logic would state that it's a denial of geographical freedom. It's a punishment.

Daddy being in jail during the kid's birthday party is different. First off, the children aren't being punished. They are not being tossed in jail. Secondly, your deportation idea is more akin to throwing the child in jail with h(is)(er) dad. Your example is really poor example. A birthday is superfluous, a university education is not.



So by your own admission 80% are from SOB. A fine place to start then. We'll get to the others as we catch them and start enforcing our sovreign laws. They are, by definition, aliens - a term generally accepted. Let's not play PC games and try to soften the reality to make it more digestible and less accurate. And as law-breakers they are illegal aliens, not undocumented. I have no problem with them obtaining a college education - on their own dime and according to the laws of the nation where they obtain it. I don't deny them an education, I just don't feel I should contribute to it financially. In. Any. Way. And shipping them home is not a waste of money. Providing benefits to law breakers while ignoring their transgressions is a waste of money and only encourages others to break the law. Shipping containers seem an efficient way to package them for transport, and is certainly no different than the way many of them arrive - packed like sardines in vans or trailers, nor is it different from how many choose to live here, 25 to a townhouse.

Fine I don't feel like contributing money "In. Any. Way." to you. I don't want to pay into social security that you will receive benefits. Pay taxes so that the army will protect you. etc. etc. etc. Proposing alternative methods and means of legalization is better (and cheaper) than deportation. Providing a way to obtain legalization via education not only incentivizes education, but also cuts down on the cost of those entering welfare. Deportation is too costly. You also run the risk of racial profiling (by the fact of "sending them south" is a good idea of what I'm talking about. What would happen is some Americans without their ID could get deported).

"[sic]There people. This the part I don't understand. Regardless of how they came here, they are people."

Whoops realized they're...typed too fast.

Waa-waa-waa!! Guess what? We are people, too, who are working hard to keep our nation and society one in which we feel safe to live. If a burglar breaks into your house and announces he's taking up residence there, and you are now obligated to shelter him, feed his family, teach his children, and care for him when he's sick... what is your reaction? Oh yeah, he also decides that he's entitled to any inheritance your ancestors left you. And he doesn't like much how you're decorated, so he'll just change that around to suit his cultural mores. How do you feel now?

Bad example again. Not going to even bother. Hopefully one day you'll learn a house is not a nation and a burglar is not an undocumented immigrant. Not an apple to apple comparison. At least come up with an analogy that is applicable. Not something that, well, is leading, illogical, and frankly stupid.



As to where they came from, well Life's Not Fair. Nothing is going to make it fair. Stop advocating throwing my money at their problem.

You are too boxed in to realize that, well, that their problem is our problem. That creating an underclass NEVER works. Look at S.A. They do deportations and denial of services to illegal immigrants. Massive riots on the streets. Many Zims are entering into the nation despite deportation efforts. People will cross no matter. That is a waste of money. Educating and providing various means of entering into our nation is actually better than creating an underclass of people.

I've already cited clearly how it affects me and will not restate the facts. Go back and reread if it's unclear. You're certainly free to disagree. Lowering yourself to vulgarity when cornered speaks volumes. Please refrain from doing so as it no doubt upsets some of our audience. Let's keep this mature.

Well, you've cited badly. Not lowering to vulgarity, but rather plain truths. Also being condescending speaks volumes about you. So if you'd actually like to be mature, you'd probably not act in such a manner. Otherwise that's hypocritical. If the word F U C K offends you, well, it's more telling about your maturity level. It shows that you would not allow a person to write capital letters in a certain order.


Are you sure that it is?

Yes actually.

I did, and do think about these things. That's how I am aware of what's going on and have stated it succinctly here.

No you've not mentioned those things...so it appears you are not aware. You even stated that the reason why you put your children in private schools was due to bilingual education. Thus, "oh the immigrants". That's the only logical conclusion one can reach.

Yes, putting my child in private school is my choice. I find it distrubing that a school I'm already paying for has been removed as an option. I would find it even more disturbing to have my toddler come home and greet me with "Hola, Papa! ¿Cómo estás?" I'm thankful that I can do what I am to solve the problem in our case and feel for those who cannot, and must deal with the consequnces of our government failing to enforce our immigration policy either at the border or within society.

As for your educational background, what does that have to do with the discussion? Were your parents criminal invaders? If not, your citing your situation is irrelevant. Shall I bring up where I went to school? Would that make my case stronger here? I don't think so.

You stated that it affected you since you has "no option" but to send your children to private school. The implication being that public school would somehow have ruined your children educationally speaking. So, it is relevant since it's a counter to your point. It's not really a challenging concept to understand (point, counter point).

"I went to public school and turned out fine."

That's open to debate but I'll try to stick to the current topic.

Not really open to debate. Again, your maturity is showing.

My complaint lies not with the money I spend on private tuition as I could choose to do that in any case. The complaint lies with spending my hard earned tax dollars to provide for the children of criminal aliens who are brought here and dumped into our social support systems while those same parents are contributing nothing to our society in proportion to what they take out. I don't want them sheltered, fed, educated, nor provided with medical care on my tax dollars.

So why did you bring it up? The only logical inference that a person can make when you state you had "no option" but to send your children to private is school is that is a complaint you have. I get it. Your main complaint is that you have to pay taxes. Well, so do I. We all do. Get used to it. Taxes are needed to ensure services are met for everyone.

I'd rather our elected representatives enforce existing laws. I'd rather the borders be secure. And yes, I'd rather not educate the children of criminal illegal aliens. Barring all that, I'd rather send them back across the border as expeditiously as possible, whether that is in a shipping container, a bus, or through the desert from whence they came.

I'd rather not be in a bigger deficit. I'd rather not be a gleaming failure of a society. I'd rather make sure that our down trodden are taken of.



1) They sure redesigned their plans once they become aware that there is a teat in America to suckle at.
2) Life is about probablilities.
3) Everything has it's costs. Again, what does your educational debt have to do with this? Shall I talk about my student loans? (Grad school sure is expensive and I went to one of the costliest school in the nation. It's paying off.)
4) No, I don't want to be appeased. I just want them gone with no welfare system in place here to lure them back.

1). We all suckle. Hell, your generation is going to get S.S. benefits because they helped float along for another few years.
2). Stupid platitude.
3). Ummm...except that right now tuition is rising faster than ever before. Education shouldn't cost this much. People saying "everything has it's cost" contributed to over-speculation of the housing market.
4). So you want to be appeased.


Many of us pay taxes. And the burden is proportionately higher the more you make. The story about your parents is beautiful, and you tell it so well. But what the hell does it have to do with this? Do you want to whip out W2s or arm wrestle dollar-for-dollar?

If you complain about paying taxes and imply MOST have your same sentiment concerning illegal immigrants and taxation, this is a counter point. You do understand the concept of a counter point, right?


Does reading the Socialist Bible keep you up at night? If you want to aid those less fortunate, then spend your money to do so. Do not spend mine.

The Socialist Bible? I'm not talking about economic policy here. Please stay on topic. Oh, and if you tried to be clever...again learn the proper definitions.

Au contraire. I think I exemplify that which made America great and made it a place where the standard of living is so high that people worldwide are drawn to it. You don't advocate fixing problems, you advocate magnifying problems by giving my money to criminal underachievers and creating a welfare state in which tax dollars are used to reward criminal behavior. You are right in that I choose to pay private school tuition, no argument there. I wish I didn't feel the need to and know many who do not have the choice that I do. Many children of real US citizens are denied a good education in our public school system due to the pressures of having to educate and provide for the needs of illegals and anchor babies.

No you don't. And I do advocate in funding those that need it most. Focusing on education would help American citizens as well. If you fail to realize that "more money" would help Americans as well...that's astounding.

Lack of compassion? Boo-Hoo-Hoo! Spend your charity dollars on whom you wish to, but do not spend mine.

All I hear is the rabble of a person who clings to a flag and has mental blinders. Not a person who loves said flag and realizes innovation will help our nation.
It's 2 am.
 
Old 09-02-2009, 04:10 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 3,562,469 times
Reputation: 783
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
Illegal alien students have already had access to 12 years of education, I feel no obligation to provide them with more.
We have been over this many, many times. Their parents placed them in this situation. I did not place them in this situation. My neighbor across the street did not place them in this situation. Their parents brought them to the US knowing full well that what they were doing was illegal. The concept of acting like an adult and accepting responsibility for one's behavior seem to be foreign to many illegal alien parents. Nonetheless, the fact of the matter is that they have no one to blame except themselves for their illegal children's situation and no amount of finger pointing can change that.





So what? 80% of them are from the south. The ones who are from other areas of the world should be returned to their respective homelands.



Oh yes! We are soooooo dehumanizing! They attend our schools for free, get free interpreters and lawyers whenever needed, they can walk into any ER and get thousands of dollars worth of care for which they will never pay a dime, they have activists and ethnic advocacy groups constantly on the prowl to make sure their 'rights' are not infringed upon and anytime things do not go their way all they need do is shout 'racism!' and more often than not they will get what they want. Give me a break!




They can get a college education in their own country and serve as a role model there.



They can contribute to the communities in the country that they are from. (hint; it's not the US)



They can help in inner city and poor rural areas in their own countries.



They can serve to inspire those to pursue their dreams in their own country instead of heading to El Norte to feast at the trough of the Blue Eyed Devils.



It's not wasted money.




Who are you to decide what should be an acceptable school environment for someone else's child?



I am not going to do anything that
a) encourages the ones we have to stay and
b) encourages even more to sneak in.




Why not? For once in their lives, why shouldn't they do something the legal way? You know, the way everybody else is expected to apply for student visas, etc.?



Good for you.




When ever someone commits a crime or breaks a law, they are taking a chance. They might get away with it or they might not. When illegal madre and padre packed up the kids and headed for the US, they took a chance. I suspect alot of them believed that another amnesty was right around the corner, all they had to do was hang out for a few years. However they years have gone by and there has not been another massive shamnesty. Their tactic now is to use their kids as the reason why they must be allowed to stay. Let's say we do grant the DREAMboats their wish and give them citizenship.......................

What is the very first thing the citizens Dreamies are going to do as soon as they can, that1guy?

Answer: They are going to sponsor illegal madre and padre for citizenship. This exactly what madre and padre have been counting on! They will be very well rewarded for breaking the law. And they in turn can sponsor additional illiterate, unskilled family members. If we gain one DREAMie with at least two years of post HS schooling but also get 5 family members who are never going to carry their own weight, to me that is not a very good deal.
One word only...paranoia.
 
Old 09-02-2009, 12:03 PM
 
3,712 posts, read 4,153,091 times
Reputation: 1274
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
One word only...paranoia.
You deny that the amnestied DREAMies will sponsor madre and padre for citizenship?
 
Old 09-02-2009, 12:42 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 3,562,469 times
Reputation: 783
Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
You deny that the amnestied DREAMies will sponsor madre and padre for citizenship?
So what?
 
Old 09-02-2009, 01:19 PM
 
Location: Pa
20,291 posts, read 11,485,808 times
Reputation: 6426
Well that post was reworked wasn't it.
No its not a punishment, it is the consequences of the parents actions.
If my father robbed a bank and used the money to buy a nice house, we would not be allowed to keep the house when he was caught.
Are we being punished? No
We owe these Illegal (Aliens) nothing. However we do owe legal citizens what our constitution promises.
We can not afford the Dream act. Not when we are borrowing from China to pay our bills.
Yes it is sad when a child is impacted by their parents bad decision. The anger should be directed at said parents.

I have watched my school taxes jump and in part due to having to supply english to spanish translators. For students that should not be here in the first place.
The children of people who are not paying school taxes or contributing to the system.
So no I do not agree that we are punishing anyone. Nor do I think that we owe them a free pass.
To many american kids are missing opprotunities and have no such free pass waiting for them.
Take care of our own first and always.
 
Old 09-02-2009, 01:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
So what?
Madre and padre are then REWARDED with citizenship for having broken our immigration laws.
 
Old 09-02-2009, 01:24 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
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Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
Madre and padre are then REWARDED with citizenship for having broken our immigration laws.


(and I agree with your premise).
 
Old 09-02-2009, 02:08 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andreabeth View Post
Madre and padre are then REWARDED with citizenship for having broken our immigration laws.
Again...so what? As long as their children are supporting them, it really doesn't matter. If they are sponsored by the children, I feel that is a very different situation than when they originally came here. If their children do become successful, then most likely the children will aid their parents, thus not being a drain on the system.
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