can someone support legal immigration but oppose illegal immigration? (unemployment, American, USA)
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Part of what is now the US was part of Mexico. That's history, nothing more. I'm gonna bet if Spain defeated the rebels in 1820 that probably a few years later Spain would've sold what is now Mexico to the US. Either way; we'd be owning that land.
Bear in mind I was merely pointing out a blatantly inaccurate statement. Nothing more. In fact, all of the territory ceded, sold or taken by force by the USA from Mexico is vastly better off for it. Mexico is a mess the people of Mexico would probably have been better off if we'd annexed the whole of Mexico. But OldGlory was wrong when he said that almost none of the USA was ever part of Mexico. He was wrong when he said we've never invaded them.
Bear in mind I was merely pointing out a blatantly inaccurate statement. Nothing more. In fact, all of the territory ceded, sold or taken by force by the USA from Mexico is vastly better off for it. Mexico is a mess the people of Mexico would probably have been better off if we'd annexed the whole of Mexico. But OldGlory was wrong when he said that almost none of the USA was ever part of Mexico. He was wrong when he said we've never invaded them.
Agreed tho with the nasty racism back in 1848 I think that most Mexicans would've been put on reservations with the few "white" ones becoming part of the anglo white world.
I support LEGAL immigration although IMO it should be cutback/controlled. I certainly oppose illegal immigration. The U.S. wouldn't have an illegal immigration issue if laws were enforced and businesses wouldn't hire illegals. Many people like to point fingers at the border but seldom point fingers at the source of the problem: THOSE THAT HIRE THEM. Without these jobs for illegals they do not come. PERIOD. We already have a pathway to citizenship in place. It's called LEGAL IMMIGRATION. Also, automatic citizenship needs to be stopped in our country and how about all of the people that get a student visa or other type of temporary visa and over-stay their time here permanently? Perhaps a very expensive deposit should be collected before granting such visas? Who cares if people's feelings get hurt. Our country and citizens should come first every single time.
I support LEGAL immigration although IMO it should be cutback/controlled. I certainly oppose illegal immigration. The U.S. wouldn't have an illegal immigration issue if laws were enforced and businesses wouldn't hire illegals. Many people like to point fingers at the border but seldom point fingers at the source of the problem: THOSE THAT HIRE THEM. Without these jobs for illegals they do not come. PERIOD. We already have a pathway to citizenship in place. It's called LEGAL IMMIGRATION. Also, automatic citizenship needs to be stopped in our country and how about all of the people that get a student visa or other type of temporary visa and over-stay their time here permanently? Perhaps a very expensive deposit should be collected before granting such visas? Who cares if people's feelings get hurt. Our country and citizens should come first every single time.
-Cheers.
I'll have to disagree with you here somewhat. It is not "seldom" that the fingers get pointed at the employers who hire illegal aliens. It gets brought all the time by we anti-illegal immigrationists. What seldom happens is the pro-illegals blaming the illegals themselves. We blame both.
I agree that birthright citizenship needs to be addressed as it isn't only jobs that bring them here. We provide an education to illegal aliens also and that needs to stop among other things like healthcare that they never pay for. Through their U.S. born kids they are able to tap into our welfare coffers. Removing the job magnet is not a solution on its own. However, it is one of the top three.
I support LEGAL immigration although IMO it should be cutback/controlled. I certainly oppose illegal immigration. The U.S. wouldn't have an illegal immigration issue if laws were enforced and businesses wouldn't hire illegals. Many people like to point fingers at the border but seldom point fingers at the source of the problem: THOSE THAT HIRE THEM. Without these jobs for illegals they do not come. PERIOD. We already have a pathway to citizenship in place. It's called LEGAL IMMIGRATION. Also, automatic citizenship needs to be stopped in our country and how about all of the people that get a student visa or other type of temporary visa and over-stay their time here permanently? Perhaps a very expensive deposit should be collected before granting such visas? Who cares if people's feelings get hurt. Our country and citizens should come first every single time.
-Cheers.
But you fail to consider that the MAIN REASON people come here "illegally" is because it's almost impossible to come here "legally". Go read the "legal immigration" forum some time. People post that it would take "10-18 years" to complete legal immigration. That is ridiculous.
And, in cases like that, it is easy to see why you would opt to "sneak in" instead of "follow the process".
I "immigrated" from Michigan to Maine recently. Guess what I had to do in order to make such a move? I had to sign a lease, switch utilities into my name, and then go to the Secretary of State office with my "proof of residence" (the utility bills) and change my driver's license. I'm now a "citizen of Maine".
That's all it should take for ANYONE to move ANYWHERE.
If you supported legal immigration that meant "all you have to do is secure a home in a new location and then change your citizenship" then your argument would make sense, since there would be no reason for anyone to immigrate illegally. But supporting the current system is ridiculous. It's way too hard for people to get citizenship, and therefore, there is no reason to expect them to acquiesce to such ridiculous demands.
It's like if you posted a speed limit of 30 mph on a 4 lane highway and then got mad because almost everyone was driving 70. Well no ****, that's what happens when you make up laws that people think are ridiculous - they break them.
can someone support legal immigration but oppose illegal immigration?
Of course!
It just means you want legal, law abiding people,
entering your (OUR) country.
Do I want a crook living next door, or a law-abiding
citizen? Someone who committed a crime the first
nano-second he entered my country, or someone
who jumped through hoops, obeyed the rules and
laws to enter my country with honor?
I'll go with the guy who worked hard, kept his nose
clean, and proved he could come here and be a up-
standing member of my community.
But you fail to consider that the MAIN REASON people come here "illegally" is because it's almost impossible to come here "legally". Go read the "legal immigration" forum some time. People post that it would take "10-18 years" to complete legal immigration. That is ridiculous.
And, in cases like that, it is easy to see why you would opt to "sneak in" instead of "follow the process".
I "immigrated" from Michigan to Maine recently. Guess what I had to do in order to make such a move? I had to sign a lease, switch utilities into my name, and then go to the Secretary of State office with my "proof of residence" (the utility bills) and change my driver's license. I'm now a "citizen of Maine".
That's all it should take for ANYONE to move ANYWHERE.
If you supported legal immigration that meant "all you have to do is secure a home in a new location and then change your citizenship" then your argument would make sense, since there would be no reason for anyone to immigrate illegally. But supporting the current system is ridiculous. It's way too hard for people to get citizenship, and therefore, there is no reason to expect them to acquiesce to such ridiculous demands.
It's like if you posted a speed limit of 30 mph on a 4 lane highway and then got mad because almost everyone was driving 70. Well no ****, that's what happens when you make up laws that people think are ridiculous - they break them.
You just listed a bunch of reasons why the laws need to be harder on illegal aliens. NO 1 has the "right" to go to another country illegally, the US is no different. Sheesh!
Unfettered illegal immigration just because one can't come legally is still inexcusable. We have quotas for legal immigration and for good reasons. By coming here illegally one negates that sane policy which protects jobs and resources for Americans and keeps population growth in check.
Our policies and quotas are based on the best interests of Americans not foreigners and rightly so! Our immigration laws based on all of the above are not ridiculous. It is sane policy for the citizens of this country. If we had a "come one come all" policy we would have all of the 2 billion impoverished across the world coming here. How in the world would we be able to accommodate that many people and without it negatively impacting our own citizens? It would be like killing the goose that laid the golden egg and committing national suicide. Then where would all these people flee to after destroying our nation for our own citizens?
Unfettered illegal immigration just because one can't come legally is still inexcusable. We have quotas for legal immigration and for good reasons. By coming here illegally one negates that sane policy which protects jobs and resources for Americans and keeps population growth in check.
Our policies and quotas are based on the best interests of Americans not foreigners and rightly so! Our immigration laws based on all of the above are not ridiculous. It is sane policy for the citizens of this country.
Someone who moves here BECOMES American. So how exactly are you "protecting jobs"? Who are you protecting them from? Other Americans! lol
This kind of thinking shows that you have put absolutely no thought into your position.
I'll use myself as an example again - I just "immigrated" to Maine from Michigan. I was hired by a local company in Maine, therefore I "stole" a job that a "Mainer" could have had. However, I have more skills, experience, and am simply better at this kind of work than anyone who was already living in Maine, so it was good for the company who hired me - they get a better worker than they would have gotten if they were forced to only hire Mainers.
Also, not to mention, I AM a Mainer now. I pay local taxes, I shop at local businesses, etc. So how exactly did Maine suffer from having a Michigander come in and "steal a job"? It didn't, it gained a skilled worker at Michigan's expense.
This is the same situation as you are painting. You think a "Mexican" will come in and steal a "Texan" job, but you fail to realize that as soon as the Mexican settles in, he BECOMES a Texan (and American), so how exactly was the job lost or stolen? All that happened was that the community GAINED a worker that Mexico lost.
So you don't want to "protect" jobs at all - you want to protect losers who aren't skilled enough to compete for jobs by trying to keep the competition away. That doesn't seem like a good policy to me...
Last edited by JoulesMSU; 08-26-2013 at 08:42 AM..
You just listed a bunch of reasons why the laws need to be harder on illegal aliens. NO 1 has the "right" to go to another country illegally, the US is no different. Sheesh!
This is where you are wrong. Everyone should have the RIGHT to live/work where ever they want.
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can someone support legal immigration but oppose illegal immigration?
