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Old 10-25-2009, 04:06 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,933 posts, read 30,188,716 times
Reputation: 17748

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ManGoneADreamin View Post
Your responses are hilarious, considering the fact that most of you lean politically to the right.


You say things like "illegals don't pay taxes".. Yet, that is a typical liberal response to something.


All of us of critical thinking and pro-freedom minds, know that taxes on income is one of the worst social ills that this country currently has. Because it implies that the government owns the fruits of your labor. They just allow you to keep a certain percentage. You all know that we had no income tax in this country until 1913 right?


How did the income tax start out ? Kind of like how universal health care is starting out today. They make lies about how much it will cost, and how the quality of the service will be. If people back then knew that the income tax would rise to about 20-30% for the average American, they would have not allowed it. And if they would have knew that our government was not on the gold standard of money and switched to a fiat system where they just printed it and racked up debt, they definitely would not of allowed their money to be given to a wasteful/lying/useless organization.

Thank goodness for the internet today. People can access information that just wasn't available back then. People see through the lies of the pro-UHC crowd. They know that the public option will end up covering illegals. They know that the public option leads to UHC , b.c the public option is subsidized with unlimited tax payer money causing their costs to actual users to be massively lower than to a private insurer who can't cheat the system legally.




So don't blame the OP (me).. The other generations created this problem of illegal immigration, with their "good" intentions...

If we didn't have the socialistic programs, then illegals would not be as much a problem. We need to phase out social security, phase out medicare (which makes all health care more expensive...), phase out the income tax (which will make government smaller, and stop all the unconstitutional things they are doing) ...



In closing, do I agree that Illegal Immigration is a problem today? Well, yes.... but it's only a problem because of the game we are forced to play today.

I believe you guys are trying to fix a broken branch, when in all reality, the whole tree is a SCAM to begin with. You're not going to fix this country's problems by trying to fix the symptoms... you can only fix it by fixing the disease that allows it to all happen.
It sounds like you are blaming the suppression of peasants by Countries like Mexico on the US? How is that possible? Our social service network was designed for the US citizens that pay into it not for some third World's illiterate and uneducated poor.
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Old 10-25-2009, 06:29 PM
 
432 posts, read 510,150 times
Reputation: 161
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
It sounds like you are blaming the suppression of peasants by Countries like Mexico on the US? How is that possible? Our social service network was designed for the US citizens that pay into it not for some third World's illiterate and uneducated poor.

Wow, I have no idea how you got that out of my post.

I was saying that AMERICANS are hurt by their own system they created through wealth redistribution, lack of individual rights, and regulation of private business.
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Old 10-26-2009, 12:22 AM
 
411 posts, read 403,062 times
Reputation: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManGoneADreamin View Post
Wow, I have no idea how you got that out of my post.

I was saying that AMERICANS are hurt by their own system they created through wealth redistribution, lack of individual rights, and regulation of private business.

I think you need to simplify your posts here so that other people can follow them, I've read them and they're great....
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Old 10-26-2009, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Portlandia "burbs"
10,236 posts, read 13,559,933 times
Reputation: 25856
I don't blame the illegals nearly as much as our government for diverting their eyes from the problem for the last 25 years! No politician, leader, or law-maker wanted to touch it with a 10' pole, so they chose to pretend that there "is no problem". And our current leader doesn't want to touch that pole, either.

Mangoneadreamin, I don't know how old you are, but I well remember when many of the jobs that the illegals partake of were given to the lesser-skilled Americans, or school kids. I was working as a waitress when high school kids, and the "less employable" were hired as dishwashers.

And it is NOT true that they take only the jobs that "we" don't want.

Landscaping USED to be fairly decent-paying jobs. Employers got greedy.

Construction USED to be very well-paying jobs. Again, employers got greedy.

I'll assume that restaurants have done the same. I was in San Francisco a few years ago when I walked by a Benihana, in Japantown, and noticed that the Asian chefs had been replaced with Hispanics. I'd bet that the pay wasn't the same.

There's another issue here, too, and that is JAIL SPACE! Don't believe me? If you live where there's a high percentage of illegals, trying probing into your local police blotters and mug-shots of recently arrested criminals, and you might find yourself very surprised.

As for healthcare. . . I won't even go there.
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Old 10-27-2009, 09:33 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,840,521 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesbabe View Post
I don't blame the illegals nearly as much as our government for diverting their eyes from the problem for the last 25 years! No politician, leader, or law-maker wanted to touch it with a 10' pole, so they chose to pretend that there "is no problem". And our current leader doesn't want to touch that pole, either.

Mangoneadreamin, I don't know how old you are, but I well remember when many of the jobs that the illegals partake of were given to the lesser-skilled Americans, or school kids. I was working as a waitress when high school kids, and the "less employable" were hired as dishwashers.

And it is NOT true that they take only the jobs that "we" don't want.

Landscaping USED to be fairly decent-paying jobs. Employers got greedy.

Construction USED to be very well-paying jobs. Again, employers got greedy.

I'll assume that restaurants have done the same. I was in San Francisco a few years ago when I walked by a Benihana, in Japantown, and noticed that the Asian chefs had been replaced with Hispanics. I'd bet that the pay wasn't the same.

There's another issue here, too, and that is JAIL SPACE! Don't believe me? If you live where there's a high percentage of illegals, trying probing into your local police blotters and mug-shots of recently arrested criminals, and you might find yourself very surprised.

As for healthcare. . . I won't even go there.
The absolute truth!
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Old 10-27-2009, 10:51 PM
 
Location: NC
10,005 posts, read 8,739,032 times
Reputation: 3062
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManGoneADreamin View Post
Do people really believe that there is a shortage of jobs because of illegal immigrants?


I believe that the laws on the books from American Legislatures is what creates a shortage of jobs.



If this was a free country, we would not need to worry about where people came from. But b.c we have so many laws that REGULATE (CONTROL) businesses here in America, and have so many laws that REGULATE (CONTROL) citizens of America, we have businesses going overseas where they can actually produce stuff without worrying about big brother.

But for some reason America has always wanted to become like Britain, ever since we departed from them.


Stop blaming poor Mexicans for what we created ourselves in DC and in the other capitals...



(the government wants you to blame Mexicans.... corporations.... CEO's....etc..../anything that gets your attention off the real cause of the problems)




Get rid of the laws that regulate and control and tax and tax businesses and employees. And we will have prosperity once again. Let people choose where they work, instead of shutting down businesses for having "unsafe work conditions" that the other 99% of the world could only dream of having available in their areas....




Blaming Illegals for trying to feed themselves and their families, is like blaming a wet homeless puppy in the rain for wagging it's tail.



And for those that say "they are ILLEGALS.. they broke the law.. send them back!!"...

- I say to you... How many laws have you broken in the last day? the last month? the last year? There are SO MANY LAWS in this country now, that 99.99% of the population breaks some law at least once every week... So please don't tell me or anyone in the younger generation to have respect for the law anymore, when anything and everything can and will be against the law soon enough at this pace.


You have 535 legislatures that couldn't recite 5 constitutional ammendments if you asked them. Yet you worry about poor Mexicans for breaking the law? When you have at least over 500 ignorant legislatures making the laws?


In closing, quit blaming the little guy just trying to get by....
Oh where to start...the shortage of jobs is the result of the massive deregulation that occurred from the 1980s onward. (The 1980s were also when "conservatives" tried with moderate success to relax immigration laws ie the 1986 amnesty.) The most notorious of which was the deregulation of the financial sector. This lead to a liquidity crisis and threw a wrench into small business's ability to borrow money and create jobs.

Secondly, Britain did much the same thing with de-regulation under the conservative government of Thatcher. In fact, initially conservatives supported going a step further along with what you want and supported the plan for the UK to join the EU in an attempt open their boarders to cheaper labor...Now they are flooded with Polish and other Eastern European legal immigrants on top of the many illegals coming from Africa and the Middle East. The labor market there is way over saturated and the only way they are able stay afloat is through their social safety nets and long, government mandated, vacation periods.

As to breaking the law many people do especially traffic and marijuana laws, but no one is calling for an "amnesty" on traffic tickets or saying that imprisoning marijuana users is a "crime against humanity". I will agree many laws are foolish, but at the same time if you do not like them you should work to change them. You should not, on the other hand, willfully flaunt them and claim you deserve special status for doing so. One of the central problems in America is that we are too soft on crime and illegal immigration is a glaring example of that.

Finally, as to our of our legislators, while I may or may not agree with them most of them are Attorneys and probably know a whole heck of a lot more about the constitution then you do. This especially seems to be the case considering the fact that you do not cite any Constitutional reasoning for your argument and I can assure you that in section 8 the congress clearly has the power create "a uniform rule of Naturalization" (Art. 1 Sec. 8 clause. 4). Illegal immigrants violate those naturalization rules and should be punished accordingly.

It is not so much about punishing the little guy as it is punishing anyone who breaks the law regardless of whether they are an illegal immigrant or Bernie Madoff. Illegal immigration is the poor man's version of white collar crime and like as such should be punished according to the relevant laws. If it is not punished it will just get out of control. Ignoring illegal immigration just because it doesn't seem like a problem to you is can only be construed as an invitation for millions of people to break the law and that is simply intolerable.

Last edited by Randomstudent; 10-27-2009 at 11:05 PM..
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Old 10-28-2009, 12:55 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,933 posts, read 30,188,716 times
Reputation: 17748
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManGoneADreamin View Post
Wow, I have no idea how you got that out of my post.

I was saying that AMERICANS are hurt by their own system they created through wealth redistribution, lack of individual rights, and regulation of private business.
what does wealth redistribution, lack of individual rights, and regulation of private business" in America have to do with Illegals sneaking into our Country taking "yer jerbs?"
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Old 10-28-2009, 03:03 PM
 
47 posts, read 97,004 times
Reputation: 41
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManGoneADreamin View Post
Do people really believe that there is a shortage of jobs because of illegal immigrants?

Quote:
Every job taking by an illegal is a jobs taking from an legal citizen. Jobs are not created for illegal aliens and 20 million illegal aliens are not picking lettuce, jobs americans will not do.

Stop blaming poor Mexicans for what we created ourselves in DC and in the other capitals...

Quote:
I agree. We if go after anyone it should be those who make the laws and do not enforce them. We could do something about illegal immigration if we went after the cause. Instead we vent our anger toward illegal aliens and anything that look Hispanic. I am one of the guilty ones.

Blaming Illegals for trying to feed themselves and their families, is like blaming a wet homeless puppy in the rain for wagging it's tail.

Quote:
No it's not. A wet homeles puppy, I would take in and he would not bit my butt.

In closing, quit blaming the little guy just trying to get by....
Quote:
This little illegal aliens should force his govenment to help him get by instead of going after our leaders demanding rights they do not have. If they fought as hard in Mexico as they do here instead of demanding siesta they could change things.
When the going gets rough the little one get going, back to Mexico by the thousands and leaving the homes they got loans for holding the bag and braking the banks that we had to bail out.
Kick that little homeless puppy's butt and send him on his way.
Take away the freebies and he will leave and take away the citizenship of ther amerian born children so they can't get any freebies.
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Old 10-28-2009, 10:27 PM
 
432 posts, read 510,150 times
Reputation: 161
you guys really need to think critically..

stop watching sean hannity and just repeating the opinions he has...


I'm saying there should be no freebies in the first place. There should be no federal income tax in this country (there wasn't till 1913) , there should be no prefrential laws for corporations , and there should be no regulation of businesses by the feds.. Do those things, and their will be surpluses and growth in this country that only one could dream of.


But I suppose you all want to keep following the status quo of regulating more, taxing more, and controlling other people's behaviors and lives?
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Old 10-29-2009, 01:34 AM
 
Location: Portlandia "burbs"
10,236 posts, read 13,559,933 times
Reputation: 25856
If "controlling other people's behaviors and lives" means taking control of our borders to cut back significantly on our government freebies, bring dignity back to our work force, start seaming up some of the healthcare that's been bursting open for years, and pare down on the crime and jail/prison space. . . then. . . what does this have to do with taxes (other than that many illegals don't pay into it at all)?

And I, personally, have never listened to Sean Hannity, and do not listen to talk radio at all. Ever. In fact, I've been bitching about lack of border controls, and predicting all the issues we have now for over 25 years when most people thought I was fulla' caca.
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