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Old 11-22-2009, 09:44 PM
 
411 posts, read 402,628 times
Reputation: 115

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Unless Latin King is pulling our collective legs here. Either he is an American or he may be a DREAMie.

Even with legal residency then going through the military to naturalize.........I believe it is 3 years. My dad went that route when he immigrated from Hungary (legally) in 1951; was drafted for the Korean War (kept stateside) then received his US citizenship in 1954.

Wow guys, I may be wrong, this was my understanding from when I went to "la migra", i will certainly seek the info, thanks for the input, anyway sooner or later I will become a citizen, I didn't go through the process before because I was too busy, but I love my adopted country, and will without a doubt go for citizenship....

 
Old 11-23-2009, 02:01 AM
 
2,381 posts, read 4,410,824 times
Reputation: 475
Quote:
Originally Posted by macmeal View Post
Agreed. If you live in a place (we'll call it 'back home' for the sake of fairness), and if life there is rough, tough, unfair, and harsh....and then you LEAVE, presumably you do so because you're going to a place (call it 'up here') that's BETTER than 'back home'. That's basic common sense. People migrate from 'bad' to 'better', instead of vice-versa.

After arriving in 'up here', if you then proceed to REJECT what you find here...the culture, the way of doing things, and the habits.....and if you persist in acting, thinking, relating, and living your life as though you were still 'back home'...and if you insist on congregating among huge numbers of like-minded people, all living like 'back home', and mistrusting 'up here'....guess what will happen? Give up? What will happen is that after awhile, "up here" will begin to resmemble "back home", and the problems you left behind will re-emerge here.

The reason 'up here' isn't like 'back home' is because our system here is different. We ignore that fact at our own peril. If you REALLY like things the way they were 'back home', perhaps the wise thing to do would be never to have left there. If you want to benefit by being 'up here', it would be prudent to begin integrating into the system up here.

No specific countries being mentioned here...just a general rule-of-thumb. Language, as such, isn't the main issue here. The main issue is assimilation. Can assimilation be done without learning the local language...and using it? I don't see how...not if you define 'assimilation' as I understand the term. Language is a big part of assimilation. There are other factors, too....but since almost ANY of these would provoke another argument, I'll leave it at 'language' for now.
I like your general assessment, no specific countries and over all a great point.

I will give you my point of view based on what I see in my community. Most illegal immigrants come here for a season, a couple of years, etc. They dont plan on staying because they know their status will not allow them to. The years go by and he or she starts forming a family, part of life right?

I think the fact that they are unstable does not allow them to feel confident in learning another language. Its that feeling of the unknown. They do not know if they will be leaving, deported or if they will end up staying here. If there was a path to legalization, I'm sure more people would want to learn the language. That does not mean that illegal immigrants do not know English because I know many of them do. Besides, if there is an amnesty, I'm sure not all 12 million people would pass an English test. Not all 12 million people would become legal and would have to deport.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 06:07 AM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,628,664 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
I like your general assessment, no specific countries and over all a great point.

I will give you my point of view based on what I see in my community. Most illegal immigrants come here for a season, a couple of years, etc. They dont plan on staying because they know their status will not allow them to. The years go by and he or she starts forming a family, part of life right?

I think the fact that they are unstable does not allow them to feel confident in learning another language. Its that feeling of the unknown. They do not know if they will be leaving, deported or if they will end up staying here. If there was a path to legalization, I'm sure more people would want to learn the language. That does not mean that illegal immigrants do not know English because I know many of them do. Besides, if there is an amnesty, I'm sure not all 12 million people would pass an English test. Not all 12 million people would become legal and would have to deport.
As for the 'starting a family' bit: that is no excuse to stay here in the USA. I lay the blame directly in said illegals for doing so hence they still needing to leave and taking their US born kids with them (unless the kids can be left with friends/relatives here legally).

The above refers to an illegal having a kid with a US citizen/green card holder only------------if both parents are illegals.......then the child needs to leave regardless. Cancel birthright citizenship for Anchor Babies born after a certain date.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 06:14 AM
 
47,576 posts, read 58,722,338 times
Reputation: 22158
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
The years go by and he or she starts forming a family, part of life right?
Sometimes that happens in just a few months. What of the illegals who have families back in the other country and a whole lot of them do because that's what remittances are all about, they're here to send money back to their families, wives and kids.

These people were part of families before arriving here so it's not a good argument that they CAN easily leave a family as long as that family is in the old country but they CAN NOT leave a family if it's here.

It comes down to love of money, the money is easier here which is why it was a simple matter to pack up and leave the family when it came to coming here. Many illegals living here don't bother seeing their kids back home for years at a time. Leaving them wasn't an issue.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 07:55 AM
 
Location: Houston
3,567 posts, read 3,821,634 times
Reputation: 931
Quote:
Originally Posted by Latin King View Post
I don't know what you are talking about, I came to the states in 1986, since then I have lived in Phoenix, where I established my business 2 years after I came, I became a legal resident just about 2 months ago, and will be obtaining citizenship next year, I don't know where you get the claim that I had said differently........

That's a bold lie. But that's nothing new, is it?

Btw, there won't be an amnesty next year, either.

Last edited by XodoX; 11-23-2009 at 08:04 AM..
 
Old 11-23-2009, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,816,809 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by zacatecana View Post
I like your general assessment, no specific countries and over all a great point.

I will give you my point of view based on what I see in my community. Most illegal immigrants come here for a season, a couple of years, etc. They dont plan on staying because they know their status will not allow them to. The years go by and he or she starts forming a family, part of life right?

I think the fact that they are unstable does not allow them to feel confident in learning another language. Its that feeling of the unknown. They do not know if they will be leaving, deported or if they will end up staying here. If there was a path to legalization, I'm sure more people would want to learn the language. That does not mean that illegal immigrants do not know English because I know many of them do. Besides, if there is an amnesty, I'm sure not all 12 million people would pass an English test. Not all 12 million people would become legal and would have to deport.
There is absolutely no excuse for people living in this country for 10, 15, or 20 years, and still not knowing a single word in English.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 02:18 PM
 
Location: Cali
3,886 posts, read 5,996,235 times
Reputation: 2200
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
There is absolutely no excuse for people living in this country for 10, 15, or 20 years, and still not knowing a single word in English.
Agree! I mean if people in poor nation in Africa and Asia can learn English certainly everyone can.
 
Old 11-23-2009, 04:45 PM
 
Location: So. of Rosarito, Baja, Mexico
6,571 posts, read 17,958,369 times
Reputation: 5919
Your right Bear up to a point.

I had a green card (1948) and was in Korea in 1952. After Ike became President he signed a bill that all Green card holders who served during Korea were exempt from the 5 yr waiting period. The catch was that there was a time limit and by the time I had heard about the BILL I was too late to qualify. A woman at the LA Immigration office told me that I'd have to stand in line like everyone else even tho I had been in North Korea on the front lines.

Being still young I was offended by her remark and did not apply untill yrs later. On my interview the male person asked about my delay filing and I responded about the woman and her comment. He said that NOT all Americans were that rude and she may of had a bad day (your guess is as good as mine).

Water under the bridge...still I think that many illegals are given a bad bunch of goods by their own.

Steve
 
Old 11-23-2009, 06:42 PM
 
411 posts, read 402,628 times
Reputation: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by XodoX View Post
That's a bold lie. But that's nothing new, is it?

Btw, there won't be an amnesty next year, either.

I have always been a good citizen, have assisted people of all races, and hate no groups of people, I legalized my status because my US Citizen children were adamant about it, and I feel good I did, however becoming legalized has not made me a different person whatsoever, I love the usa...
 
Old 11-23-2009, 06:47 PM
 
3,448 posts, read 2,581,721 times
Reputation: 478
People who vacation or go abroad for buisness often find themselves in restraunts
taxi's ect ect. Is that not right ?
Is it also not correct, that most travelors speak as much of the foriegn language as they can and often bring french-eng dictionary or whatever ?
My point is there is a "difference in culture to the degree of resonable manners"
We are programed to be thoughtful and considerate , for the most part.
Illegal immigrants have shown us through refusal to ajust and fit in re language and a host of other equally workable conformitys that there "manners" simply are not the same. Are we going to say ok no problem ? At least see, that the issue of
expected consideration and good manners is culturely different. My opinion is that
a general survival disposition together with who knows what life experience's unfolds a charactor much different than the average. For this reason the only way immigration would work is on a very slow basis to encourage integration and conformity. Now its a mess of "gimmee gimmee" all you can do is bus em back
This buisness of.....trying to convince Illegal immigrants their better off going home is basically bazaar. Language is important and the immigrants believe Spanish "will"
be the Southern States Official language. They believe that. They believe the residence will have enough of it and leave. No way you say.....oh ok
Thats why all the for sale signs....They've moved in....wake up or call greyhound !
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