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Old 11-12-2009, 09:56 AM
NCN
 
Location: NC/SC Border Patrol
21,136 posts, read 21,125,167 times
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Illegal is illegal. Who cares where they are from. Send them packing.

 
Old 11-12-2009, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,809,199 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Proof? In the long run, it's cheaper to provide education than to deny education. Also much of this due to lack of funding and support available to this population.

The bold is again a "great" generalization that shows a lack of knowledge and understanding of different cultures in general. It, ironically, is a coupled with responses to which you oppose illegal immigrants in college.

If they are here, they need an education. It saves MORE money in the long run.
Címon, their dropout and teen pregnancy rates are well-documented. How many of their parents have more than a 5th grade education?
 
Old 11-12-2009, 12:01 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17688
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Your position, not you personally.

Plus, what increase in crime? This is what I don't understand...crime has decreased during the highest extent of illegal immigration. It's only now (with illegal immigration waning) that crime has slightly increased. Economics play a bigger role in crime.

Tax payer funds would be less drained if money spent on defense would go towards education and educating illegal immigrants. ESL is a good program that allows families who do not have tons of money to have their children learn English. NCLB is completely a different topic from ESL.

I know your posts. Typically it focuses on the short term, without considering long term consequences.
The part you keep failing to address IS the long term. If we could stop illegal immigration in it's tracks over night then sure, we'd only have about 2 generations of our social services getting plundered by the current bunch but it's a ROLLING BLOCK of them. It never ends. We are throwing money after money and it takes them way too long to assimilate and get off of tax payer funded programs if they ever do. The larger the number the worse it becomes.

The money is best spent finding, deporting and building better defenses against a second onslaught by the deported ones.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 12:13 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,076,921 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Címon, their dropout and teen pregnancy rates are well-documented. How many of their parents have more than a 5th grade education?
Do you think that this is cultural? Because it's not. Teen pregnancy rates and dropout rates are seen in higher rates in W. Virginia than say Mass. The difference is economics and support, not culture.

My mom has less than a 5th grade education. She speaks 4 languages (English fluently). She values education A LOT. This was due to a lack of resources rather than a lack of will.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 12:19 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,076,921 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
The part you keep failing to address IS the long term. If we could stop illegal immigration in it's tracks over night then sure, we'd only have about 2 generations of our social services getting plundered by the current bunch but it's a ROLLING BLOCK of them. It never ends. We are throwing money after money and it takes them way too long to assimilate and get off of tax payer funded programs if they ever do. The larger the number the worse it becomes.

The money is best spent finding, deporting and building better defenses against a second onslaught by the deported ones.
Actually, YOU don't address the long term. Money is not best spent finding and deporting. This would be the largest waste of money in the nation's history. Please tell me that you aren't in any form of politics, run a business, or a CPA. If you are good luck riding out this recession (you DEF. will need it).

How do you propose we stop illegal immigration its tracks? A HUGE percentage come and overstay visas. Are we going to track EVERY visitor to the US? What about the nearly two thousand mile long border? What about oceans? What about tunnels?

As for assimilation, they ARE assimilating. You simply don't like the fact that Spanish is spoken in public (or any other language). However, most can speak English.

Social Security is currently partially being propped up by illegal immigrants.

Like it seems as if you think that granting power to the military will solve the problem cheaply. We know that to be false.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 01:21 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,146,155 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
That's actually not true. In fact, most arguments from your position state that the biggest reason why people dislike illegal immigration is the increased use of Spanish...The implication being that illegal immigration automatically assumes Hispanic descent.
Baloney! There have been a lot of reasons given why we oppose illegal immigration and they are mostly about our laws and the negative impact they have on our communties economically. Spanish only gets mentioned because most illegals are Spanish speakers and hearing it all the time reminds us just how many there are here illegally from Spanish speaking countries. Kind of like pouring salt into an already open wound. Compound that with employment ads demanding Spanish as a qualification to fill a job and all the ads and catering in Spanish (press 2 for Spanish), etc. are the constant reminders of that ethnic group comprising the majority of illegal aliens in our midst, that's all.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 01:38 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,076,921 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Baloney! There have been a lot of reasons given why we oppose illegal immigration and they are mostly about our laws and the negative impact they have on our communties economically. Spanish only gets mentioned because most illegals are Spanish speakers and hearing it all the time reminds us just how many there are here illegally from Spanish speaking countries. Kind of like pouring salt into an already open wound. Compound that with employment ads demanding Spanish as a qualification to fill a job and all the ads and catering in Spanish (press 2 for Spanish), etc. are the constant reminders of that ethnic group comprising the majority of illegal aliens in our midst, that's all.
You just proved my point. Most illegal immigrants live in enclaves with other illegal immigrants. Considering that the majority of posters are middle class, there is a HUGE chance that your individual community has been at the very most slightly impacted.

If the majority of illegal immigrants were English speaking Canadians, I think that many would not be as upset. Again the whole in group/out group model.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 01:47 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,146,155 times
Reputation: 2130
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
You just proved my point. Most illegal immigrants live in enclaves with other illegal immigrants. Considering that the majority of posters are middle class, there is a HUGE chance that your individual community has been at the very most slightly impacted.

If the majority of illegal immigrants were English speaking Canadians, I think that many would not be as upset. Again the whole in group/out group model.
Proved what point? I disproved your claim that the basics of our objection to illegal immigration is the Spanish language and that simply isn't true! Let me repeat it to you once again. We object to illegal immigration from anywhere because it is against our laws and illegal immigration is impacting our nation negatively. The language usage of the illegal is way down on the scale of our objections to it. Language wouldn't even get a mention if not for the overwhelming number of illegals from one ethnic group that speak a certain language. I smell the stench of the race card again.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 02:16 PM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,076,921 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by chicagonut View Post
Proved what point? I disproved your claim that the basics of our objection to illegal immigration is the Spanish language and that simply isn't true! Let me repeat it to you once again. We object to illegal immigration from anywhere because it is against our laws and illegal immigration is impacting our nation negatively. The language usage of the illegal is way down on the scale of our objections to it. Language wouldn't even get a mention if not for the overwhelming number of illegals from one ethnic group that speak a certain language. I smell the stench of the race card again.
I never mentioned race. You stated all these objections to Spanish. AngryTax dude posts his hatred of ESL. You post and repost how assimilation is not happening.

If they were English speaking Canadians, many would not object as much. Richer country, English speakers...that's all my point.
 
Old 11-12-2009, 02:59 PM
 
Location: San Diego
32,799 posts, read 30,034,103 times
Reputation: 17688
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Actually, YOU don't address the long term. Money is not best spent finding and deporting. This would be the largest waste of money in the nation's history. Please tell me that you aren't in any form of politics, run a business, or a CPA. If you are good luck riding out this recession (you DEF. will need it).

How do you propose we stop illegal immigration its tracks? A HUGE percentage come and overstay visas. Are we going to track EVERY visitor to the US? What about the nearly two thousand mile long border? What about oceans? What about tunnels?

As for assimilation, they ARE assimilating. You simply don't like the fact that Spanish is spoken in public (or any other language). However, most can speak English.

Social Security is currently partially being propped up by illegal immigrants.

Like it seems as if you think that granting power to the military will solve the problem cheaply. We know that to be false.
Please, how many Illegal relatives do you have here. You don't stop stray cats from feeding in your back yard by leaving out food.

We can roll out all the numbers over and over again but Illegals Aliens cost the US tax payers BILLIONS each year.
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