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Old 02-01-2010, 01:06 PM
 
Location: central Oregon
1,856 posts, read 2,025,067 times
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[quote=organick;12704025]
Quote:
Originally Posted by tulani View Post
I looked up "probable cause" and what I'm reading seems to be different from what you are saying above.
I think skin color, hair length, clothes, car, ect. fit into the 'observation' category.
*********

Most probable cause sources can be placed into four categories. These categories are:
  • Observation This is information that the officer obtains through their senses, such as sight, smell or hearing. This category is also used when an officer detects a familiar pattern of criminal activity that contains suspicious behaviors (i.e., flashing headlights, circling around a certain neighborhood.)
quote]


Yeah observation of criminal activity. Skin, hair etc are not criminal behavior. I have first hand experience with the situation. Those things will be thrown out of court in 5 minutes


DUH! No kidding! I never said skin, hair, ect were criminal behaviors. I SAID that they are things OBSERVED by the police and used as tools to help them catch the bad guys. If they are looking for someone who is white with red hair and he was last seen wearing a blue and white striped shirt when he took off then they are going to be looking at every white man with red hair who is wearing a blue and white striped shirt. All those stopped are not going to be the guilty party, but it's one way of going after the one they want.
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Old 02-01-2010, 02:58 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,345,853 times
Reputation: 262
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Being profiled (if done politely) does not violate my rights. I have nothing to hide so what is the problem?

you keep saying the same thing. Why? Being profiled does violate rights If I was a black guy driving a mercedes in a drug infested neighborhood not doing anything else and got pulled over that is racial profiling and ILLEGAL. It would not stand in court for 2 minutes. You obviously don't get the idea that simply not having anything to hide does not mean you give up rights. Rights are to protect innocent people.
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Old 02-01-2010, 03:01 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,345,853 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1AngryTaxPayer View Post
I think that lil ol lady that was stuffed in the trunk of that car (on CNN now) would beg to differ with you. It was a random stop that saved her skin.

yes so lets resort to just randomly stopping law abiding citizens in hope of discovering random crime. That is great use of police time
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Old 02-01-2010, 03:07 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,345,853 times
Reputation: 262
[quote=tulani;12709099]
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post


DUH! No kidding! I never said skin, hair, ect were criminal behaviors. I SAID that they are things OBSERVED by the police and used as tools to help them catch the bad guys. If they are looking for someone who is white with red hair and he was last seen wearing a blue and white striped shirt when he took off then they are going to be looking at every white man with red hair who is wearing a blue and white striped shirt. All those stopped are not going to be the guilty party, but it's one way of going after the one they want.


you entirely miss the point. You are giving a scenario with well defined parameters of who the police are looking for. Unlike the concept that all hispanics may be illegal so that is reason to stop them. I never said that if someone fits the exact description of a know criminal they could not be stopped. See we already have laws in place to stop criminals, laws against illegal immigration. Do they need to be enforced better? maybe. Does passing new laws to cover police racially profiling people to do so serve our country? NO Does it infringe upon rights of citizens? yes. Just like the 32 million americans who have already been victims of racial profiling by police. I have already linked several stories. Please read them and maybe you will understand the post more.
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Old 02-01-2010, 03:11 PM
 
Location: OCEAN BREEZES AND VIEWS SAN CLEMENTE
19,899 posts, read 15,285,252 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArizonaBear View Post
Say what you will: but; we are all going to be seeing more and more profiling of Latinos as the effort for boot the illegals out of the USA ramps up. And; quite frankly, I am looking forward to it. If a few non Hispanic illegal aliens get picked up as well---------that will be a bonus.

I agree with you. I think we will be seeing more profiling of latinos. But frankley i don't care where they come from, who ever is in the State illegally, we don't want you here. Go home.
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Old 02-01-2010, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 16,197,803 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
you keep saying the same thing. Why? Being profiled does violate rights If I was a black guy driving a mercedes in a drug infested neighborhood not doing anything else and got pulled over that is racial profiling and ILLEGAL. It would not stand in court for 2 minutes. You obviously don't get the idea that simply not having anything to hide does not mean you give up rights. Rights are to protect innocent people.
If you had nothing to hide, it wouldn't go to court.

It's not racial profiling, it's called "cooperating with the LE"


I suppose if the Law was called to a Meat Packing plant and it was found to be employed by
nothing but Illegal Immigrants and they were all arrested...you would consider that Profiling?....
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Old 02-01-2010, 04:27 PM
 
Location: South Bay Native
13,043 posts, read 21,154,444 times
Reputation: 22514
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
yep lets detain every hispanic and oriental person in the country till we clear it up......you also have no understanding of the definition of probable cause. Way to not know your own rights
How can anyone take your argument seriously when you refer to Asians as "orientals"? Or are we talking about rugs??
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Old 02-01-2010, 05:08 PM
 
Location: central Oregon
1,856 posts, read 2,025,067 times
Reputation: 2377
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
Racial Profiling Doesnt Work (http://www.lamberthconsulting.com/about-racial-profiling/racial-profiling-doesnt-work.asp - broken link)


look the rest up yourself. you can find it with a simple does racial profiling work google search
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
oh so there is no racial profiling with police. I see tell that to 30 million americans. I hope you have something better than this as your argument. Just because you have an opinion does not make it so....back up your point. But you can't

The Roots of Racial Profiling - Reason Magazine
Racial Profiling
Racial Profiling Statistics
[quote=organick;12710952]
Quote:
Originally Posted by tulani View Post



you entirely miss the point. You are giving a scenario with well defined parameters of who the police are looking for. Unlike the concept that all hispanics may be illegal so that is reason to stop them. I never said that if someone fits the exact description of a know criminal they could not be stopped. See we already have laws in place to stop criminals, laws against illegal immigration. Do they need to be enforced better? maybe. Does passing new laws to cover police racially profiling people to do so serve our country? NO Does it infringe upon rights of citizens? yes. Just like the 32 million americans who have already been victims of racial profiling by police. I have already linked several stories. Please read them and maybe you will understand the post more.
Ok, I went back and read your links.
You are absolutely correct, the police do racially profile people. Is it wrong? Yes. Does it infringe upon the rights of citizens? IF the only reason they are stopped is because of some racial bias, then yes it does.
From what I read the police will profile anyone from any group. I guess they think equal opportunity profiling works. Profiling is not always about race.
I have to agree with the others here that if I was racially profiled (for whatever reason) and I had nothing to hide, I would not mind being stopped and questioned.
I do not feel as if I am giving up my rights. I'm really sorry that other American's feel as if they do.
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Old 02-01-2010, 05:27 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,611,035 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by organick View Post
you keep saying the same thing. Why? Being profiled does violate rights If I was a black guy driving a mercedes in a drug infested neighborhood not doing anything else and got pulled over that is racial profiling and ILLEGAL. It would not stand in court for 2 minutes. You obviously don't get the idea that simply not having anything to hide does not mean you give up rights. Rights are to protect innocent people.
You say profiling violates my rights. It does not. If you feel 'violated' when LE contacts you...........that is not my problem.
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Old 02-01-2010, 09:42 PM
 
2,087 posts, read 1,345,853 times
Reputation: 262
Quote:
Originally Posted by california-jewel View Post
I agree with you. I think we will be seeing more profiling of latinos. But frankley i don't care where they come from, who ever is in the State illegally, we don't want you here. Go home.

Again ....already immigration laws. stop accepting rights violations.
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