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Old 02-03-2010, 04:36 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028

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Quote:
Originally Posted by the one View Post
its not that your info is more credible that mine or visa versa. we started discussing a specific time frame based on the original article. 2000-04. thats the "evidence" presented. once i flipped that on its head you want to use this other data?

and again. just because there is a supposed or alleged higher number of illegals coming, doesnt mean tha thats the reason the hispanic population is "soaring". the illegals still dont make up half of the hispanic pop increase.

the numbers dont lie.

and your articles are contradictory. one says 300k immigrant births per years. the other says 750K. which one is it? o right, the one that makes your point stick. whos the susps anyways?

oh and the data from the chron article is for immigrants. hispanics. with NO differentiation between legals and illegals. so you are ASSuming that the majority is based on illegals. thats not a good debate tactic.

your grasping here.
Unfortunately, we have no accurate data. We don’t even know “exactly” how many illegal aliens are here. Therefore, your guess (and sources) are as good as mine. For all we know, we might have 2 million babies being born to illegals per year. In any case, it is unacceptable.

 
Old 02-03-2010, 04:49 PM
 
Location: CITY OF ANGELS AND CONSTANT DANGER
5,409 posts, read 11,070,242 times
Reputation: 2244
yes, your are right, we dont have exact figures. i could get with that.
and i see why you feel its unacceptable to have ANY babies of illegals here. i just want to have the strongest arguments, for or against. its all an excercise. id rather debate this stuff than that ridiculous bogus info on those chain emails (joe illegal, 95% warrants in LA are for illegals, etc etc).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Unfortunately, we have no accurate data. We don’t even know “exactly” how many illegal aliens are here. Therefore, your guess (and sources) are as good as mine. For all we know, we might have 2 million babies being born to illegals per year. In any case, it is unacceptable.
 
Old 02-03-2010, 05:15 PM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by the one View Post
yes, your are right, we dont have exact figures. i could get with that.
and i see why you feel its unacceptable to have ANY babies of illegals here. i just want to have the strongest arguments, for or against. its all an excercise. id rather debate this stuff than that ridiculous bogus info on those chain emails (joe illegal, 95% warrants in LA are for illegals, etc etc).
I only know that many hospitals claim to have a very high percentage of illegal alien births, and they are costing the taxpayers billions. The actual number of births, and the total dollar amount, remains a mystery.
 
Old 02-03-2010, 05:43 PM
 
14,307 posts, read 11,149,569 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I only know that many hospitals claim to have a very high percentage of illegal alien births, and they are costing the taxpayers billions. The actual number of births, and the total dollar amount, remains a mystery.
One illegal alien birth on our soil is one too many.
 
Old 02-04-2010, 12:33 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,077,957 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
I only know that many hospitals claim to have a very high percentage of illegal alien births, and they are costing the taxpayers billions. The actual number of births, and the total dollar amount, remains a mystery.
Not too many due since we do know fairly certainly that less than 5% of the population (this comes from Pew Hispanic, CIS, the census, various univeristy studies) are illegal (the estimates range between 3% and 5% of the total population). Not to mention that some illegal immigrants have health insurance. In a nation with an uninsured population larger than its illegal immigrant population, it stands to reason that the true cost lies from uninsured Americans.
 
Old 02-04-2010, 09:43 AM
 
313 posts, read 295,172 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Not too many due since we do know fairly certainly that less than 5% of the population (this comes from Pew Hispanic, CIS, the census, various univeristy studies) are illegal (the estimates range between 3% and 5% of the total population). Not to mention that some illegal immigrants have health insurance. In a nation with an uninsured population larger than its illegal immigrant population, it stands to reason that the true cost lies from uninsured Americans.
Wow! That is something very crucial that I've never seen brought up in regard to illegal immigrants' impact on the health care system.
Great point.
 
Old 02-04-2010, 09:58 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arpayaso View Post
Wow! That is something very crucial that I've never seen brought up in regard to illegal immigrants' impact on the health care system.
Great point.
Then you haven’t read many posts on this forum. There are countless threads devoted to the negative impact of illegal immigration; and the astronomical costs associated with providing illegals with “free” medical care, and the resultant hospital and clinic closures, has been thoroughly discussed.

A group of ingrate illegals are even suing a hospital in Atlanta because the clinic can no longer afford to provide them with “free” kidney dialysis. Illegal aliens overwhelmed their system, so now the indigent citizens of Atlanta must suffer.

Illegal immigrants fight hospital's move that could end care -
 
Old 02-04-2010, 10:08 AM
 
3,536 posts, read 5,077,957 times
Reputation: 822
Quote:
Originally Posted by Benicar View Post
Then you haven’t read many posts on this forum. There are countless threads devoted to the negative impact of illegal immigration; and the astronomical costs associated with providing illegals with “free” medical care, and the resultant hospital and clinic closures, has been thoroughly discussed.

A group of ingrate illegals are even suing a hospital in Atlanta because the clinic can no longer afford to provide them with “free” kidney dialysis. Illegal aliens overwhelmed their system, so now the indigent citizens of Atlanta must suffer.

Illegal immigrants fight hospital's move that could end care -
Your treatment of the quotation isn't really correct. I think that the poster you quoted is saying that people don't often mention that the population of uninsured Americans is larger (by most estimates) than the illegal immigrant population. That if the unisured population is larger than the illegal immigrant population, then the cost is more from the unisured population of Americans, rather than illegal immigrants (some illegal immigrants have health insurance).
 
Old 02-04-2010, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Your treatment of the quotation isn't really correct. I think that the poster you quoted is saying that people don't often mention that the population of uninsured Americans is larger (by most estimates) than the illegal immigrant population. That if the unisured population is larger than the illegal immigrant population, then the cost is more from the unisured population of Americans, rather than illegal immigrants (some illegal immigrants have health insurance).
We don’t know how many illegal aliens are living in this country, so we certainly don’t know how many are uninsured. However, we do know they are a factor in our astronomical healthcare costs. Illegal aliens should not even be a factor in our total number of uninsured, since they have no right to be here.

They should not be included in the UHC bill, and they should not receive any tax-funded treatment other than for bona fide life-threatening emergency care. Once they are stabilized, they should be deported.
 
Old 02-04-2010, 10:59 AM
 
Location: Maryland
15,179 posts, read 15,813,362 times
Reputation: 3028
Quote:
Originally Posted by that1guy View Post
Not too many due since we do know fairly certainly that less than 5% of the population (this comes from Pew Hispanic, CIS, the census, various univeristy studies) are illegal (the estimates range between 3% and 5% of the total population). Not to mention that some illegal immigrants have health insurance. In a nation with an uninsured population larger than its illegal immigrant population, it stands to reason that the true cost lies from uninsured Americans.
Again, estimates. None of these, or any other source, has an accurate accounting of the total number of illegal aliens in this country. Prior to the 1986 amnesty, “sources” estimated our illegal alien population substantially lower than the actual number of applicants once amnesty was enacted. If I’m not mistaken, the “actual” number was almost 3 times the estimated figure.

In this context, the number of uninsured citizens is irrelevant. Illegal aliens are costing us billions. . . . billions we can certainly use.
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