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View Poll Results: What illegal immigration solution would make you happy?
Asset seizure, deport, and lifetime ban from re-entering 38 66.67%
Fine, deport, "punishment" wait period, then re-enter 5 8.77%
Deport, re-entry as processing allows. No violent criminals 11 19.30%
No deport, no fine, process while in US 1 1.75%
Total amnesty. Stroke of a pen makes everyone "legal" 2 3.51%
Voters: 57. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-18-2007, 06:59 PM
 
253 posts, read 937,379 times
Reputation: 265

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Quote:
Originally Posted by chele123 View Post
You can't compare immigrants with illegals; it's two different things. There is no problem with immigrants. There is a problem with illegal aliens.
Yes I agree. Does this info pertain to immigrants or illegal immigrants? If not the latter, then what's the point of bringing it up? The argument, at least ideally, that some are making isn't about just anyone of Mexican descent. It's about those who are illegal here regardless of where they are from. All Hispanics in the US are not illegal, that's pretty well known or at least it should be, so the argument should not say, "See Hispanics do pay taxes!" I am sure many do, since quite a few of various ethnicities are legal here for many generations.

For those without any racist personal agenda (because yes there are some here who do have that agenda)...our mindset is that if you are here illegally, then you have broken the law plain and simple and to try to integrate into this nation functioning as if you are legal with an illegal status is wrong.

No excuses, no explanations! Immigration is fine as long as the process of getting here is LEGAL. That is about as straight to the point as one can get.

There should be an immigration process enforced and respected. Why is that wrong?

With some of the opposing arguments that I hear, it almost sounds as if some are saying/implying that we should just have no enforcement at all and that anyone should be able to come over how and when they please without a legal process and be treated as full citizens...because of x, y or z reason. Further statements involve that this nation is a land of immigrants or descendants or immigrants, that some people have it bad in their native country and need a new nation to prosper in and that is why some should be exempt from following the law to obtain legal status. Is that what the argument is?

If that's the case, why should anyone follow the law here in the U.S.? Why should any of us carry and obtain licenses, SS cards, reference any birth certificates, file and pay taxes, fill out documents, present ID upon purchase or employment and so forth? Why should any other immigrant looking to come over legally follow the rules?
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:05 PM
 
Location: SW Kansas
1,787 posts, read 3,347,639 times
Reputation: 1401
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsymptoticFaery View Post
Yes I agree. Does this info pertain to immigrants or illegal immigrants? If not the latter, then what's the point of bringing it up? The argument, at least ideally, that some are making isn't about just anyone of Mexican descent. It's about those who are illegal here regardless of where they are from. All Hispanics in the US are not illegal, that's pretty well known or at least it should be, so the argument should not say, "See Hispanics do pay taxes!" I am sure many do, since quite a few of various ethnicities are legal here for many generations.

For those without any racist personal agenda (because yes there are some here who do have that agenda)...our mindset is that if you are here illegally, then you have broken the law plain and simple and to try to integrate into this nation functioning as if you are legal with an illegal status is wrong.

No excuses, no explanations! Immigration is fine as long as the process of getting here is LEGAL. That is about as straight to the point as one can get.

There should be an immigration process enforced and respected. Why is that wrong?

With some of the opposing arguments that I hear, it almost sounds as if some are saying/implying that we should just have no enforcement at all and that anyone should be able to come over how and when they please without a legal process and be treated as full citizens...because of x, y or z reason. Further statements involve that this nation is a land of immigrants or descendants or immigrants, that some people have it bad in their native country and need a new nation to prosper in and that is why some should be exempt from following the law to obtain legal status. Is that what the argument is?

If that's the case, why should anyone follow the law here in the U.S.? Why should any of us carry and obtain licenses, SS cards, reference any birth certificates, file and pay taxes, fill out documents, present ID upon purchase or employment and so forth? Why should any other immigrant looking to come over legally follow the rules?
I think you've nailed it!
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:15 PM
 
398 posts, read 1,265,632 times
Reputation: 239
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPR_USA View Post
In actuality, I have met AMERICANS that have done the same thing. Your point?

We all have done something Illegal once or twice. Your not perfect.

wait wait wait a second here...there are some misconceptions here about what immigration is. And everybody need to read this so we can stop with this cheap argument of "Some americans do the same"


Immigration is good for any country in the world. There is no doubt about it. We need to start from that base. At the same time, we need to understand that immigration for every country in the world, is a business. Like in any business, both parties win and are satisfied.

So how the immigration business work for a country.

- You have people willing to come here; good people, and bad people. People who dream to be Americans, people who want to come here to take advantage of this sytem.

- We have once in a while, lack of professionals to cover specific areas of our workforce. At the same time, we always need scientifics, engineers, teachers, doctors, etc., who in some way WILL REPLACE THOSE BAD QUALITY AMERICANS WHO COMMIT CRIMES.


So here's when the deal is closed for both parties. We give the opportunity to people to come here, we filter them, we let the good come here. They satisfy their need to come here, we satisfy our needs of professionals and great people who eventually will be mentors as citizens. That is the normal process of a functional immigration system.

Based on that, there is no justification at all for an immigrant to commit the same crimes Americans do. One, because he supposedly came here to be in a better society and be a better person, and second, because this country was not looking for bad people to come here. Since these criminals are illegal creatures, the moral implications of this issue are doubled. They are not only criminals, but scammers at the same time.

With our current immigration system, these people is satisfying their needs (coming here) and we are getting nothing in exchange; worst than that, we are being damaged as a nation with these horrible type of immigrants. In other words, we are doing the stupidest deal in the world. Or better said, not we, but our government.

Immigration is like any prescription medicine. Too little is ineffective, too much, could be lethal. And right now, we are swallowing a very lethal overdose of this medicine.
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:20 PM
 
398 posts, read 1,265,632 times
Reputation: 239
Quote:
Originally Posted by AsymptoticFaery View Post
Immigration is fine as long as the process of getting here is LEGAL. That is about as straight to the point as one can get.
I agree with you, but I think that we need to enforce at the same time that only the right people comes here legally. Those who will make our country bigger and stronger, and not those who will degrade our society and will just increase bad numbers in our census.
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:36 PM
 
398 posts, read 1,265,632 times
Reputation: 239
[quote=MrsPR_USA;908010]
Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglecall View Post
Ma'am, I respect you opinions but I think you have in your comments the seed of communism. First of all, we are not brothers and sisters; We are brothers and sisters if you think we are not then your seeds of communism.

we are two different countries created by a totally different perspective. Second, helping others by giving them food, is a mistake. You think helping other by giving them food is a mistake? Wow, thats sad, I am sorry you feel that way.

that's why there is now reason for mexicans to be poor, other than being lazy or mentaly disabled. So, your saying all Mexicans are lazy or mentaly dosabled...Hmmm, Dont think you have your facts right at all.

And last, unfortunatelly in this world you do not live with a "heart". That is secondary. In this world to succeed and lead a nation, you need reason, logic and critical thinking. I disagree with you, we do have to have a heart. Why do you think everyone wants to come to America. We are so caring..

Please don't use words in a different perspective that they were not designed for so we can have a clear discussion about the issue.

We are not brothers and sisters with mexicans. We come in a high percentage from very different and distant backgrounds. Now if you start arguing with the scientific theory that humans were born in Africa and from them all different races were created, that's a different topic, and has nothing to do with what we are talking now. If that was the case, the last name "Bush" has a jewish origin and not because of that means that the president is a jewish. That was too many generations ago.

About giving food to others, you feel sorry? ok I respect your opinion 100%, but that's why we are different and that's why we create different countries with different results. From different point of view. Again who is right and who is wrong? History again proves that with what each has created and/or achieved.

No, I am not saying that all mexicans are lazy or mentaly disabled, but the majority of them YES. The majority of a country chose their legislators and representatives, therefore, the majority of a population shape the destiny of its own country. Majority of bad people equals bad country, majority of good people equals good country. That is pure logic; true or false; 1 or 0.

There is probably only ne reason why you could actually need a "heart". And is something my dad tought me so many years ago. You need a heart to fulfill your dreams with passion. That passion will make you achieve those dreams. Dreams are useless in this life without never being realized. So the use of that "heart" is personal; and as long as a society, united lives and plan under the same way of thinking, will be powerful and prosper. That's why we have something called "The great American dream"

Using "heart" to level up others to your situation instead of showing them the right steps to success, is plain socialism/marxism.
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:39 PM
 
Location: deep in the south
233 posts, read 389,907 times
Reputation: 117
Default I did the payroll and had the proof

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPR_USA View Post
Of course you would say that, but do you have proof?
I know many Americans that do the same thing... So I guess we need to get rid of them as well. right?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++
Fortunately it was my job to keep track of hours and pay the staff where I worked but the owner refused to pay for any office supplies and such for me to keep track of things and such so I bought and kept books on my own, so yes I had plenty of proof of what went on while I worked there, seeing as I paid for the necessary supplies they belonged to me and left with me when I quit. Quite a few of that staff got a free ride home thanks to the generosity of our government.
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Old 06-18-2007, 07:43 PM
 
398 posts, read 1,265,632 times
Reputation: 239
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsPR_USA View Post
Of course you would say that, but do you have proof?
I know many Americans that do the same thing... So I guess we need to get rid of them as well. right?

The few money illegals can pay in taxes is insignificant and lost due to the high cost we pay maintaining anchor babies. Here is the proof, and I quote:

"The Urban Institute estimates that the cost of educating illegal alien children in the nationís seven states with the highest concentration of illegal aliens was $3.1 billion in 1993 (which, with the growth of their population to 1.3 million, would be more like $5 billion in 2000). This estimate does not take into account the additional costs of bilingual education or other special educational needs."

FAIR: : Anchor Babies: The Children of Illegal Aliens
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Old 06-19-2007, 01:08 PM
 
16,092 posts, read 35,792,258 times
Reputation: 6264
The majority of illegals here are paid in cash. Do you really think they are reporting this to the IRS or State? If a citizen were to hide such income the IRS would take away everything he/she has. So here's another law they break. One law falls then another, then another...and the poster above is right - why should we citizens pay our taxes, get driver's licenses, pay insurance, cross at the crosswalk, etc...

And speaking of money - how about the billions that are taken out of our economy and sent to Mexico and other countries? I personally think that money should be highly taxed if it is not going to benefit our economy.
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