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Old 10-23-2007, 06:14 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,708,575 times
Reputation: 350

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Quote:
the black slaves were running through the underground railroad b/c they were being whipped, hung, raped, and treated like property in the south. they didn't come to the north for "better opportunties" they came to the north to save their lives.
I think it absolutely hilarious, the close historical analogy rejected by those anti "illegal" anti Criminal, I do assume that you who dislike illegal actions have never broken laws, never driven faster than the posted speed limit, never smoked a duby, never drove a vehicle a tad intoxicated, always paid the right amount to the IRS.

I am also glad that Jesus Christ was brought into the subject, the love and compassion ya'll express is duly noted. Oh, don't forget that JC was a criminal too, he vandalized the Temple.

A couple of quotes for you; "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and "how can you see the mote in they neighbor's eye, for the log within your own".

 
Old 10-23-2007, 06:28 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,628,664 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alanboy395 View Post
this is just ignorant.

the black slaves were running through the underground railroad b/c they were being whipped, hung, raped, and treated like property in the south. they didn't come to the north for "better opportunties" they came to the north to save their lives.

i wish someone else would try to compare the illegals struggles to the slaves struggles.
You are 100% correct.

Slaves were already Americans whereas illegal immigrants are just that: here illegally.
 
Old 10-23-2007, 06:47 PM
 
294 posts, read 390,051 times
Reputation: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
I think it absolutely hilarious, the close historical analogy rejected by those anti "illegal" anti Criminal, I do assume that you who dislike illegal actions have never broken laws, never driven faster than the posted speed limit, never smoked a duby, never drove a vehicle a tad intoxicated, always paid the right amount to the IRS.

I have broken laws, but i didnt expect benefits from hit such as health care and housing, nor did i ever expect to not be held accountable or pay the consequences. and with the IRS...they have managed to rape me for the full amount every time.

I am also glad that Jesus Christ was brought into the subject, the love and compassion ya'll express is duly noted.

I am not nearly the man he was, but this isnt about love and compassion, i have done more things out of compassion for these very people and others around the world that you will never know....i still dont want them here unless its LEGALLY. and i dont want the govt to force compassion and love from my pocket book. i will do that myself if i feel so inclined. as far as there plight and feeling bad for having bad lives...i DO, become a citizen and make something for yourself under our rules.....that easy

Oh, don't forget that JC was a criminal too, he vandalized the Temple.

Illegals arent here to bring gods word either or to save humanity, they are here to mooch off of the country because its easier and they can.

A couple of quotes for you; "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" and "how can you see the mote in they neighbor's eye, for the log within your own".

even with the log in my own eye can i feel someone stealing my wallet, I dont damn them or hate them or want them to die (for the most part). i want them to carry there own load and be contributing members to society instead of taking me for everything i am worth

what is so hard to understand about not mooching off of everybody else and becoming legal? if you are so concerned about it, you help them, dont require me too
 
Old 10-23-2007, 07:49 PM
 
Location: Northern VA (for now)
23,010 posts, read 31,965,939 times
Reputation: 30400
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
I think it absolutely hilarious, the close historical analogy rejected by those anti "illegal" anti Criminal, I do assume that you who dislike illegal actions have never broken laws, never driven faster than the posted speed limit, never smoked a duby, never drove a vehicle a tad intoxicated, always paid the right amount to the IRS.
Actually i just got a ticket for running a red light. I couldn't plead "please officer, i live in one of Alexandria's worst neighborhoods, it's hard for me where i'm at, you being a racist, i just want a better life for my family." bottom line, i broke the law and i have to do my time (or pay my fine). It is extremely unfair to let illegals, who broke the law at the end of the day, get legal status and hop over legals who gone through **** and high water to get into the US and make a good life the right way.

Bottom line. A lot of these illegals can ruin a state's quality of life. I'm having second thoughts about moving to NC b/c of all the illegals there.
 
Old 10-23-2007, 08:52 PM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,708,575 times
Reputation: 350
Quote:
Slaves were already Americans whereas illegal immigrants are just that: here illegally.
Nope, they were not Americans, the were not citizens, they were not even persons, they were 3/5ths of a person, check the Constitution.

Ya' know, if the illegals were all 19 year old French and Swedish girls ya'll would not have a problem.

The illegals do not hurt me or you, they contribute greatly to the economic well being of this country. I walk out to get the paper at 6:00 in the morning, dark, cold, they are out in the fields working hard as they will do until late afternoon, I challenge any of you to spend a season in the fields. In fact John McCain offered $50,000 to any white man who would spend a season in the Yuma fields, he did not have one taker.

Quote:
Bottom line. A lot of these illegals can ruin a state's quality of life. I'm having second thoughts about moving to NC b/c of all the illegals there.
Lotta 'coloureds' too, darned darkskinned people, they tain't real Amuricans.
Oh, and Abraham Lincoln did not help the slaves much, as he said, his goal was preservation of the Union, not ending slavery. If you would read the Emancipation Proclamation you will realize also he did not free a single slave.
 
Old 10-23-2007, 09:26 PM
 
294 posts, read 390,051 times
Reputation: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
Nope, they were not Americans, the were not citizens, they were not even persons, they were 3/5ths of a person, check the Constitution.

Brought here aginst there will as slaves. at least they could be "americans" as free men. but again...illegals werent brought here as slaves tied to ships, see the differance yet?

Ya' know, if the illegals were all 19 year old French and Swedish girls ya'll would not have a problem.

I would if they were sucking the economy dry or causing a decrease in linving conditions or here illegally. funny thing is in reality they would get deported alot quicker.

The illegals do not hurt me or you,

you can say this with a straight face??

they contribute greatly to the economic well being of this country.

again you are not laughing when you say this?

I walk out to get the paper at 6:00 in the morning, dark, cold, they are out in the fields working hard as they will do until late afternoon, I challenge any of you to spend a season in the fields.

If i didnt join the military i would have and thought about it, just to make ends meet. nobody is knocking the work ethic of the decsent ones...but they are here ILLEGALLY and supported by the GOVT with MY TAX DOLLARS.


In fact John McCain offered $50,000 to any white man who would spend a season in the Yuma fields, he did not have one taker.

how long is a season? is the offer still good? nobody is questioning the work ethic of some of them, but does this mean we have to provide services and whatnot for them? how about becoming citizens, paying taxes getting your own health care and if then i have to pay another 40 cents for a head of lettuce ok....ill do it. but if i have to pay 1240$ a year or whatever the figure is so they can have all the benefits as ILLEGALS...i wont do it

Lotta 'coloureds' too, darned darkskinned people, they tain't real Amuricans.
Oh, and Abraham Lincoln did not help the slaves much, as he said, his goal was preservation of the Union, not ending slavery. If you would read the Emancipation Proclamation you will realize also he did not free a single slave.

you are right abou this. attacking slavery was also a way to cripple the southern economy which was stronger then the north. wasnt about freeing slaves that was a byproduct....sadly the truth

so illegals who become american citizens who pay taxes cant do the exact same thing????? if it causes us to pay more fo rthe product...guess what...that is life. they are here ILLEGALLY, they get benefits that we taxpayers, pay for and i am suppose to just smile becasue they do a hard job? um no....i have no problem with those very same people getting work visas or becoming citizens learning the language and getting there own benefits even if ti means i have to pay more for vegatables
 
Old 10-23-2007, 09:38 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,628,664 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
N
Ya' know, if the illegals were all 19 year old French and Swedish girls ya'll would not have a problem.
Guess what?

I am first generation US born American of 1/2 Hungarian heritage-------if a bunch of the above ethnic group came here illegally and refused to assimilate------can someone say la migra?
 
Old 10-23-2007, 09:40 PM
 
Location: Mesa, Az
21,148 posts, read 36,628,664 times
Reputation: 3785
Quote:
Originally Posted by greatbasinguide View Post
Lotta 'coloureds' too, darned darkskinned people, they tain't real Amuricans.
Oh, and Abraham Lincoln did not help the slaves much, as he said, his goal was preservation of the Union, not ending slavery. If you would read the Emancipation Proclamation you will realize also he did not free a single slave.
BTW: where do you have the right to stereotype that all illegal immigrants have dark skin?

Please remember that Hispanics; the largest source of illegals are not a race.
 
Old 10-24-2007, 08:47 AM
 
Location: CA Coast
1,900 posts, read 1,708,575 times
Reputation: 350
Boy, ya'll's prejudices seem to colour your views.

Consider this statement; a higher percentage of illegals work than American citizens. They come here to work, and they work hard, MOD CUT, and don't worry, you would not last a season in the fields. There is a reason why American born whites don't work in the fields, they can't handle the work.

Quote:
Please remember that Hispanics; the largest source of illegals are not a race.
And your point is?

Those of you who think that illegals are a drain on the economy really ought to turn off Fox news and do a bit of research.
Let me state clearly illegal immigrants are not a drain on the economy, but instead support the economy. You need to get that straight.

The Wall Street Journal, hardly a liberal rag;
Quote:
The immigration debate is roaring again, and we're happy to join the fun. One place to start is a myth that has become a key talking point among restrictionists on the right--to wit, that immigrants come to the U.S. for a life of ease on the public dole.

Leading this charge is the Heritage Foundation's Robert Rector, who argues in a new study that "the average lifetime costs to the taxpayer will be $1.1 million" for each low-skilled immigrant household. Hispanic immigrants and their families are a net national drain, he says, because they "assimilate into welfare."

Mr. Rector and Heritage have done some good social science research in the past, but this time they have the story backward: In most cases immigrants will pay at least as much in lifetime federal taxes as they receive in benefits.

One basic flaw in the Heritage analysis is that, as a study by the Immigration Policy Center points out: "The vast majority of immigrants are not eligible to receive any of these [welfare] benefits for many years after their arrival in the United States. . . . Legal permanent residents cannot receive SSI [Supplemental Security Income], which is available only to U.S. citizens, and are not eligible for means-tested public benefits until 5 years after receiving their green cards."

Illegal immigrants are also ineligible for any kind of federal welfare benefits--with the exception of emergency health care. Many of the Congressional proposals to legalize this population would not allow these workers to collect welfare until waiting up to eight years for a green card and five years after that.

The "welfare" charge is also refuted by the experience of the federal welfare reform passed 11 years ago. That law reduced the welfare eligibility of new immigrants on the sensible grounds that the magnet for America should be work, not a government handout. Ron Haskins, an architect of that reform and the author of a 2006 book on its consequences, concludes that "the use of welfare by noncitizens has declined rapidly" in the wake of that law.

Off the Dole
Change in welfare use by immigrants, 1996-2004
Cash welfare (AFDC)
-73%
Food stamps
-39%
Supplemental Security Income
-20%
Medicaid
+20%

Source: Ken Haskins
The nearby chart shows how rapidly. Between 1994 and 2004, the percentage of immigrant households collecting traditional cash welfare payments, supplemental security income, and food stamps fell by about half. The decline in welfare use was more rapid for immigrants than for native-born Americans. The exception has been Medicaid, thanks to states that have increased immigrant eligibility for the state-federal program in recent years.

However, immigrants have a positive financial impact on the most expensive federal entitlements: Medicare and Social Security. This is because immigrants generally come when they are young and working. Seventy percent of immigrants are in the prime working ages of 20-54, compared to only half of the native-born American population. Only 2% of immigrants are over 65 when they arrive compared to 12% of natives.

As a result, most immigrants contribute payroll taxes for decades before they collect Social Security or Medicare benefits. The Social Security actuaries recently calculated that over the next 75 years immigrant workers will pay some $5 trillion more in payroll taxes than they will receive in Social Security benefits. These surplus payments more than offset the costs of use of other welfare benefits received by most immigrant groups.

There's no doubt that immigrants draw on public resources, like the roads and the schools. The latter is mandated by a Supreme Court decision, Plyer v. Doe, and in any event would our society rather have these children in school, or wandering the streets? Even immigrants who don't own homes, and thus don't pay property taxes, finance public schools indirectly through rents paid to landlords. As for health care and roads, immigrants who receive paychecks have their income taxes withheld, and they also pay sales tax and other levies like everyone else.

Perhaps most important, immigrant earnings and tax payments rise the longer they are here. According to Census data for 2005, immigrants who have just arrived have median household earnings of $31,930, or about 30% below the U.S. average of $44,389. But those in the U.S. for an average of 10 years have earnings of $38,395; for those here at least 25 years, the figure is more than $50,000. Those earnings wouldn't be increasing if most immigrants were going on the dole. They are instead assimilating into the work force, growing their incomes as their skills increase.

As Congress debates immigration policy, the Members should keep in mind that the melting pot is still working; that taxes by immigrants cover their use of public services; and that finding a way to let immigrants work in the U.S. legally is the humane and pro-growth solution to the illegal immigration problem.

Last edited by NewToCA; 10-24-2007 at 09:14 AM.. Reason: No personal comments
 
Old 10-24-2007, 10:02 AM
 
16,092 posts, read 35,788,600 times
Reputation: 6264
If I had 20 Swedish people crammed into a 2-bedroom house next door (and several others) the problem is the same. Also if a school is overwhelmed by several hundred Swedes and must take away from the other children to teach them English. Or worse the citizen's kid must take his tests in Swedish. If Swedish people decided they were above the laws the rest of us must follow there would be resentment.

I doubt Sweden or France (especially) would get the favoritism shown to Mexico, anyhow.
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