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Old 04-26-2010, 09:03 AM
 
1,038 posts, read 1,031,310 times
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Many on here claim that only illegal immigrants will be subject to the law. My understanding of the bill is that police can search anyone and demand to see proof of citizenship, including pedestrians. Which one is it? Is this law only for illegals or for anyone suspect? Are you required to carry a drivers license if you don't drive? If in fact the police have a right to search law abiding citizens who have commited no crime, is this constitutional?
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:09 AM
 
Location: North Las Vegas
1,082 posts, read 1,333,791 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holdencaulfield View Post
Many on here claim that only illegal immigrants will be subject to the law. My understanding of the bill is that police can search anyone and demand to see proof of citizenship, including pedestrians. Which one is it? Is this law only for illegals or for anyone suspect? Are you required to carry a drivers license if you don't drive? If in fact the police have a right to search law abiding citizens who have commited no crime, is this constitutional?
What difference is this law than when the police stop people at a check point randomly to see if the driver is DUI? There was no proof that a crime was being committed, but we don't have a problem with DUI checkpoints, so why not Illegal Alien Checkpoints?

I know people hate this argument but, if you are here legally why worry about it? I know if I am stopped I would gladly hand over my ID (who doesn't carry an ID with at all times now anyway?) and have a nice talk with the officer. He is just doing his job, and this time around his job is something I wish I could do myself, eliminate part of the illegal alien problem.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:15 AM
Status: "Make America the Great Joke Again" (set 23 days ago)
 
Location: Denver
9,060 posts, read 15,467,286 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tymberwulf View Post
What difference is this law than when the police stop people at a check point randomly to see if the driver is DUI? There was no proof that a crime was being committed, but we don't have a problem with DUI checkpoints, so why not Illegal Alien Checkpoints?

I know people hate this argument but, if you are here legally why worry about it? I know if I am stopped I would gladly hand over my ID (who doesn't carry an ID with at all times now anyway?) and have a nice talk with the officer. He is just doing his job, and this time around his job is something I wish I could do myself, eliminate part of the illegal alien problem.
There are already immigration checkpoints, this law is different.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:34 AM
 
1,038 posts, read 1,031,310 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tymberwulf View Post
What difference is this law than when the police stop people at a check point randomly to see if the driver is DUI? There was no proof that a crime was being committed, but we don't have a problem with DUI checkpoints, so why not Illegal Alien Checkpoints?
Pedestrians are not subject to DUI. This law also allows people to be searched in multiple places, work, public places, stores, private places,etc.. Would you support radom drug testing by the government at your place of work? What about at restaurants, parks, movie theatres?

Quote:
I know people hate this argument but, if you are here legally why worry about it? I know if I am stopped I would gladly hand over my ID (who doesn't carry an ID with at all times now anyway?) and have a nice talk with the officer. He is just doing his job, and this time around his job is something I wish I could do myself, eliminate part of the illegal alien problem.
So you have no problem with a mandatory identification card? You have no problem with law abiding citizens being searched randomly.
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:38 AM
 
Location: AL
2,477 posts, read 2,202,011 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Holdencaulfield View Post
Many on here claim that only illegal immigrants will be subject to the law. My understanding of the bill is that police can search anyone and demand to see proof of citizenship, including pedestrians. Which one is it? Is this law only for illegals or for anyone suspect? Are you required to carry a drivers license if you don't drive? If in fact the police have a right to search law abiding citizens who have commited no crime, is this constitutional?

If your not illegal....who cares!

Oh and if the Feds would kick out the illegals in the 1st place...this would be a none issue!
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Old 04-26-2010, 09:39 AM
 
1,038 posts, read 1,031,310 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerrymac View Post
If your not illegal....who cares!

Oh and if the Feds would kick out the illegals in the 1st place...this would be a none issue!
Should I take that as a yes or I don't care?
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Old 04-26-2010, 10:51 AM
 
31,385 posts, read 31,051,757 times
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This is how the law reads in part:

ARTICLE 8. ENFORCEMENT OF IMMIGRATION LAWS
11-1051. Cooperation and assistance in enforcement of immigration laws; indemnification

B. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY
OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS
STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE, WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON. THE PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE VERIFIED WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1373(c).

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf

How you establish a constitutional standard for reasonable suspicion is beyond me.
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Old 04-26-2010, 10:54 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,059,856 times
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What do you mean by "search?" Pat-down? Back seat. Glove box? Trunk?
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Old 04-26-2010, 11:01 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 9,059,856 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovcatto View Post
This is how the law reads in part:

ARTICLE 8. ENFORCEMENT OF IMMIGRATION LAWS
11-1051. Cooperation and assistance in enforcement of immigration laws; indemnification

B. FOR ANY LAWFUL CONTACT MADE BY A LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICIAL OR AGENCY
OF THIS STATE OR A COUNTY, CITY, TOWN OR OTHER POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THIS
STATE WHERE REASONABLE SUSPICION EXISTS THAT THE PERSON IS AN ALIEN WHO IS UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES, A REASONABLE ATTEMPT SHALL BE MADE, WHEN PRACTICABLE, TO DETERMINE THE IMMIGRATION STATUS OF THE PERSON. THE PERSON'S IMMIGRATION STATUS SHALL BE VERIFIED WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT
PURSUANT TO 8 UNITED STATES CODE SECTION 1373(c).

http://www.azleg.gov/legtext/49leg/2r/bills/sb1070s.pdf

How you establish a constitutional standard for reasonable suspicion is beyond me.
We need to know the definition of "lawful contact" as well. Since none of us here seem to have a clue what legal meaning these terms have, it's way too early to be crying "nazi totalitarian communist fascist racist." I'm not an expert in either AZ or US constitutional law, and neither are any of you. Therefore, to me, those screaming "unconstitutional" to this law will be filed next to those screaming the same about the health care act.
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Old 04-26-2010, 11:01 AM
 
97 posts, read 81,371 times
Reputation: 88
You know, I don't understand why people are so outraged by Arizona's new law. After all, it worked so well for Germany!
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