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Old 04-28-2010, 10:35 AM
 
10,543 posts, read 11,687,286 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
What's to stop a cop from trying to put me through the ropes of proving I'm a legal citizen?
The law that you're so upset about. It says that a valid drivers license is enough.

 
Old 04-28-2010, 10:38 AM
 
Location: CITY OF ANGELS AND CONSTANT DANGER
5,409 posts, read 11,076,179 times
Reputation: 2244
lawful contact was not defined in the bill/law.
what exactly IS lawful contact?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr View Post
It seems to be lost on many that the law requires that police be engaged in "lawful contact" before asking about immigration status. That means that they have stopped you for violating a law not for having a particular skin tone. At that point, they need reasonable suspicion, and the law specifically states that race or ethnicity can't be the sole reason for suspicion.
 
Old 04-28-2010, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 4,783,909 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr View Post
If you do that and, on top of that, they have reasonable suspicion other than your skin tone or ethnicity then you would be subject to question. You have posted several points that are directly contradicted by the text of the law. You clearly have not read it or you don't care what it says.
What would "reasonable suspicision" be?
 
Old 04-28-2010, 10:50 AM
 
10,543 posts, read 11,687,286 times
Reputation: 2797
Quote:
Originally Posted by the one View Post
lawful contact was not defined in the bill/law.
what exactly IS lawful contact?
"Kris Kobach, a University of Missouri Kansas City Law School professor who helped draft the law tells York that "lawful contact" means "the officer is already engaged in some detention of an individual because he's violated some other law. ... The most likely context where this law would come into play is a traffic stop.""

What Does Arizona's Immigration Law Actually Say? | The Weekly Standard
 
Old 04-28-2010, 10:56 AM
 
10,543 posts, read 11,687,286 times
Reputation: 2797
Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
What would "reasonable suspicision" be?
No license plate on a car, evasive responses, appearing nervous etc.
 
Old 04-28-2010, 10:58 AM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 4,783,909 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr View Post
No license plate on a car, evasive responses, appearing nervous etc.
Yep and those are all attributes common of legit citizens as well. You mean if I get nervous like I always am when I get pulled over the cop has the right to put me through hell to prove I'm a citizen. You and I both know what "reasonable suspiscion" is, the difference is I'll admit it.
 
Old 04-28-2010, 11:00 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 5,623,525 times
Reputation: 1459
Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
In DUI checkpoints you aren't detained unless there is clear and probably cause. I deliver pizza late at night and go through them all the time. As long as I don't appear drunk or high and have my license it takes no more than 5 minutes.
Well Finally the truth come out , We are not picking on only the "Mexican" illegals . Yes at a DUI check point you are not detained ! if everything ( Papers, proper proof as to who you are ) are in order. but you are stopped! without probable cause.

SO lets stop wasting all the efforts and all this time and just put police to work OFF the highways ( Making money instead of protecting and serving )and on the city streets , and lets check everyone that passes. Now if a car turns and runs then the cops have their probable cause to go after them . and no one's constitutional rights are violated! again if they are not here legally then they have NO RIGHTS. . We should be proud to show proof we are Americans and have a right to be here.
 
Old 04-28-2010, 11:00 AM
 
3,151 posts, read 3,046,386 times
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Rino alert...
 
Old 04-28-2010, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Full time RV"er
2,403 posts, read 5,623,525 times
Reputation: 1459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr View Post
The law that you're so upset about. It says that a valid drivers license is enough.
There would not be any problem if as i do every person in the US would Voluntarily ( NOT BECAUSE OF ANY LAW)carry a copy of your birth cert. on your person I travel full time all over this country and have no problem with doing this. What's the big deal! Is it too simple to resolve this problem this way ?
 
Old 04-28-2010, 11:07 AM
 
10,543 posts, read 11,687,286 times
Reputation: 2797
Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
Yep and those are all attributes common of legit citizens as well. You mean if I get nervous like I always am when I get pulled over the cop has the right to put me through hell to prove I'm a citizen. You and I both know what "reasonable suspiscion" is, the difference is I'll admit it.
Deal with the whole package of points, not just one. If you're just nervous, then no. If you're nervous, have no license, or license plate, and don't provide clear answers, then yes.

Regarding the right to put you "through hell," That Arizona law states that, "a reasonable attempt shall be made, when practicable, to determine the immigration status of the person."

Given technology today and the fact that officers have radios and computers in their cars, a citizen should not have to go through hell to demonstrate citizenship.
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