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Old 04-28-2010, 01:24 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,111 posts, read 15,661,943 times
Reputation: 8790

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toyman at Jewel Lake View Post
A question for those that oppose the new law-what would you suggest to get a handle on the criminal alien problem? Counting on the feds isn't working, they lack the willingness to handle their responsibility. Obviously the state needs to do something-what do you suggest?
And states also have a responsiblity to protect the citizens. Somebody must do the job.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:28 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,111 posts, read 15,661,943 times
Reputation: 8790
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanrene View Post
They have made a political calculation that the intensity/anger/rage from hispanics and the Left will OUTWEIGH the anger/enthusisam of Indies/Conservatives and Moderate Dems who absolutely DO NOT want to see all these illegals given amnesty.

Dirty Harry believes he will get a more enthusiastic hispanic vote in the fall, never mind that 70% of Arizonans approve of the legislation.

I think they have miscalculated.
I think they've miscalculated too; big time. And the more Obama threatens to overstep his authority in yet another area, the greater will be their loss.
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Old 04-28-2010, 01:31 PM
 
1,472 posts, read 1,905,098 times
Reputation: 1128
I see no problem with the Law I've been stopped several times along the border by BP and asked if I was a U.S. Citizen never has been a problem never will be as far as I'm concerned.

brushrunners
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:21 PM
 
Location: AL
2,477 posts, read 2,202,357 times
Reputation: 1007
Quote:
Originally Posted by twista6002 View Post
It's not the side of the illegals. It's the side of the Constitution. I'm going to bring this up everytime a rightwinger whines about how if anything Obama and the Dems are doing is unconstitutional.

1st off...Illegals are NOT covered under our Constitution.
2nd.......Again what is un-Const. about this law?

If you are stop under reas.susp. you must produce I.D....that goes for everyone....whats the problem?
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 4,780,744 times
Reputation: 2150
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerrymac View Post
1st off...Illegals are NOT covered under our Constitution.
2nd.......Again what is un-Const. about this law?

If you are stop under reas.susp. you must produce I.D....that goes for everyone....whats the problem?
Legal citizens are going to have their rights violated as a result of this law.

Fourth Amendment to the United States Constitution - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And no one opposed presenting a mandatory ID
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:24 PM
 
Location: Highland, CA (formerly Newark, NJ)
6,183 posts, read 4,780,744 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
If they are teaching the Constitution at all in AZ, they are ahead of the rest of the states, because the Contitution is no longer being taught in any school. If it were, we wouldn't have so many people on C-D who have no clue what it says about anything.
I know. It's a shame some people don't read up on the 4th Amendment.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:29 PM
 
Location: #
9,605 posts, read 14,276,273 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Thanks, roy. My views line up with the majority on each question. Indeed, I'm unsure whether the law will end up violating the rights of citizens, a virtual split vote in question #4.
If this law goes through, whether or not the law violates rights of citizens will be found out in November. If a lot of Democrats win across Arizona, the answer will be that indeed it does.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:30 PM
 
Location: Sierra Vista, AZ
16,116 posts, read 20,152,267 times
Reputation: 8204
Rasmussen usually comes out about 80 points right of reality.
I live here I hate it
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:36 PM
 
Location: Aurora, Colorado
2,212 posts, read 4,494,638 times
Reputation: 2363
Quote:
Originally Posted by azriverfan. View Post
I'm an Arizona resident and a Sheriff Joe supporter. I'm also a Republican and a strong supporter of immigration reform. Most of the people in Arizona do not support this law including me. 40% of the Arizona population consists of Hispanic Americans like myself. Hispanic Americans, contrary to popular belief, endorse strong immigration reform and don't favor illegal immigration. However, this law targets U.S. citizens like myself. Yes, yes, "Just show them your driver's license"....sorry...I shouldn't have to. I'm born and raised in this country. I shouldn't have to carry a copy of my passport or show my driver's license out of being racially profiled and harrassed. I can understand showing proof of citizenship if there is probable cause ie I broke the law. However, this law doesn't mandate probable cause and gives law enforcement the right to question anyone's citizenship status based on "reasonable suspicion" which is not specific and can essentially mean anything.

This law would not have taken place if Governor Jan Brewer did not sign this into law. Jan Brewer was not elected to the governorship. She inherited it when Janet Napolitano left to become the Homeland Security Secretary. Arizona residents voted for Napolitano not Brewer.

Rasmussen is a conservative polling group. I wonder what percentage of those they polled were Hispanic Americans because 40% of the Arizona population is Hispanic American.
With all due respect, my in-laws are Arizona residents and have been for generations. They were the exact people President Obama talked about...the people who owned land before Arizona was a state...and they are American citizens AND Latino. They, and their huge network of friends and business associates, are totally in favor of this bill. They have watched the changes happening (particularly in Phoenix) and while they sympathize with those who are willingly risking their lives to get to the US, the bigger issue here is the rampant crime that has literally taken over.

You aren't the "voice of the Hispanic community of Arizona" any more than they are. Arizona has a huge Hispanic population (40% as you said is probably pretty close) and yet they can only gather a few hundred to protest? Tells me that there are plenty in favor of this bill...skin color has little to do with it...my in-laws are citizens because they did the right thing...they don't sympathize with people who are trying to circumvent the system.

As for showing proof you're here legally...again I will use my in-laws as an example. They all have driver's licenses. Two of my cousins are here on green cards, awaiting citizenship. If the police ask them for ID, they can provide it.

Unless you can think of a better way to identify the poor person just trying to carve out a better life for themselves versus the coyote who is holding illegals hostage until their family pays up, then this is what it's come down to. Arizona has been left unchecked for too long and the time to act was decades ago. Since coyotes and drug lords don't wear special t-shirts to indicate who they are...what do you purpose Arizona should do? Just give up? Would you tell a neighborhood not to bother trying to stop crime that they see happening in their own neighborhood because it will just make the problem worse? I would tell those neighbors to fight with everything they had to take their neighborhood back...just as I am 100% in support of this bill in Arizona.
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Old 04-28-2010, 02:42 PM
 
Location: Aurora, Colorado
2,212 posts, read 4,494,638 times
Reputation: 2363
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
I think they've miscalculated too; big time. And the more Obama threatens to overstep his authority in yet another area, the greater will be their loss.
The 7th Congressional District in Arizona has the highest percentage of Hispanic citizens. It's Rep Grijalva's district and basically sits at the far southern edge of Arizona. Hispanic citizens there number around 65% and yet only 35% of them vote.

The Democrats have made a truly bad calculation by turning this into political games. Arizonans were very unhappy with the way George Bush handled the border issue too...they don't want political grandstanding...they want action.

The American people are getting the message...crime rates in Phoenix are skyrocketing, drugs are coming through the borders, and the federal government has known about this problem for decades and has done nothing, not matter which political party they're on. Most Americans favor the power of the states to tell them how they should live...they are enormously suspicious of Washington with good reason, so to see the blowhards in DC suddenly have an opinion of how a state should take care of itself is sobering to many people.
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