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Old 05-20-2010, 12:30 AM
 
Location: Phoenix,Arizona
2,805 posts, read 2,440,992 times
Reputation: 1999
Default After the Border is Secure...Would this work ?

The illegal alien problem is basically an identification problem. So how can we properly identify people which include citizens, legal aliens, illegal aliens, and temporary visitors?
The federal government wants to institute a federal ID. Under no circumstances do I want a national ID. They have no constitutional authority to require a national ID. We do not want our government to have that much control over us, so how do we solve the identification issue? The answer lies with the states. Currently, the state issues ID cards known as Drivers Licenses. If you donít drive, you still go to the DMV to get a State ID card that looks similar to a valid driverís license. We should use this existing system with a few changes to get rid of the fraud that now goes on. What changes am I talking about? We must dramatically tighten the requirements to be issued the new license/ID card. The following is my suggestions for the new ID system.
First, from this point on, a social security card can no longer be used for any type of identification other than payroll deduction. It could only be used once you were hired so that your payroll deductions could be tracked for social security purposes. This was the original intent of the number from the beginning. Along the way we have perverted its use. That must stop now!
Second, in order to be issued the new state ID card, you must present a valid solid proof of citizenship. This would include a birth certificate, passport, or naturalized citizenship papers along with any other corroborating pieces of ID that may be necessary. No more SS cards to get a driverís license. This would go into effect immediately for new issue licenses. Current holders of a valid AZ driverís license/ID card would have one year to get the new issue license. This is more than enough time for them to round up their passports, birth certificates, etc.
Third, the state will issue two types of state ID.
The first one is a state ID card for US citizens. It could look just like we the one we have now or be changed slightly, to reflect the fact that the holder has proven citizenship and is a current resident of Arizona.
The second one would be a valid Arizona ID card for foreign nationals. In order to get this card, the foreign national would have to show his legally issued work visas or other work documents. The license/ID card would expire in accordance with the work documents. As is the law now, they would still be required to comply with all other laws concerning the carrying of work documents at all times. This ID card would look noticeably different from the normal AZ ID card. Any foreign national currently living and working in Arizona would be required to have this ID on them at all times. If the foreign national is just visiting and or vacationing, this ID would not be required. Their ID from their country of origin would suffice.
As is the law now, people moving here from other states, and possessing that states ID would have a short grace period to obtain the new Arizona ID.
I feel that implementing this ID policy would force the illegals to become legal or go home.

What are your constructive comments ?

I'm tired of waiting for over paid non productive elected people and as
an American Citizen I pledge allegiance,
To the flag, Of the United States Of America,
And to the republic, For which it stands,
One nation, Under God,
Indivisible,
With Liberty, And Justice for all !
Quick reply to this message

 
Old 05-20-2010, 12:37 AM
 
2,228 posts, read 1,974,981 times
Reputation: 2021
No offense, but none of your suggestions will ever matter one bit until you have a government that serves its people, not corporations and social "Frankfurt School" Marxists.

How does one get such a government?

That is a question worth answering.

Spoiler
How did we do it in 1776?

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Old 05-20-2010, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Phoenix,Arizona
2,805 posts, read 2,440,992 times
Reputation: 1999
None taken

I just have more faith in the American People
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Old 05-22-2010, 02:37 PM
 
Location: Phoenix,Arizona
2,805 posts, read 2,440,992 times
Reputation: 1999
Well it looks like I'll have to find another way to help

I really had the thought and faith that out of all of us
here we just might come up with an idea or two on this
issue...My bad
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-25-2010, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Oklahoma(formerly SoCalif) Originally Mich,
13,387 posts, read 9,614,759 times
Reputation: 4611
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouser View Post
The illegal alien problem is basically an identification problem. So how can we properly identify people which include citizens, legal aliens, illegal aliens, and temporary visitors?
The federal government wants to institute a federal ID. Under no circumstances do I want a national ID. They have no constitutional authority to require a national ID. We do not want our government to have that much control over us, so how do we solve the identification issue? The answer lies with the states. Currently, the state issues ID cards known as Drivers Licenses. If you donít drive, you still go to the DMV to get a State ID card that looks similar to a valid driverís license. We should use this existing system with a few changes to get rid of the fraud that now goes on. What changes am I talking about? We must dramatically tighten the requirements to be issued the new license/ID card. The following is my suggestions for the new ID system.
First, from this point on, a social security card can no longer be used for any type of identification other than payroll deduction. It could only be used once you were hired so that your payroll deductions could be tracked for social security purposes. This was the original intent of the number from the beginning. Along the way we have perverted its use. That must stop now!
Second, in order to be issued the new state ID card, you must present a valid solid proof of citizenship. This would include a birth certificate, passport, or naturalized citizenship papers along with any other corroborating pieces of ID that may be necessary. No more SS cards to get a driverís license. This would go into effect immediately for new issue licenses. Current holders of a valid AZ driverís license/ID card would have one year to get the new issue license. This is more than enough time for them to round up their passports, birth certificates, etc.
Third, the state will issue two types of state ID.
The first one is a state ID card for US citizens. It could look just like we the one we have now or be changed slightly, to reflect the fact that the holder has proven citizenship and is a current resident of Arizona.
The second one would be a valid Arizona ID card for foreign nationals. In order to get this card, the foreign national would have to show his legally issued work visas or other work documents. The license/ID card would expire in accordance with the work documents. As is the law now, they would still be required to comply with all other laws concerning the carrying of work documents at all times. This ID card would look noticeably different from the normal AZ ID card. Any foreign national currently living and working in Arizona would be required to have this ID on them at all times. If the foreign national is just visiting and or vacationing, this ID would not be required. Their ID from their country of origin would suffice.
As is the law now, people moving here from other states, and possessing that states ID would have a short grace period to obtain the new Arizona ID.
I feel that implementing this ID policy would force the illegals to become legal or go home.

What are your constructive comments ?

I'm tired of waiting for over paid non productive elected people and as
an American Citizen I pledge allegiance,
To the flag, Of the United States Of America,
And to the republic, For which it stands,
One nation, Under God,
Indivisible,
With Liberty, And Justice for all !
There will always be a black market. So your suggestion will only make it easier for illegals..
Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-25-2010, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,608 posts, read 6,743,578 times
Reputation: 2977
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouser View Post
Currently, the state issues ID cards known as Drivers Licenses. If you donít drive, you still go to the DMV to get a State ID card that looks similar to a valid driverís license. We should use this existing system with a few changes to get rid of the fraud that now goes on. What changes am I talking about? We must dramatically tighten the requirements to be issued the new license/ID card. The following is my suggestions for the new ID system.
First, from this point on, a social security card can no longer be used for any type of identification other than payroll deduction. It could only be used once you were hired so that your payroll deductions could be tracked for social security purposes. This was the original intent of the number from the beginning. Along the way we have perverted its use. That must stop now!
Second, in order to be issued the new state ID card, you must present a valid solid proof of citizenship. This would include a birth certificate, passport, or naturalized citizenship papers along with any other corroborating pieces of ID that may be necessary. No more SS cards to get a driverís license. This would go into effect immediately for new issue licenses. Current holders of a valid AZ driverís license/ID card would have one year to get the new issue license. This is more than enough time for them to round up their passports, birth certificates, etc.
Third, the state will issue two types of state ID.
The first one is a state ID card for US citizens. It could look just like we the one we have now or be changed slightly, to reflect the fact that the holder has proven citizenship and is a current resident of Arizona.
The second one would be a valid Arizona ID card for foreign nationals. In order to get this card, the foreign national would have to show his legally issued work visas or other work documents. The license/ID card would expire in accordance with the work documents. As is the law now, they would still be required to comply with all other laws concerning the carrying of work documents at all times. This ID card would look noticeably different from the normal AZ ID card. Any foreign national currently living and working in Arizona would be required to have this ID on them at all times. If the foreign national is just visiting and or vacationing, this ID would not be required. Their ID from their country of origin would suffice.
In Wa state (where I live) we already in effect have TWO forms of DL ID - since they happily issue DL to illegals, legal residents are now stuck with the SAME DL that illegals can also get - while there is a CITIZENS ONLY "enhanced" DL.

This really frosts my a$$ as my daughter and I (like many others) jumped through all the hoops (not to mention the $$ spent) to be here LEGALLY and had to show a screed of paperwork to get OUR DL - yet now the DL we have is not accepted as VALID ID simply because illegals can ALSO get the same ID.
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Old 08-25-2010, 11:13 AM
 
1,150 posts, read 574,034 times
Reputation: 368
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouser View Post
Well it looks like I'll have to find another way to help

I really had the thought and faith that out of all of us
here we just might come up with an idea or two on this
issue...My bad
I think your ideas could work. There will always be fraud, and we'll never have 100% foolproof ways to detect fraudulent papers, but every little bit helps. Just making it more difficult for people to scam the system would be a plus. The only thing I would add is all IDs issued to non-citizens should have their fingerprints on them. Maybe a chip, bearing more information than is likely to be known by a frudulent user, and that can be scannd by law enforcement, could be imbedded in them.
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Old 08-25-2010, 11:48 AM
 
Location: Spokane via Sydney,Australia
6,608 posts, read 6,743,578 times
Reputation: 2977
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayarcy View Post
I think your ideas could work. There will always be fraud, and we'll never have 100% foolproof ways to detect fraudulent papers, but every little bit helps. Just making it more difficult for people to scam the system would be a plus. The only thing I would add is all IDs issued to non-citizens should have their fingerprints on them. Maybe a chip, bearing more information than is likely to be known by a frudulent user, and that can be scannd by law enforcement, could be imbedded in them.
non citizens here LEGALLY already HAVE an ID - it's called a green card and to get one (legally) you have to be fingerprinted and pass an FBI background check - EVERY single time you renew it btw.
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Old 08-25-2010, 12:12 PM
 
3,195 posts, read 1,266,331 times
Reputation: 1520
I'm all for trying anything.

It seems obvious to me that at some point we will have some kind of amnesty. People are worked up enough about illegals that something will be done, the question is what.

In the proposals I've seen, it looks as if in short, there would be a grace period to registar, a fine, a waiting period and then citizenship. My question is, how many will follow even this process. It has been so publicly announced that we can't deport them all, so what incentive do they have to follow the rules now? They are told we can't deport them all so why would they pay a fine and bother with the paper work when they know we "can't" enforce the law anyway?

We are seeing stories on TV where illegals are commiting crimes and released. Just today I saw that an illegal killed a man in a DUI car accident. He sat in jail awaiting trial and was released for time served in court. He was TOLD to self deport. He's back in jail again now.

Another case in Tennesee an illegal admitted to voting illegally and walks. And Homeland Security tells the voting commission to purge his records.

I seriously don't get what's going on. Our government officials appear to be complicit in harboring criminals. I know that sounds crazy but it just doesn't make sense to me. A flight back to their homeland just can't be more expensive than incarceration..or US services.

Another thing I would like to know is why don't individuals in cases like the DUI guy sue the Dept of Homeland Security for not having deported these people. Does anyone know if that's legal? I could swear that it is legal to sue a dept. of the gov't if you have a dollar value attatched to an incident. Anyone else know? I guess they would get tax payer money in the settlement but it could prove embarrassing to the gov't.

Oh well, sorry for my rant. I'm anxious for any other thoughts on the matter.
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Old 08-25-2010, 02:47 PM
 
3,073 posts, read 4,299,372 times
Reputation: 1536
The problem has a solution and Canada found it years ago. We should require every alien to have a workers permit before he can work. The permit will let them work at a specified job APPROVED AS ONE THAT DOESNT COMPETE WITH CANADIAN CITIZENS , No permit no work and NO one can hire an alien without the certified permit or risk jail and fines. Why dont we do this here? Answer is because we dont want to. The politicians want to play polictics with it and NOT find a simple solution.
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