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Old 05-22-2010, 03:11 PM
 
Location: Washington state
7,208 posts, read 8,189,769 times
Reputation: 1892

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I'm not a supporter of 1070. I think it's just a lot of playing politics seasoned with a dose of racism. However, as demonstrated by this case...something needs to be done.

Quote:
Madrigal's arrest and immigration record includes a staggering number of contacts with law enforcement since 1989. That's the year he was convicted of theft using a firearm in California.

He was deported a couple of times after that. Then in 1999, he was arrested for drug sales in both San Diego and San Francisco. Records show that he was deported three times that year between April and August.

He was arrested for drugs again in Stockton, Calif. in 2000. In 2002, he pleaded to third degree sexual assault in Denver. Later that year, he was deported again. And in 2003, records show he was deported three more times.
Investigators: Edmonds rape suspect deported nine times | KING5.com | Seattle Area Local News
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Old 05-22-2010, 03:24 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
378 posts, read 357,031 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Upton View Post
I'm not a supporter of 1070. I think it's just a lot of playing politics seasoned with a dose of racism. However, as demonstrated by this case...something needs to be done.
First, I don't understand how you think 1070 is racist or even playing politics. AZ took a stand, plain and simple, because the feds would not.

That story illustrates just HOW extreme the problem is and that is just ONE of what could be MILLIONS of violent and unconscionable criminals lliving illegally in America.

And it is unfathomable how ANY legal American citizen who reads that story could support and condone illegal immigration.



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Old 05-22-2010, 03:34 PM
 
Location: Washington state
7,208 posts, read 8,189,769 times
Reputation: 1892
Quote:
Originally Posted by desli View Post
First, I don't understand how you think 1070 is racist or even playing politics. AZ took a stand, plain and simple, because the feds would not.

That story illustrates just HOW extreme the problem is and that is just ONE of what could be MILLIONS of violent and unconscionable criminals lliving illegally in America.

And it is unfathomable how ANY legal American citizen who reads that story could support and condone illegal immigration.



I'm opposed to illegal immigration. I think the Democratic party's courting of illegals and the applauding of a Mexican ruling elite crook like Calderon is disgusting. Doesn't mean I'm blind however.

If the people of Arizona, indeed the Republican party, were really serious about the problem they would go after the root cause of illegal immigration..THE EMPLOYERS.

Both sides are obviously playing politics. Just like they always do.
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Old 05-22-2010, 04:02 PM
 
22 posts, read 33,612 times
Reputation: 12
It doesnt matter what color you are!!!

If you are talked to and dont speak english like you were born here, have papers. If I were in France, I would expect myself to have papers.......same goes here.
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Old 05-22-2010, 04:29 PM
 
Location: Verde Valley AZ
8,222 posts, read 9,100,976 times
Reputation: 10391
Quote:
Originally Posted by Upton View Post
I'm opposed to illegal immigration. I think the Democratic party's courting of illegals and the applauding of a Mexican ruling elite crook like Calderon is disgusting. Doesn't mean I'm blind however.

If the people of Arizona, indeed the Republican party, were really serious about the problem they would go after the root cause of illegal immigration..THE EMPLOYERS.

Both sides are obviously playing politics. Just like they always do.
Not necessarily. Yes, I blame our politicians for not doing something about the illegal immigration problem all these years. It's not like this "problem" just popped up a month ago. I never knew if they just didn't take it seriously because, while they gave it lip service every now and then, they never were very serious about doing anything. And yes, they spend more time squabbling than they do anything else so nothing ever gets done.

Two years ago a law was passed that spelled out employer sanctions/fines/license losses for "knowingly" hiring illegal immigrants. For a couple of reasons it doesn't seem to have worked all that well. I think the word "knowingly" in the law makes it easy for an employer to say they "didn't know" someone wasn't legal here. And the employee can show ID, social security card, DL...that was bought and paid for...and unless the employer uses E-verify they'll just accept it. I think employers have fallen down on the job in that respect.

Another reason there hasn't been more of a crackdown on employers is that there simply aren't enough "bodies" to do a thorough job. Maybe instead of leaving it all up to ICE they could hire more cops. Sheriff Joe does sweeps on drop and dope houses, just expand it to employers. Most employers who do get busted have been "snitched" on. Every bust yields fake or stolen IDs...not all but enough. Others have no ID at all and in AZ I know that in order to work for ANYBODY there has to be a copy of your DL, or state ID and social security card kept in your file. So, yeah, those employers need to be busted hard.

Everyone says that the employers just want "cheap slave labor" and that could be true. But the average wage in AZ is "cheap slave labor". If you have a job that pays $12-15 hour here you're 'in the money'. I do know that any Hispanic workers I have worked with...legal or illegal, who knows?...made the same wage as the rest of us.

Anyway....we're working on it.
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Old 05-22-2010, 04:43 PM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
10,395 posts, read 8,349,307 times
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Hey don't you know they just come here to work? If I run across the border (northward)... can I commit a boatload of crimes and just get sent BACK as punishment? Sweet deal in you ask me!!
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Old 05-22-2010, 05:16 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
378 posts, read 357,031 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by balljoint_ View Post
It doesnt matter what color you are!!!

If you are talked to and dont speak english like you were born here, have papers. If I were in France, I would expect myself to have papers.......same goes here.
Only in America, it seems, do blatant criminals have the privilege of calling the shots and demanding rights.
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Old 05-22-2010, 05:28 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
378 posts, read 357,031 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZDesertBrat View Post

Two years ago a law was passed that spelled out employer sanctions/fines/license losses for "knowingly" hiring illegal immigrants. For a couple of reasons it doesn't seem to have worked all that well. I think the word "knowingly" in the law makes it easy for an employer to say they "didn't know" someone wasn't legal here. And the employee can show ID, social security card, DL...that was bought and paid for...and unless the employer uses E-verify they'll just accept it. I think employers have fallen down on the job in that respect.
You're right - it's a loophole they use.
And yes, IDs are faked all the time.



Quote:
Originally Posted by AZDesertBrat View Post
Another reason there hasn't been more of a crackdown on employers is that there simply aren't enough "bodies" to do a thorough job. Maybe instead of leaving it all up to ICE they could hire more cops. Sheriff Joe does sweeps on drop and dope houses, just expand it to employers. Most employers who do get busted have been "snitched" on. Every bust yields fake or stolen IDs...not all but enough. Others have no ID at all and in AZ I know that in order to work for ANYBODY there has to be a copy of your DL, or state ID and social security card kept in your file. So, yeah, those employers need to be busted hard.
Good idea! A Sheriff Joe sweep of employers nationwide!

Quote:
Originally Posted by AZDesertBrat View Post
Everyone says that the employers just want "cheap slave labor" and that could be true. But the average wage in AZ is "cheap slave labor". If you have a job that pays $12-15 hour here you're 'in the money'. I do know that any Hispanic workers I have worked with...legal or illegal, who knows?...made the same wage as the rest of us.
I think most people, when it comes to the topic of "illegal alien cheap labor", think minimum wage . . . but plenty are making the range you mention . . . it's still not a lot of money but it's not like they're working for slave labor pennies and dollars.
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Old 05-22-2010, 05:51 PM
 
Location: Inis Fada
16,685 posts, read 27,895,432 times
Reputation: 7177
Quote:
Originally Posted by desli View Post
I think most people, when it comes to the topic of "illegal alien cheap labor", think minimum wage . . . but plenty are making the range you mention . . . it's still not a lot of money but it's not like they're working for slave labor pennies and dollars.
Here on Long Island, day laborers aka illegal aliens, are making $125/day cash, plus one or two meals! Cash alone is $625/week off the books or $15.65 per hour

I am a small business owner who does not employ illegals. My lowest paid tradesman earns $800 a week. After taxes (single guy) he takes home a few cents shy of $610/week after taxes on his $20/hour 40 hour week.

It's disgusting to think that there are employers out there who in order to stiff the government, and decrease their payroll exposure, will hire an illegal before they hire their fellow citizen.
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Old 05-22-2010, 05:58 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
378 posts, read 357,031 times
Reputation: 243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Upton View Post
If the people of Arizona, indeed the Republican party, were really serious about the problem they would go after the root cause of illegal immigration..THE EMPLOYERS.

Both sides are obviously playing politics. Just like they always do.
Ok, I understand your first reference to playing politics, I just don't think the legislation is racist oriented in any way.

You are of course, right about the employers.
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