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Old 04-14-2008, 11:29 AM
 
51 posts, read 37,446 times
Reputation: 13

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS2753 View Post
You're missing my point on several issues. First of all, I'm not some north shore Chicago liberal trolling in the downstate forum. My family goes back to the mid-1800's in Massac County, and helped to settle this part of the state. I know the history of this region. The potential of what could have been, but isn't.

Champaign, the U of I, is central IL. It's not southern, unless you're a geographically challenged Chicagolander. But that's another issue. I'm speaking generally of the area south of I-64, and specifically the area south of Route 13. If you knew this area, you would know that there is not enough farming here to fill any local grocery shelves.

Yes, "city folk" have their own limited perspective. But do to the multicultural nature of large urban areas, and the access to a more varied life experience, their perspective most likely has a larger world view.

No individuals have been bashed here. I'm speaking of the local culture collectively.

It's strictly a personel observation, from someone who spent a significant number of years living in other parts of the world.

The service member comment is particularly interesting, being I mentioned earlier in the thread I'm retired military.

I think the issue is that you're very pro rural areas, and very anti-big city. Which is fine. I try to maintain a balance between the two. Being that this forum has people, who are looking to perhaps relocate to this area, it is important to relate the situation as it is. The social norms that most people are accustomed to, don't apply to this region in many instances. School districts, transportation, etc. are likely different from one's prior experiences.

The rivers, Shawnee National Forest, and other natural amenities are very nice. The climate is better than alot of places too. But if you come here without a secure offer of employment and/or have kids of school age, you are jeopardizing your future, and your children's potential.

If one doesn't have to live on the local economy, and doesn't have children of school age, they might like it here.
Absolutely right. I have a feeling that BLS and I are the same person, but he has 30 years on me. So I could be talking to my future?

U of I is not in southern Illinois, I will echo that. It is in central Illinois. Anything south of Chicago is not "southern Illinois" has many northerners seem to think. It's a big state; there is southern, central, and norther. Southern is south of I-64, as he said.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,253 posts, read 1,542,292 times
Reputation: 1776
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian B View Post
At least consider the metro-east burbs of
St. Louis. O'Fallon, Fairview Heights, etc. Southern Illinois has been at a standstill for at least 22 years (my lifetime), with an exception of Marion. Marion would be by far the best place to send your kids to school.
Marion is a ray of hope. We'll see how things progress there in the years to come. Hopefully, the population density will expand out. If Marion, Cape Girardeau MO, and Paducah KY could grow in population to where they met in the middle somewhere, we could have a nice little metro area. Too much interstate rivalry and provincial thinking, most likely make this more fantasy than reality.

A little brainstorming on towns that I believe meet the criteria I listed for having inferior school systems. These towns are about the same size, with similar demographics and prevailing mindset among the natives.

Random list, mostly north to south from I-64.

McLeansboro

Carmi

Harrisburg

Eldorado

Murphysboro

Chester

Johnston City

West Frankfort

DuQouin

Pinckneyville

Anna-Jonesboro

Metropolis

Cairo, is in a whole separate category of bad. See my post in the Cairo thread.

Towns between Carbondale and Marion are better because geographical proximity to one another allows for school district selectivity and competition for students. Also, SIU faculty with children, have a positive influence on school district quality. The Route 13 corridor, and the people who live along it, has and have a more progressive "feel" than the rest of the region. I don't include Murphysboro and Harrisburg even though they're on 13. Vehicles seem to transform from Camry's to F-150's once your past Carbondale westbound, or Marion eastbound.
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Old 04-14-2008, 05:54 PM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,253 posts, read 1,542,292 times
Reputation: 1776
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian B View Post
Absolutely right. I have a feeling that BLS and I are the same person, but he has 30 years on me. So I could be talking to my future?

U of I is not in southern Illinois, I will echo that. It is in central Illinois. Anything south of Chicago is not "southern Illinois" has many northerners seem to think. It's a big state; there is southern, central, and norther. Southern is south of I-64, as he said.
It took me a long time to recognize this region for what it is. I love this area, and just wish things were different. If you have ties here, you do what your heart tells you to do. Just make sure you have the financial ability to avoid relying on the local economy. Either that, or toss whatever education you have, and prepare to do, in local phraseology: "good, honest hard work".

I don't like painting a rosey picture to outsiders who have never set foot here. The negatives outweigh the positives. Most natives think everyone should want to live here. They have no other frame of reference, because this is all they have ever known.
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Old 04-14-2008, 10:42 PM
 
Location: Chicagoland
81 posts, read 278,516 times
Reputation: 31
WOW...I must say you guys paint a pretty scary picture!

I guess I'll just have to pray for the best (literally) in regards to my children. We are coming to view a home in Mcleansboro (who made the list for inferior schools) and am open to that area per the online information on the State of Illinois school's report card along with greatschools.net. I also read that Benton's schools are ok per these sites as well.

Seeing things from your perspective, I guess I can be grateful that my children DO know what is outside of the Southern IL region having lived in urban IL for so long, but I still find it so hard to believe that so few people have had the know-how that there was life outside of Southern IL?!?!

Maybe I'm an optimist!
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Old 04-14-2008, 11:19 PM
 
9,404 posts, read 3,223,364 times
Reputation: 10305
Default Okay, how long are you going to beat this dead horse?

Imo, most Southern Illinois residents are quite content with their lives, and are right where they want to be. Further more, most don't give a rat's a** what other people think anyways! Just my opinion, of course.

Last edited by sandgirl; 04-15-2008 at 12:38 AM..
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Old 04-14-2008, 11:49 PM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,253 posts, read 1,542,292 times
Reputation: 1776
Quote:
Originally Posted by New2SouthernIL View Post
WOW...I must say you guys paint a pretty scary picture!

I guess I'll just have to pray for the best (literally) in regards to my children. We are coming to view a home in Mcleansboro (who made the list for inferior schools) and am open to that area per the online information on the State of Illinois school's report card along with greatschools.net. I also read that Benton's schools are ok per these sites as well.

Seeing things from your perspective, I guess I can be grateful that my children DO know what is outside of the Southern IL region having lived in urban IL for so long, but I still find it so hard to believe that so few people have had the know-how that there was life outside of Southern IL?!?!

Maybe I'm an optimist!
Nothing to be scared about. Your kids are not in danger. I just think large suburban school districts provide a better education.

Parents are the ultimate factor in a child's education.

I don't know what your experiences are with rural areas and small towns. If you don't have any idea of what to expect, you're in for a culture shock.

It always amazes me how those from urban areas, are surprised when they move here, that the amenities of urban living don't exist. I don't know what they expect from a sparsely populated area.

A few things:

Suburban type malls and shopping areas are 50 miles or more apart. One might have a Target, another one may not. One might have a Best Buy, but no Target. You get the picture.

If you shop at Nordstrom's, Neiman-Marcus, etc. prepare for a 2 hour drive to St. Louis.

Multiplex theatres, same as malls. If you like anything other than the top 10 box office draws, it's a 2 hour drive to St. Louis.

One Barnes and Noble in Carbondale. No Borders anywhere. Unless you take a 2 hour drive to St. Louis.

Have a medical problem requiring a specialist? It's a 2 hour drive to St. Louis.



There's little zoning or code enforcement within the city limits of these towns. You can own a beautiful restored older home, right next to a similar one in severe disrepair with Larry the Cable Guy and his disruptive family for tenants.

Some towns allow trailers to be plucked down anywhere. Vacant lot in your pristine neighborhood? Watch out for the rusted out rig being backed on to the premises.

The haphazard zoning and code enforcement, is why these towns are increasingly void of a meaningful middle class population. Land is cheap here, and most people with an above average income, simply build somewhere in the respective county. Above average income is anything over $30K a year.

Unless you have an employer transferring you here, or have family you want to move closer to, I see no reason to randomly choose this area for relocation.
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Old 04-15-2008, 04:12 AM
 
Location: Small-town central IL
68 posts, read 263,895 times
Reputation: 29
Default Green Acres is the place to be!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BLS2753 View Post
Nothing to be scared about.

I don't know what your experiences are with rural areas and small towns. If you don't have any idea of what to expect, you're in for a culture shock.

It always amazes me how those from urban areas, are surprised when they move here, that the amenities of urban living don't exist. I don't know what they expect from a sparsely populated area.

<snip>

There's little zoning or code enforcement within the city limits of these towns. You can own a beautiful restored older home, right next to a similar one in severe disrepair with Larry the Cable Guy and his disruptive family for tenants.

Some towns allow trailers to be plucked down anywhere. Vacant lot in your pristine neighborhood? Watch out for the rusted out rig being backed on to the premises.

The haphazard zoning and code enforcement, is why these towns are increasingly void of a meaningful middle class population. Land is cheap here, and most people with an above average income, simply build somewhere in the respective county. Above average income is anything over $30K a year.

Unless you have an employer transferring you here, or have family you want to move closer to, I see no reason to randomly choose this area for relocation.
Back in the 1960's, the disparity of urban/rural life was cleverly depicted by Eddie Albert and Eva Gabor in the sitcom Green Acres.

While "life in sticks" was certainly portrayed a bit "over-the-top" (needing a generator for electricity and climbing a pole in order to use the telephone!) in some places, it's not too far from being the reality-even now!

Truth be told: many of the things described about southern Illinois in this posting are also prevalent in much of central IL; at least until you get to the McLean/Tazewell/Peoria County line northward.

However, the medical community in Central IL is quite up-to-date with fine facilities in Springfield, Decatur, Champaign, Bloomington and Peoria. No need to travel to St. Louis, except in the most extreme of cases.
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Old 04-15-2008, 05:47 AM
 
Location: Norwood, MN
1,828 posts, read 3,135,811 times
Reputation: 871
Can anyone tell me why Cairo has faded so badly in the last 50 years or so? I know it was once a very prosperous city.It seems like it would be a cool place, with the merger of the 2 rivers there.
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Old 04-15-2008, 08:54 AM
 
Location: Metropolis IL
1,253 posts, read 1,542,292 times
Reputation: 1776
Quote:
Originally Posted by big daryle View Post
Can anyone tell me why Cairo has faded so badly in the last 50 years or so? I know it was once a very prosperous city.It seems like it would be a cool place, with the merger of the 2 rivers there.
Race riots in the late 1960's. The town never recovered.

There's a lengthy thread on Cairo that is more descriptive.
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Old 04-15-2008, 02:47 PM
 
51 posts, read 37,446 times
Reputation: 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by arpschneider View Post
However, the medical community in Central IL is quite up-to-date with fine facilities in Springfield, Decatur, Champaign, Bloomington and Peoria. No need to travel to St. Louis, except in the most extreme of cases.
Again, we are talking about the REAL southern Illinois, south of I-64, which is much closer to St. Louis than Springfield, Bloomington, Peoria, Champaign, etc. I have never heard anyone say they are going to anywhere but St. Louis for major procedures.


EDIT: My bad. I saw where you were making a comparison central vs. southern. Sorry about that
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