Amtrak Cuts to Trains Serving Downstate Illinois Only (Chicago, Arlington Heights: work, business)

[BUalumni]

Originally Posted by jdoll

Sorry to break your bubble Illini84, but remove tax the income from the six counties that compromise the Chicagoland area and the two IL counties in Metro St Louis and you'll find the remaining 94 counties die from lack of tax dollars.

Rural IL has always been financed by the other, more populated counties. I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but it has always been a fact of how IL funds it's state budget.

And before I get blasted from either side, check the state revenue figures. Plus I 've lived more years in rural IL than I've lived in a collar county and seen/heard both side of this argument.

Sure, it may be the "Illinois way" of doing buisness, to allow the bigger population centers to "pay" for the rest of the state. I can see the wisdom in sometimes doing this. But that is not the way that it has to be, or even should be. I grew up in central Illinois, moved to Chicagoland, and then moved back past (dare I say it) past I-80 (GASP!). I've been there and done all of that my friend. Even thirty years ago, I can remember thinking how backwards downstate Illinois was, for it's non-stop complaints and crude remarks about Chicago. I really felt this way believe it or not.

Once I moved up to Chicago though, I saw it for what it really was, and got a first hand account of what downstate's feelings trully where, and how divided this state has become. And you know what, myself, and everyone of my fellow Chicago transplants, know that these downstate feelings are more than justified!! You see, Chicagoan's like to pretend that they have a real knowledge of Illinois' true feelings, and that downstate farmers thank the almighty everyday for Chicago's presence. Just read this forum. These remarks are everywhere from forum members up there. They really are living in a delusional world. I've read a certain C-D member mention that Naperville was more exciting than Nashville, Tennesee??!!!!! Can you see the delusion here??

In reality though, Chicagoans haven't the slightest clue, because if they really did, they would know that Illinois isn't so simply split between upstate and downstate. Oh no my friends! Chicago has created so much anamosity in the past 20-50 years, that now you could really say there are about five distinct divisions in this state that are widening by the year, with little hope of seeing any immediate solidification, if ever. Now up there, I could talk all day to an eager audience about the legacy of Chicago's corruption and scandals that have made Chicago look bad in the press, but have real-world consequences for Chi-towns dumping grounds, down here. I've done it lots of times. But now, having moved back to Peoria, I am now yet another rambling, uneducated downstater, that is just jealous because I don't live in Chicagoland. It is amazing how fast Chicago jumps to conclusions about the type of person you are, just by were you live in the state. Because we all know how the educational system in Cook (Crook) County is just so comprehensive.

Here is a perfect example. Sadly it is only one of countless stories that you find in both upstate and downstate medias, about Chicago controlling every aspect of this state. Keep in mind, stories like this can be found in any state newspaper on a weekly basis.

Peoria and Bloomington, for years have been trying to expand their highway system. Springfield, or should I say Chicago, for decades determined that central Illinois hadn't proved itself "economical" enough to recieve such an upgrade, since it would end up being one of the most expesive IDOT projects in the states history. Well of course this recieved a huge amount of attention from all spectrums of the state, and was bitterly rehashed over and over again by Springfield's (Chicago's) lawmakers. Heck, I remeber reading in the Journal Star, how Mayor (Mob) Daley, who shouldn't even have a say in what happens down here!!, suggested that we toll this, and let "downstate handle it's own expenses." -Yes Mayor Rich, what a wonderful idea! If you want something to get better, just tax it to death, right? You and Blago are just fantastic in your economic infinite wisdom. Please, give us more.- I still have the article if you want to read it. Sorry, Mayor D. - but we have seen how well tolling the roads has helped you guys, and thanks, but not thanks-, is pretty much what Peoria, East Peoria, Morton, and Bloomington-Normal told Chicago.

One of the main arguments from Chicago was that of why should Peoria get an upgrade, when Chicago's crumbling public transit infrastructure is in need of some major repairs. I'm sorry, but the mess that is Chicago's public transit was neither caused by downstate Illinois, or even a downstate issue. Well, to make a long story short, after over a decade of debating, it finally got done, and it is really nice. Sure it cost the state a load, but after all, WE PAY TAXES TOO!!! Well as you can imagine, this gained us a lot attention in the legislature, and now we have Joliet and Aurora, begging the state to create a "direct" Peoria to Chicago highway so that "Peoria can benefit." What a load...

Now, has this been opposed by the Chicago machine? NOT A BIT! Why? Because Chicago knows that Aurora and Joliet are the two biggest, AND, two of the most struggling cities up there, and that like it or not, without them, Chicagoland with have some big shoes to fill. Chicago also knows how much I-55 has helped create a more solid economy between Joliet and Bloomington. But that was by chance really. I don't think anyone really predicted Bloomington to grow the way it has. And where is the fastest growing area of Illinois located?, by golly, it is right along the I-55 corridor, west and south of Joliet. Hmmm.... And when did that growth really start taking place?, by golly, just about a year after Bloomington started amping up. I know, what a shocker right??!! But now, we have Peoria, which is an already established market, and with greater moblity between the two, Aurora knows what they stand to gain, and the more Chicagoland can just pass it off to someone else, the better off it is for Chicagoland.

Now, I'm not going to pretend that Peoria's politicians don't understand what they could gain as well. But what they do understand, that Aurora and Chicago do not, is the negative impact this would have on all the farming towns around them. Chicago doesn't get that Illinois is blessed with the most fertile land in the WORLD!!!! Once you plow over it with some highway, the nutrients are gone, lost, forever! We have to be wise in our planning. Something that Chicagoland has absolutely no concept of ever understanding. Not to mention how this would affect the cities that Chicago would just plow through like LaSalle/Peru. So as you can tell, a VERY expensive project that helps out Chicagoland little is debated and fussed about in Springfield by Chicago lawmakers for over two decades. But an even more expensive project, that benefits Chicagoland, but causes thousands of conflicts and distruptions down here, is admired and the discussion happens much quicker. Heck, it would probably be built by now if it wasn't for the farmers and city planners down here flooding Springfield and Washington with letters to stop this project from continuing. You think the average Chicagoland resident has a clue? NOPE!

If Chicago was really interested in what was good for the whole state, instead of themselves, they would drive the extra 45 mintues from Bloomington to Peoria and not complain. Peoria is in many ways isolated from Chicago. There is no passenger rail line, or "direct" highway line between the two. Peoria's success has been it's own, so don't sit there and tell me that we stand to gain so much from this, because we don't! In case you haven't noticed, the laws and procedures of Illinois, for going on the past twenty years, have not really worked, and have put us on display, for a complete case "of what not to do" for the rest of the nation. I'm so tired of central Illinois doing so many things right, and then Chicago does something to make us all look like idiots. Chicago can whine and complain about how much money downstate drains from Cook, Dupage, Lake, Will, and whatever new county Chicagoland's sprawl is next to consume.

But like you said, the majority of Illinois' population live in and around Chicago. Maybe you should take a look at the spending that is happening up there with cities that are 100% dependent on Chicago for their life, instead of cities in Peoria, Tazewell, McClean, Champaign, and Sangamon counties that have little to do with, and almost no interest into the day to day activities of what just happens to be Illinois' biggest city.

[sukwoo]

Originally Posted by BUalumni

Sure, it may be the "Illinois way" of doing buisness, to allow the bigger population centers to "pay" for the rest of the state. I can see the wisdom in sometimes doing this. But that is not the way that it has to be, or even should be. I grew up in central Illinois, moved to Chicagoland, and then moved back past (dare I say it) past I-80 (GASP!). I've been there and done all of that my friend. Even thirty years ago, I can remember thinking how backwards downstate Illinois was, for it's non-stop complaints and crude remarks about Chicago. I really felt this way believe it or not. Once I moved up to Chicago though, I saw it for what it really was, and got a first hand account of what downstate's feelings trully where, and how divided this state has become. And you know what, myself, and everyone of my fellow Chicago transplants, know that these downstate feelings are more than justified!! You see, Chicagoan's like to pretend that they have a real knowledge of Illinois' true feelings, and that downstate farmers thank the almighty everyday for Chicago's presence. Just read this forum. These remarks are everywhere from forum members up there. They really are living in a delusional world. I've read a certain C-D member mention that Naperville was more exciting than Nashville, Tennesee??!!!!! Can you see the delusion here?? In reality though, Chicagoans haven't the slightest clue, because if they really did, they would know that Illinois isn't so simply split between upstate and downstate. Oh no my friends! Chicago has created so much anamosity in the past 20-50 years, that now you could really say there are about five distinct divisions in this state that are widening by the year, with little hope of seeing any immediate solidification, if ever. Now up there, I could talk all day to an eager audience about the legacy of Chicago's corruption and scandals that have made Chicago look bad in the press, but have real-world consequences for Chi-towns dumping grounds, down here. I've done it lots of times. But now, having moved back to Peoria, I am now yet another rambling, uneducated downstater, that is just jealous because I don't live in Chicagoland. It is amazing how fast Chicago jumps to conclusions about the type of person you are, just by were you live in the state. Because we all know how the educational system in Cook (Crook) County is just so comprehensive.

Here is a perfect example. Sadly it is only one of countless stories that you find in both upstate and downstate medias, about Chicago controlling every aspect of this state. Keep in mind, stories like this can be found in any state newspaper on a weekly basis.

Peoria and Bloomington, for years have been trying to expand their highway system. Springfield, or should I say Chicago, for decades determined that central Illinois hadn't proved itself "economical" enough to recieve such an upgrade, since it would end up being one of the most expesive IDOT projects in the states history. Well of course this recieved a huge amount of attention from all spectrums of the state, and was bitterly rehashed over and over again by Springfield's (Chicago's) lawmakers. Heck, I remeber reading in the Journal Star, how Mayor (Mob) Daley, who shouldn't even have a say in what happens down here!!, suggested that we toll this, and let "downstate handle it's own expenses." -Yes Mayor Rich, what a wonderful idea! If you want something to get better, just tax it to death, right? You and Blago are just fantastic in your economic infinite wisdom. Please, give us more.- I still have the article if you want to read it. Sorry, Mayor D. - but we have seen how well tolling the roads has helped you guys, and thanks, but not thanks-, is pretty much what Peoria, East Peoria, Morton, and Bloomington-Normal told Chicago. One of the main arguments from Chicago was that of why should Peoria get an upgrade, when Chicago's crumbling public transit infrastructure is in need of some major repairs. I'm sorry, but the mess that is Chicago's public transit was neither caused by downstate Illinois, or even a downstate issue. Well, to make a long story short, after over a decade of debating, it finally got done, and it is really nice. Sure it cost the state a load, but after all, WE PAY TAXES TOO!!! Well as you can imagine, this gained us a lot attention in the legislature, and now we have Joliet and Aurora, begging the state to create a "direct" Peoria to Chicago highway so that "Peoria can benefit." What a load... Now, has this been opposed by the Chicago machine? NOT A BIT! Why? Because Chicago knows that Aurora and Joliet are the two biggest, AND, two of the most struggling cities up there, and that like it or not, without them, Chicagoland with have some big shoes to fill. Chicago also knows how much I-55 has helped create a more solid economy between Joliet and Bloomington. But that was by chance really. I don't think anyone really predicted Bloomington to grow the way it has. And where is the fastest growing area of Illinois located?, by golly, it is right along the I-55 corridor, west and south of Joliet. Hmmm.... And when did that growth really start taking place?, by golly, just about a year after Bloomington started amping up. I know, what a shocker right??!! But now, we have Peoria, which is an already established market, and with greater moblity between the two, Aurora knows what they stand to gain, and the more Chicagoland can just pass it off to someone else, the better off it is for Chicagoland. Now, I'm not going to pretend that Peoria's politicians don't understand what they could gain as well. But what they do understand, that Aurora and Chicago do not, is the negative impact this would have on all the farming towns around them. Chicago doesn't get that Illinois is blessed with the most fertile land in the WORLD!!!! Once you plow over it with some highway, the nutrients are gone, lost, forever! We have to be wise in our planning. Something that Chicagoland has absolutely no concept of ever understanding. Not to mention how this would affect the cities that Chicago would just plow through like LaSalle/Peru. So as you can tell, a VERY expensive project that helps out Chicagoland little is debated and fussed about in Springfield by Chicago lawmakers for over two decades. But an even more expensive project, that benefits Chicagoland, but causes thousands of conflicts and distruptions down here, is admired and the discussion happens much quicker. Heck, it would probably be built by now if it wasn't for the farmers and city planners down here flooding Springfield and Washington with letters to stop this project from continuing. You think the average Chicagoland resident has a clue? NOPE! If Chicago was really interested in what was good for the whole state, instead of themselves, they would drive the extra 45 mintues from Bloomington to Peoria and not complain. Peoria is in many ways isolated from Chicago. There is no passenger rail line, or "direct" highway line between the two. Peoria's success has been it's own, so don't sit there and tell me that we stand to gain so much from this, because we don't! In case you haven't noticed, the laws and procedures of Illinois, for going on the past twenty years, have not really worked, and have put us on display, for a complete case "of what not to do" for the rest of the nation. I'm so tired of central Illinois doing so many things right, and then Chicago does something to make us all look like idiots. Chicago can whine and complain about how much money downstate drains from Cook, Dupage, Lake, Will, and whatever new county Chicagoland's sprawl is next to consume. But like you said, the majority of Illinois' population live in and around Chicago. Maybe you should take a look at the spending that is happening up there with cities that are 100% dependent on Chicago for their life, instead of cities in Peoria, Tazewell, McClean, Champaign, and Sangamon counties that have little to do with, and almost no interest into the day to day activities of what just happens to be Illinois' biggest city.

You might want to break your rant into multiple paragraphs. It would make it easier to read. (Although it still probably wouldn't make any sense.)

[BUalumni]

Originally Posted by sukwoo

You might want to break your rant into multiple paragraphs. It would make it easier to read. (Although it still probably wouldn't make any sense.)

What doesn't make sense?

[sukwoo]

Originally Posted by BUalumni

What doesn't make sense?

I'm not entirely sure what you are complaining about. I think you are complaining that Chicago(land) is:

1. Big
2. Growing
3. Powerful (politically and economically)

I suppose all three are correct. Short of wiping northeast Illinois off the map by nuclear annihilation its unlikely that any of these three attributes will change in the near future. If you feel that this is intolerable, may I suggest that there are many other states without a vibrant world-class economic powerhouse that you could choose from. I hear Iowa is very lovely.

[Steve-o]

Here goes the poor, pathetic, trolling BUalumni again... Always has to pinpoint me in every single one of his posts and display his retarded, uncontrollable, whimsical, BS hatred of Chicagoland.

[BUalumni]

Originally Posted by sukwoo

I'm not entirely sure what you are complaining about. I think you are complaining that Chicago(land) is:

1. Big
2. Growing
3. Powerful (politically and economically)

I suppose all three are correct. Short of wiping northeast Illinois off the map by nuclear annihilation its unlikely that any of these three attributes will change in the near future. If you feel that this is intolerable, may I suggest that there are many other states without a vibrant world-class economic powerhouse that you could choose from. I hear Iowa is very lovely.

What is so hard to understand folks? My post may be long, but it is too the point. I guess I will try to simplify it for those of you that don't get it.

I'm using the proposed Peoria to Chicago highway as an example of Illinois' corrupt politics.

But thanks again to you and Steve-O for proving my point that Chicagoan's are cluless as to the state of the state, and think downstate Illinois hates or is jealous of Chicago. Right on cue my friends....

[Drover]

Wah.

[Steve-o]

Originally Posted by BUalumni

What is so hard to understand folks? My post may be long, but it is too the point. I guess I will try to simplify it for those of you that don't get it.

I'm using the proposed Peoria to Chicago highway as an example of Illinois' corrupt politics.

But thanks again to you and Steve-O for proving my point that Chicagoan's are cluless as to the state of the state, and think downstate Illinois hates or is jealous of Chicago. Right on cue my friends....

I dont think downstaters are jealous of Chicago, but there is a definite and strong disliking of Chicagoans, you cant deny that.

[sukwoo]

Originally Posted by BUalumni

What is so hard to understand folks? My post may be long, but it is too the point. I guess I will try to simplify it for those of you that don't get it.

I'm using the proposed Peoria to Chicago highway as an example of Illinois' corrupt politics.

But thanks again to you and Steve-O for proving my point that Chicagoan's are cluless as to the state of the state, and think downstate Illinois hates or is jealous of Chicago. Right on cue my friends....

Hmm, I re-read your rant now that its broken into paragraphs (thanks!) I know that there is plenty of corruption in Chicago, but I don't see any evidence of it in your rant. Instead you seem upset that Chicago(land) exerts a tremendous amount of political power on the state level. I can see how this can be annoying for those outside of Chicagoland, but the political power is commensurate to its demographic and economic power.

[HeadedWest]

Originally Posted by sukwoo

I'm not entirely sure what you are complaining about. I think you are complaining that Chicago(land) is:

1. Big
2. Growing
3. Powerful (politically and economically)

I suppose all three are correct. Short of wiping northeast Illinois off the map by nuclear annihilation its unlikely that any of these three attributes will change in the near future. If you feel that this is intolerable, may I suggest that there are many other states without a vibrant world-class economic powerhouse that you could choose from. I hear Iowa is very lovely.

Love it or leave it?

It might be more tolerable if there were any accountability or honesty in Chicago politicians.