Indianapolis's population estimates are out! (Marion, Franklin: hotels, new house, neighborhood)

[Miserable Midwest]

Originally Posted by Broadrippleguy

not talking metro.
talking CITY limits.

City limits are arbitrary and totally meaningless in the world of business. Using city limit populations only serve those who live in small metro areas where the city limits are stretched out much farther than in most places. These people can then pound their chests and shout at what a big urban area they live in. When businesses want to expand into the "top 20 markets" or "top 50 markets", they are NEVER looking at city limits...it's always MSA. You can boast about city limit population all day long, but it means ZERO in the real world. Nada. Do you really think anyone believes that Indianapolis is bigger than Boston, Miami, Atlanta, DC, San Francisco, Detroit, Seattle and Denver? Seriously??

Also well Indy may have 2, 100 degree days how long is it going to be near or above that in austin?

They average 12 days per year where it reaches 100 degrees or above. I think people would be more inclined to be attracted to the fact that on the coldest day of the year, the average high temperature is 61.

[Broadrippleguy]

Originally Posted by normcrok8

These 2011 or 2012 numbers are merely ESTIMATES or GUESSES. The Cneus doesnt know anymore than anyone else. The only population totals that are official and actually count are those from years ending in zero. No one, not even the Census can predict what the population counts will be in 2020. These annual Census estimates should be taken with a grain of salt. The Census is actually a bit biased (I helped take the count in 2010) against the Midwest, Indy in this case, and know what I am talking about. This can be seen when comparing population totals between Indianapolis and Jacksonville. Both are consolidated cities and should be measured the same way, but the Census doesnt do that. They always look at Jacksonvilles total count (821,000) within Duval County and only part of Indys *balance* count (820,000). Bet when its done correctly and comparing apples to apples, Indy(829,718) is just a tad larger than 12th place Jacksonville (821,245). Indy is OFFICIALLY the 11th largest city in the country, not 12th. And Jacksonvilles population is slight overblown, because of the bias. The Census screws up the estimating all the time and did it to Atlanta, Chicago, Phoenix, San Antonio, Austin, etc. before the 2010 count. No one in Indy needs to worry. Although, I believe Austin and Jacksonville will officially overtake Indy by 2020.

jacksonville probably wont overtake Indy in 2020 cause Flordia isnt as highly desirable to relocate too anymore.
As some news articles said and this doesnt surprise me 50% of people that relocate to Flordia move away within 2 years............. its one thing to vacation to hot and humid and hurricane prone Flordia. its a totally different world living there.
Flordias fast growth days are numbered and the new hot relocating places are in the midwest and the south outside of Flordia and Texas and Indiana.
And thanks for verifying what i just said
+rep points for you.

[A2DAC1985]

Originally Posted by Miserable Midwest

(1)City limits are arbitrary and totally meaningless in the world of business. Using city limit populations only serve those who live in small metro areas where the city limits are stretched out much farther than in most places. These people can then pound their chests and shout at what a big urban area they live in. When businesses want to expand into the "top 20 markets" or "top 50 markets", they are NEVER looking at city limits...it's always MSA. You can boast about city limit population all day long, but it means ZERO in the real world. Nada. Do you really think anyone believes that Indianapolis is bigger than Boston, Miami, Atlanta, DC, San Francisco, Detroit, Seattle and Denver? Seriously??

They average 12 days per year where it reaches 100 degrees or above. I think people would be more inclined to be attracted to the fact that on the coldest day of the year, the average high temperature is 61.

Two things here:

I don't understand why people keep saying a city's limits are meaningless. Choosing to ignore them and saying they're meaningless are two completely different things. It seems to me that people will ignore city limits (in general) when they aren't favorable to their perception and feelings on said city. It's like asking, "Who has more money?"

-Person A has a bank account with $10,000,000 in it.
*Person B has a bank account with $100,000 in it.

Who has more money? It's obvious who physically has the most money.

-Person A is retired with a house, a car, a vacation home.
*Person B is retired with 5 mansions in different parts of the country, 2 yachts, a helicopter, 100,000 shares of Apple stock, mutual funds, bonds, CDs.

So now when the question of, "Who has more money" is brought up, people think that Person B has more physical money.

Using the completely arbitrary boundaries of a person's bank account/wallet, Person A still has physically $9,900,000 more than Person B. Cut and dry. End of story. It's a fact.

But if you change the question to, "With all the money they had access to, who has done more with it?", then it is clear that Person B has the most to show for money that originated from his bank account/wallet. And once taking that into consideration, people come to the conclusion that the person with the smaller bank account actually has more money, wealth, power, prestige, etc., than the person with a much larger bank account/wallet. That might very well be the empirical and objective truth. The downside to that is its not as easy to mobilize the money that went other places when you need more than $100,000 to do something.




...and meaningless?

How are taxes meaningless to businesses? How those taxes are spent is meaningless to businesses? Government (city) services that have subsidies for services/products a company provides/makes is meaningless to a business?

Arbitrary city limits decide where money is not so arbitrarily collected, spent, and/or distributed.

[A2DAC1985]

Originally Posted by A2DAC1985

...and meaningless?

How are taxes meaningless to businesses? How those taxes are spent is meaningless to businesses? Government (city) services that have subsidies for services/products a company provides/makes is meaningless to a business?

Arbitrary city limits decide where money is not so arbitrarily collected, spent, and/or distributed.

And just to put a real world example on this:

I talked to someone with Best Buy at one of their stores. It was asked, "So, where exactly is this store? Westfield or Carmel?" He told us it was Westfield. If the store was on the other side of the street, in Carmel, the building would have been made out of brick, per Carmel rule, law, whatever. So Best Buy decided to open up shop on the other side of the street to use less expensive building materials. Now, thousands of dollars in taxes are going into Westfield's bank account, instead of Carmel's, simply because of some arbitrary city boundaries.

[domergurl]

Originally Posted by Broadrippleguy

jacksonville probably wont overtake Indy in 2020 cause Flordia isnt as highly desirable to relocate too anymore.
As some news articles said and this doesnt surprise me 50% of people that relocate to Flordia move away within 2 years............. its one thing to vacation to hot and humid and hurricane prone Flordia. its a totally different world living there.
Flordias fast growth days are numbered and the new hot relocating places are in the midwest and the south outside of Flordia and Texas and Indiana.
And thanks for verifying what i just said
+rep points for you.

did you hit the gummy bears a little too hard last night? What in the world does this mean?

Would love to see your stat about people leaving FLORIDA as fast as they move there.

[missik999]

Originally Posted by Broadrippleguy

jacksonville probably wont overtake Indy in 2020 cause Flordia isnt as highly desirable to relocate too anymore.
As some news articles said and this doesnt surprise me 50% of people that relocate to Flordia move away within 2 years............. its one thing to vacation to hot and humid and hurricane prone Flordia. its a totally different world living there.
Flordias fast growth days are numbered and the new hot relocating places are in the midwest and the south outside of Flordia and Texas and Indiana.
And thanks for verifying what i just said
+rep points for you.

It's a totally different world living in Florida? How many years did you live in Florida to determined this?

[Broadrippleguy]

its not gummy bear or whatever hangover you want to call it. its the truth
and it applies to many places. not just Flordia.
Hawaii/New York also come to mind.

[normcrok8]

Originally Posted by Miserable Midwest

City limits are arbitrary and totally meaningless in the world of business. When businesses want to expand into the "top 20 markets" or "top 50 markets", they are NEVER looking at city limits...it's always MSA. Do you really think anyone believes that Indianapolis is bigger than Boston, Miami, Atlanta, DC, San Francisco, Detroit, Seattle and Denver? Seriously??

Wrong! City limit population is TOTALLY relevant, especially when it comes to federal funding. Last time I checked, federal funding was for CITY LIMITS POPULATION ONLY, regardless of the suburbs. In that case, only the central city matters. At the 2010 Census Indy was the 11th largest city in the country with 829K people compared to 14th ranked San Fran (805K), 18th ranked Detroit (713K), Boston (617K), Seattle (606K), Washington DC (603K), Denver (600K), Atlanta (420K) and Miami (405K). But yes, Indy is more like 30th when the MSA is considered.

[domergurl]

learn to spell BRG ... what does Flordia mean?

[msamhunter]

Originally Posted by Miserable Midwest

City limits are arbitrary and totally meaningless in the world of business. Using city limit populations only serve those who live in small metro areas where the city limits are stretched out much farther than in most places. These people can then pound their chests and shout at what a big urban area they live in. When businesses want to expand into the "top 20 markets" or "top 50 markets", they are NEVER looking at city limits...it's always MSA. You can boast about city limit population all day long, but it means ZERO in the real world. Nada. Do you really think anyone believes that Indianapolis is bigger than Boston, Miami, Atlanta, DC, San Francisco, Detroit, Seattle and Denver? Seriously??

They average 12 days per year where it reaches 100 degrees or above. I think people would be more inclined to be attracted to the fact that on the coldest day of the year, the average high temperature is 61.

In and of itself green flows across all mythical borders worldwide. To say city doesn't matter is though a complete farce. Company A looks to set up shop or relocate, the amenities of Bartow county Georgia means nothing to them. What matters is Atlanta. Now once they've decided on Atlanta, they very well may end up choosing to relocate to Bartow County BUT the point being, no one looks to relocate (individual or business) based off of a suburb. You don't hear anyone or any company dying to move to Naperville. That person or that entity is looking at Chicago period. That is the first and foremost thought. Only having chosen CORE city does then one get into the particulars of just exactly where in or near that core city. It's an afterthought and secondary in nature and usually where local competition comes in. Other than that, it's nothing local about it. It's core city vs. core city and only when that core city wins out, does the MSA come into play with regards to where you pay taxes. C-D people tend to have this glorious outlook on MSA's as compared to its core city but truth be told, MSAs are nothing but dime a dozen suburbs that 95% of the people couldn't tell you where they were, esp. without mentioning the core city for reference. If I asked you where is DeMotte Indiana, could you say exactly where it was without using google or bing, let alone know what MSA it belongs to?

Some people need their suburbs to boost their cities up. You can have a desirable overall geographic location but less than desirable subset of that same location, Miami for example. The core city itself is a crap hole but it has highly desired suburban areas. Same with Detroit.