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Old 08-14-2010, 11:32 AM
 
Location: Planet Eaarth
8,955 posts, read 17,967,678 times
Reputation: 7193

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Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post

Why don't you leave the technical concerns to the network engineers. There's a reason they're called 'engineers,' you know. Let them run their networks, and stop listening to the politicians, whose only goal is to increase their own power and control.
And I guess you're taking a long walk off of a short pier.......
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Old 08-14-2010, 11:39 AM
 
Location: Tyler, TX
15,209 posts, read 18,486,202 times
Reputation: 8052
I'm getting really sick of people with no technical clue whatsoever saying that the concept of "all bits are created equal" is a good idea. Those people (cough cough) have absolutely NO IDEA WHATSOEVER what the implications of putting that concept into practice would be.

Do you use VoIP? Say bye-bye to it. Your neighbor's P2P downloads are going to squash it like a bug, and you'll be lucky if you catch every other word in a conversation. Hope you don't mind some extra lag in your online gaming, either - but hey, what's a few hundred milliseconds, right?

Like I said, leave the technical decisions to the people that now how to make them. And if you think that your senator or congresscritter has any concept of how the technology actually works, then please don't vote. Or reproduce...
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Old 08-14-2010, 01:46 PM
 
Location: Lemon Grove, CA USA
1,055 posts, read 3,646,052 times
Reputation: 952
You really think it will be limited to P2P swagger? It is a slippery slope... one that corporations plan to use like a slip n slide. You'll see anything they can't make money off of get throttled. Don't be surprised when streaming video, VOIP and gaming become "premium services".

I don't think throttling should be used... bandwidth overage fees on the other hand I have no problem with. Do away with the unlimited plans and sell bandwidth packages... you go over you pay a premium like if you go over your minutes on a cell phone. Throttling on the other hand, for any reason, I have a problem with.

I pay for #MBs up and #MBs down... that is what I expect. To clarify in case of confusion. I know I won't get that exactly, I understand the technology, but I do expect my data to be passed through without manipulation. If you are slowing down how fast I receive data but I have yet to reach the cap you promised me then there is something wrong.

If there are concerns about the network being able to handle the load put on it by users then they need to be charging them for bandwidth.

And yes I'm qualified to have a technical discussion, lol.
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Old 08-14-2010, 04:28 PM
 
Location: Tyler, TX
15,209 posts, read 18,486,202 times
Reputation: 8052
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomSD View Post
And yes I'm qualified to have a technical discussion, lol.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TomSD View Post
Throttling on the other hand, for any reason, I have a problem with.
LOL, indeed.
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Old 08-15-2010, 12:41 AM
 
Location: Tuscaloosa
7 posts, read 10,592 times
Reputation: 13
swagger, you may be technically informed but you're jumping to the large corporation defense before realizing you are yourself obviously a consumer. That is of foremost importance. A company should provide a service without passing preferential judgement of provision due to personal use.

The biggest lie is 'unlimited'. Nobody has an unlimited plan. The sooner people join in a class action against these companies, the sooner we get realistic advertising.

Now technically speaking, throttling is essential to keep a network running. But throttling for the sake of "hey, stop doing that!" is improper. swagger, I hope you're taking into consideration the ever increasing load of traffic due to more consumers and silly websites like facebook and youtube as the basis for your concern. However you should also keep in mind that the infrastructure can also be improved. We are not in static resource mode and feeding on human femurs(wow, I got imaginative there) to provide use to all. Our networks are constantly improving, and technology is decades ahead of current implementation. With the advent of fiber optics and cheaper Petabyte drives(and all that storage goodness), the question of whether there is enough to go around is rather ridiculous. As such, restriction based on use is not what I support.

It's quite clear that websites provide an inefficient service. Having people reload their favorite music videos off youtube over and over again is one example. p2p is a highly efficient service, however it has roadblock after roadblock thrown in its path because corporations lust after the money in consumers' wallets.

Smart policies would include throttling p2p at peak hours, allowing it freely in set off hours. I'll just stop this post here, sleep a while and come back later.
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Old 08-16-2010, 12:09 AM
 
Location: Victoria TX
42,663 posts, read 75,347,085 times
Reputation: 36174
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post
NN is nothing more than a political buzzword at this point. There's two versions of the concept, and until someone can point to a piece of proposed legislation in the works, then there's nothing to talk about.
The point is, it is exactly the ABSENCE of legislation that will enable the erosion of NN.
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Old 08-16-2010, 12:17 AM
 
Location: SW Missouri
15,850 posts, read 30,785,377 times
Reputation: 22403
Quote:
Originally Posted by joey2000 View Post
Since when is the net free? I'm pretty sure even "net zero" started charging for freakin dial up (even if it still exists) years ago.

waah. People need to spend a lot less time on this damn thing anyway. And yes include myself. Go ride a bike or spend more quality time w/the family or something.
Ah, yes brother, but then how could *they* control our minds?????

20yrsinBranson
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Old 08-19-2010, 11:51 PM
 
Location: Mableton, GA USA (NW Atlanta suburb, 4 miles OTP)
11,319 posts, read 22,730,215 times
Reputation: 3895
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brill View Post
The internet is not currently free.
Access might not be, but most information sources on the net still are. It hasn't yet balkanized to the level we had in the days of "online services" (you know, CI$, Delphi, GEnie, AOL, Prodigy, and friends).

I personally see good technical reasons to throttle certain classes of traffic, and understand how and why it's sometimes done, but I also don't like the idea of an ISP or other entity throttling my connection in ways intended purely to maximize their own profit at the expense of my being able to utilize said connection.

It ain't a black and white world. And joey2000 ... my family is 1200 miles away. What do you think I'm using the net for ... WoW? More like keeping in touch, supplementing my regular phone conversations. Pics and snippets of random thoughts from friends and family can be quite nice to have during the day...
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:32 AM
 
3,651 posts, read 8,372,932 times
Reputation: 2766
Quote:
Originally Posted by swagger View Post
NN is nothing more than a political buzzword at this point. There's two versions of the concept, and until someone can point to a piece of proposed legislation in the works, then there's nothing to talk about.
So you'll be leaving then?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tightwad View Post
what the heck is "bittorrent"??
A way of downloading things (music movies etc) in a P2P kinda way. Net effect, it does what you used to be able to do with Napster, etc when they were free.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rcsteiner View Post
... my family is 1200 miles away. What do you think I'm using the net for ... WoW? More like keeping in touch, supplementing my regular phone conversations. Pics and snippets of random thoughts from friends and family can be quite nice to have during the day...
No argument there. All a question of degree..
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Old 08-25-2010, 07:48 PM
 
Location: 10110001010110100
6,385 posts, read 10,839,849 times
Reputation: 5589
Internet will eventually be just like smoking cigarettes or weed. Weed is arguably less harmful but illegal but the legal alternative, cigarettes are nothing but tasteless chemical packed, sorry excuse for a tobacco which many smoke because they are legal.
Most wise, health conscious and possibly lame people (like myself) whether they have smoke either or, are free of both.

There will ultimately be 2 Internets: legal, commercially or government controlled cleaner, lamer, consumer version and the underground version where the more liberal, rebellious and techno people will be using and yes, it might be illegal at one point even.

Government but more so commercial entities will sugar-coat the illegal, unconstitutional and unethical practices to look acceptable in order to make increase profits, it is all a business and companies hate free lunches!

[/endpreach]
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