Wi Fi Technical Question (wireless, how to, work, routers)

[JBrown]

Harry.....both posts

1st Post: Ground loops...yup can happen and does. I spend some of my time on an antenna range. Two RF and computer equiped sites about 1200 ft apart from each other both equiped with 6 axis positioners for modelling the patterns etc from various antennas from low VHF to 40 + Ghz. The two sites are connected with serial and GPIB instrumentaion bus/drivers cables. In 30 years what you described happened once. But, I agree it can happen. Of course if the remote building is getting AC power from the main house and done to code ,then the service panel in the remote is by definition a subpanel and dosen't have it's own Gnd rod. It is referenced to the Gnd. in the main house. BTW...when that happened about 5 years ago (an actual strike !) we had to replace damaged rf equipment and took the down time to also replace the instrumentation and computer interface lines with fiber optic stuff. So if you wanna get fancy, extenders of every type are available in fiber instead of copper, if that makes you happier.

2nd post:
a: I'm not sure what a service drop off the power grid has got to do with
this situatoin but you said it "If Bud is trying to access his parent's computers and is willing to pay for the access point, lives close, and the parents are willing, there is nothing illegal in setting up a network. If those parents also have an internet connection and are willing to share it with their children while they are on their property, that also is not illegal." And..it's legal wether it be wireless,fiber, or copper.

b: Regarding my "hint hint" comment. I chuckled when I wrote that and wondered how long it would take for someone to get bent outta shape about that. Congrats. At that point it wasn't clear if he even had tv,it wasn't until his later post that he said he had a dish. The point being,as you said above, it's not illegal for anyone of us to string cable on our property to an "outbuilding" and provide service there...and yes, as you correctly point out elsewhere,nowadays the system will shut down unauthorized boxes within a few days. So if you want service to this "outbuilding" you're going to have to rent a box etc...all very legal.

c: IMHO You're trying way to hard to be "understanding". I stand by my opinon of what the trend here has been.

d: Yes, I have actually built a snow dish and coffee can set up ! (I assume that's what you mean) Turns out a 2 1/2 Ghz the coffee can is a perfect size for circular waveguide. Also right at the MMDS system freq. (wireless cable tv) Oh God !.....another can of worms....

[harry chickpea]

"b: Regarding my "hint hint" comment. I chuckled when I wrote that and wondered how long it would take for someone to get bent outta shape about that. Congrats. At that point it wasn't clear if he even had tv,it wasn't until his later post that he said he had a dish. The point being,as you said above, it's not illegal for anyone of us to string cable on our property to an "outbuilding" and provide service there...and yes, as you correctly point out elsewhere,nowadays the system will shut down unauthorized boxes within a few days. So if you want service to this "outbuilding" you're going to have to rent a box etc...all very legal."

Not bent outta shape, just remembering that a lot of people on the net seem to think that once something is written, it is not only possible, but easy. Leading 'em down a primrose path might be fun sometimes, especially if they are humor impaired engineers, but it still ain't a sweet thing to do. Only slightly apropos, but sad to me, just this morning I got another forwarded email about how Bill Gates will pay hundreds of dollars to forward a message that internet explorer is great. This from a customer who knows better. <sigh> Now to perfect how to run my car on the aluminum beer cans I find by the side of the road and a little lye, like in "Back to the Future." I've got the basics; what I can't figure out is what the wilted produce was for... biofilter?

[BudinAk]

Originally Posted by LBSer

im sorry this is too funny. obviously the OP is trying to pirate internet..im not surprised if your sat TV is also pirated. any logical person who reads this will find it too absurd.. that if you can set up coax cable into your parents cable connection to your house... how in the world that your cable company does not reach your "area"...... if you live THAT close to your parents house.. this is ridiculous... although im a pirate too... when i was renting my apartment.. i was able to pirate an internet connection somewhere around my area..

Moderator cut: illegal

Nice try LBS, but you're assumption is WRONG!!! There is cable service to my parents house. There is NOT cable service available at my house 400' away, because there is a huge river seperating the two that the cable company doesn't want to fool around with stringing cable across...because I am the ONLY house on my side of the river. (why should they spend multi-thousands of dollars to service ONE customer?) This isn't a "different" property....this is on 57 acres of land my parents own. Anyway, I am not pirating anything...there are TWO cable modems at my parents house: one for my parents computer, and the other one is for me. For one thing, their cable modem is SLooooow! Mine is a high-speed unit. They recieve a monthly bill for their internet, and I recieve a monthly bill for mine. We also have our own satellite TV setup, and my parents have their own as well. NOTHING is being pirated or stolen!

Bud

[BudinAk]

Did some research on the web, and these guys (among many) appear to have the answer to my inquiry:

GNS Wireless LLC., Wireless Bridge, Point to Point Wireless Network Solutions, WiFi Hotspots, 2.4ghz outdoor antennas, 5ghz antennas, long range wireless, wireless network, networking, installations, install


Bud

[LBSer]

very well. now you explained the geography thoroughly. now i have another confusion. on your first post u said u dont have internet connection. but now u are saying your parents pay for YOUR internet connection and theirs.. and apparently your connection is fast and theirs is slow.. and on your first post u said you are trying to connect to your parents connection which is apparently slow... wow im confused with my question too..

i wonder though how u can have fast connection and they have slow connection if you are connected on the same internet connection... which makes me ask you now why you said you dont have internet in the first post??

[Niners fan]

You mentioned you needed 500+kbs. That's not very fast. If you can't access your parents' wi-fi have you looked into satellite internet like HughesNet? Generally you can get 1500 kbs from them.

[BudinAk]

Originally Posted by LBSer

very well. now you explained the geography thoroughly. now i have another confusion. on your first post u said u dont have internet connection. but now u are saying your parents pay for YOUR internet connection and theirs.. and apparently your connection is fast and theirs is slow.. and on your first post u said you are trying to connect to your parents connection which is apparently slow... wow im confused with my question too..

i wonder though how u can have fast connection and they have slow connection if you are connected on the same internet connection... which makes me ask you now why you said you dont have internet in the first post??

Sorry about the confusion...I guess I didn't explain it very well. More info:
My parents don't pay for my internet connection....I do! The bill comes to my mail address, and is addressed to me, not them. My parents don't have anything to do with it, except that my cable modem is located in their house. I have my modem connected to a common "garden-variety" WiFi router (Belkin FSD7230-4), which only gives me access when I am within 50 or 60 feet, and not at my house 400 feet away. So yes, I do have an internet access, but not where I want it. It only works if I sit in my car with a laptop outside my parents house, or inside their house. Therefore the reason for my OP: how can I get access to the internet via my modem when I am at home 400 feet away?

The 500kb/s may not be "fast" by today's standards, but it's good enough. (I can get a faster modem connection for more money, but don't need it to be faster. I don't know if Hughes satellite internet is available in Alaska...and I'm kinda scared to ask "how much"...) At this point, if I can't get the WiFi to work, then my only other option is to go to a dial-up phone modem @ 56kb/s. (No DSL available on my line....Aaarrrggghhhhh!)
Hope this makes sense...
Help!

Bud

[J Arp]

If I was doing it I would probably "redneck it" and flat out run cat5 across the way, but I only say that because I have a few boxes laying next to me instead of wireless equipment. The limitations for cat5 are somewhere around 300-320ft/100m (I was told there would be no math), but I know we've ran connections at work further than that without any noticeable loss. So for wireless this is what I would do...

Get two honkin' antennas, two wireless routers, and create a bridged network.

Depending on your distance you will go for a different db antenna...again I was told there would be no math...if you do enjoy math there are all sorts of wonderful equations out there about milliwatts times decibels times log this and distance that, then throw in some Fresnel effect...but for the range you are estimating I would suggest two of these:

WiFi | Directional Wireless Panel Antenna

You'll also need to purchase appropriate pigtail connectors to connect to the antennas on your routers. I think Linksys likes RP-TNC, again do some research if you plan on using different equipment than I point out. I'm not an expert on all this, but I work with it a lot.
I would opt for the 19db antenna to be safe, but if you are on a tight budget I wouldn't think going for the 13db and having -6db would hurt you too much, especially if you can boost the power on your routers...which leads to the following...

Get two of these bad boys from somewhere:

Newegg.com - LINKSYS WRT54GL IEEE 802.3/3u, IEEE 802.11b/g Wireless-G Broadband Router - Wireless Routers

MAKE SURE IT IS WRT54GL. You can actually use different brands and models than the above (read on the following websites), but I have this one and I like it.

Now you pimp your router with one of the following firmwares. I use dd-wrt and enjoy it. Turn that 60$ econo-router into a beast for free.
Just be sure to READ and make sure that if you do go with a different router it is completely compatible with one of the firmwares. The websites have a lot of good tutorials and wikis. I've heard good things about tomato too, but again I've only used dd-wrt.

DD-WRT :: News

OpenWrt

Tomato Firmware | polarcloud.com

Once all that is in place you can bridge the connections, fine tune it by upping/lowering the mW power on both of the routers, securing it with MAC-filters and encryption if you want.

Good luck either way.

[Brian.Pearson]

If I was doing it I would probably "redneck it" and flat out run cat5 across the way, but I only say that because I have a few boxes laying next to me instead of wireless equipment. The limitations for cat5 are somewhere around 300-320ft/100m (I was told there would be no math), but I know we've ran connections at work further than that without any noticeable loss. So for wireless this is what I would do...

How about using a phone line, instead?

[harry chickpea]

"The 500kb/s may not be "fast" by today's standards, but it's good enough. (I can get a faster modem connection for more money, but don't need it to be faster. I don't know if Hughes satellite internet is available in Alaska...and I'm kinda scared to ask "how much"...)"

IF it is available, figure about $300 up front and $60/mo +- and you'll need to wipe snow off the dish, and connection speeds average a little more than 4 x dialup speeds. If you can avoid it, and I'm sure you can, steer clear. You are getting some good leads and advice here.