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Old 11-12-2008, 10:14 PM
 
Location: TwilightZone
5,296 posts, read 5,304,689 times
Reputation: 1031

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WillysB View Post
There shouldn't really be a reason for a tech have you go to a 168.x.x.x number. That's a local machine, or as another poster called it 'nobody home'. Any PC with no internet configuration will always pull a 169.x.x.x. A 192.x.x.x is an IP assigned by a router.

The quad number I was looking for is what your IPCONFIG reports to your inquiry. If it is a 169.x.x.x then your PC is NOT talking to the router. That would be a wireless connectivity problem, local machine. If it is a 192.x.x.x then the PC IS talking to the router. Very simple. Very fool proof. The difference in the two reports > 169 or 192 dictates the direction for resolution.

Where is the router located? In the same room? UPstairs? In the garage? Are there electrical devices BETWEEN the router and the PC? Fridge? HVAC? Cable box or TV? Any lead lining in the walls? And yes, is there any kind of telephony device between the router and the PC? ALL of these things lead to understanding and resolving the connectivity issue. Right now, sounds to me like it's a wireless configuration. That would explain why either the cable or DSL BOTH had the problem.
Sorry,I said 168...it's actually something like 192.168.X.X

The router(you mean modem?)is sitting right on top of the computer tower on the floor under the desk. That's another thing the tech mentioned,is that sometimes even though it's sitting on top sometimes the signal doesn't actually reach all around so he suggested maybe moving it on top of the desk which I did. So no there is nothing in between,although there's a phone nearby. The walls I think are just concrete.

I think you're heading in the right direction with the wireless config and that's why the DSL and cable had probs. Whenever I call Vz tech support(which is about once a month now)they usually go in and do some configuring...so who knows,they probably have some conflicting info there in their instruction manuals they read to me over the phone from India
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Old 11-13-2008, 10:15 AM
 
4,608 posts, read 7,362,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StuckPA View Post
Sorry,I said 168...it's actually something like 192.168.X.X
Okay, so everytime you call Tech support they have you access the router, which is typical procedure. That 192.x.x.x is to access the router. I'm assuming a modem/router combo device unless you use a Vz modem and your own router. Once settings are correct they shouldn't need changing. Ever. But, they have to look for something. Watch the lights on the Vz provided device. One of them show connectivity, does it go out when you lose your connection. Not the one that blinks when you surf the net, but the one that says 'okay, internet ready'.

So the router being on top the tower could have been a problem but probly not. Moving it to desk top would resolve that.

Although the wife may be opposed you really need to try the hardwire CAT5 to prove the connection. If you get drops with hardwire then the problem probly exists somewhere from the router to the CO. If NO drops with hardwire then the problem looks definitely to be wireless connection. Sometimes.... just sometimes... wireless is not going to be a good idea. If the problem is wireless then it will NOT be a Vz problem, but something about your machine, your problem.

And yeah, I've supported DSL since the early days, though for biz customers. And it was with Verizon.
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Old 11-13-2008, 11:39 AM
 
Location: kcmo
712 posts, read 1,963,174 times
Reputation: 373
I don't know what you’re telling this guy.. here's a method to troubleshoot in theory a bad router or a bad connection with ISP (and believe me I've experienced the ISP part.. w/ DSL and experienced weird quirks with routers as well technically making them broken)

type ipconfig in command (start, run type "cmd") and press ENTER

That number you find for a gateway ping it.. with this command

ping 192.168.0.1 -t (example IP)
If the router is the problem... eventually..

you will watch it say reply, reply, reply.. and eventually it will say connection timed out if there's a problem with your ROUTER.. until it says reply, reply again..
If however the connection is your ISP then do this (and you can do these together in 2 separate windows) type on the command line again
tracert google.com

You will see after a while numbers and IP's pop in as this commands traces how you get to google..

What you want is not the number you already have up top.. you want the 2nd number listed whatever that is.. that is most likely your ISP's gateway (which can be confirmed by checking your router settings but since this add's more complication to the instructions I'm not going there)

once you have this number.. hit control + c to stop the trace or just close the window re-open the command window (see above)

and now run
ping IP FOUND -t

With these 2 windows open and running if one of them gets a connection timed out this is your problem.. if the ROUTER goes down it will take out both windows.. if you have problems with your ISP only that one will say timed out.. you can also hit control + c in the window to stop them and if they show lost packets at all that is most likely your problem connection, though technically ISP's can lose sometimes 1% and still be considered useable/fine

(Bare in mind that some ip's are not pingable.. meaning there blocked.. if this is the case.. you can just run a command like ping google.com -t as well)
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Old 11-13-2008, 12:15 PM
 
Location: TwilightZone
5,296 posts, read 5,304,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WillysB View Post
Okay, so everytime you call Tech support they have you access the router, which is typical procedure. That 192.x.x.x is to access the router. I'm assuming a modem/router combo device unless you use a Vz modem and your own router. Once settings are correct they shouldn't need changing. Ever. But, they have to look for something. Watch the lights on the Vz provided device. One of them show connectivity, does it go out when you lose your connection. Not the one that blinks when you surf the net, but the one that says 'okay, internet ready'.

So the router being on top the tower could have been a problem but probly not. Moving it to desk top would resolve that.
I'll have to remember to look at the lights when the connection goes out...which by the way is a prime day today b/c it's raining out,which is another variable I forgot to mention...

Usually when it's raining or about to rain is when it's guaranteed to go out...but not for a whole day like it now does about once a month or so.
It's funny but we can actually predict the rain before we even see it by how much the connection goes out beforehand! At first I thought it was something with the phone wires at the house b/c even when the wife went out to water the lawn when she went near the wires with the hose the connection would go on & off also.

As for it being on top of the desk now,it hasn't made that great of a difference.
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Old 11-13-2008, 04:06 PM
 
4,608 posts, read 7,362,106 times
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Sounds like fun. Next time you need someone to talk with you can put the water sprinkler in a position to water the wires, then call tech support. It'd be especially good if they made a truck roll to come out and trouble shoot. The wife could turn the water on and off, alternately as they discover a connection then lost. Sort of a three stooges scenario. They get paid enough, may as well go for the entertainment value.
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Old 11-13-2008, 04:17 PM
 
Location: TwilightZone
5,296 posts, read 5,304,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WillysB View Post
Sounds like fun. Next time you need someone to talk with you can put the water sprinkler in a position to water the wires, then call tech support. It'd be especially good if they made a truck roll to come out and trouble shoot. The wife could turn the water on and off, alternately as they discover a connection then lost. Sort of a three stooges scenario. They get paid enough, may as well go for the entertainment value.
Well the moisture doesn't seem to affect the phone reception,just the stupid internet connection. Figure that one out!
Btw support now does this thing where they say they're going to send a tech out but I never hear anything after that.
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Old 11-13-2008, 04:58 PM
 
28,607 posts, read 40,588,688 times
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169 is "nobody home". Seems that is what a lot of clients need to hear to grasp the concept. I've learned over the years that simple really is better when explaining techie stuff to non-techies...

I'm with the previous poster. You either have interference, distance, or strength problems.

Do you live in a stucco covered house? A lot of them have chicken wire in the stucco to give it a base to adhere to. Sitting in a chicken wire cage and asking a signal to get through it? Good luck. Been through that with a client. Finally got them to move the router. They were trying to get the signal through two exterior walls. Wasn't going to happen.

Check the angle of the computer that works in relation to the antenna on the router. Do the same for the one that doesn't. I find that parallel antennas is best. For example I work directly below my router. My connections are more stable when the antenna on the router is parallel to the floor.

Can you move the problem computer to the same location as the one without problems and run for a while? That's a sure fire test. If it has problems the computer is likely at fault, if not it's distance, interference, antenna angle, etc.

Do you use a fan on your desk? Electric motors and some equipment have interesting interactions. CRT monitors and fans or old telephones with ringers are fun. Set a fan just behind a CRT on the other side of a partition and turn it on. Wait. Pretty soon the CRT user is going to mention the screen is flickering. When they ask someone to look at it, turn off the fan. When they get there, no problem. Repeat.... Repeat with the fan running at different speeds...

I have a couple of other interesting stories regarding electrical and computers. One of which had an entire company laughing at me. Until I proved I was right.
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Old 11-13-2008, 06:23 PM
 
Location: TwilightZone
5,296 posts, read 5,304,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
Do you live in a stucco covered house? A lot of them have chicken wire in the stucco to give it a base to adhere to.

Can you move the problem computer to the same location as the one without problems and run for a while? That's a sure fire test. If it has problems the computer is likely at fault, if not it's distance, interference, antenna angle, etc.
It's not a stucco covered house,just concrete & bricks.

I'll maybe try the other computer down here if I get the time.
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Old 11-13-2008, 08:18 PM
 
4,608 posts, read 7,362,106 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tek_Freek View Post
I have a couple of other interesting stories regarding electrical and computers. One of which had an entire company laughing at me. Until I proved I was right.
Definitely. In the dial up days I'd ask users if the phone line was wrapped around a stereo speaker... just to get the point across. Co-workers would laugh at me.

Stuck, is there any kind of cordless phone in the area, like the 2Gh or 5.xGh. I don't deal with cordless phones so not sure of the frequencies. A cordless phone sending a signal might cause interference. If someone is using the phone may cause a problem. That's another reason I suggest hardwiring for a while, to verify whether or not you get random disconnects. If none, then something interferes with the wireless. And is the Vz service the old copper service or do you have FiOS?
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Old 11-13-2008, 10:29 PM
 
Location: TwilightZone
5,296 posts, read 5,304,689 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WillysB View Post
Stuck, is there any kind of cordless phone in the area, like the 2Gh or 5.xGh. I don't deal with cordless phones so not sure of the frequencies. A cordless phone sending a signal might cause interference. If someone is using the phone may cause a problem. That's another reason I suggest hardwiring for a while, to verify whether or not you get random disconnects. If none, then something interferes with the wireless. And is the Vz service the old copper service or do you have FiOS?
As a matter of fact we do have a Panasonic 6.0 somethin or other phone nearby,which may also explain why we didn't have the prob in the other place b/c the phone was in the other room. Now most of the time we're not on the phone when the conn goes down.
I think the wires are old copper since this house is so old,and no we don't have FIOS.
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