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I understand you're in the industry and feel a need to defend against often false statements here but that bolded statement I have a problem with. The ignorant investors are exactly the ones more likely to have their money at EJ, Ameriprise or other similar firms.
My issue with consumer ignorance isn't limited to my industry. If you sign up for a loan and don't understand it, it is your fault.
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Many posters here at CD have remarked in other threads that those are the very investors who should be OK paying higher fees because they need hand holding to prevent hurting themselves. I think all investors should take the time to educate themselves but I don't think ignorance should be considered permission to churn.
I never claimed ignorance was permission to churn but it is your responsibility at the end of the day
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How much annual portfolio tinkering is considered OK and what justifications exist for front-end loads?
Front end loaded funds should be held long term or at least stay within the same family. I personally don't use them and I can buy front end loaded funds at nav. I couldn't give you set numbers of what's allowed for tinkering but what I can say is some tinkering and churning are vastly different things
Last edited by Lowexpectations; 07-07-2017 at 08:57 AM..
In 2015, Edward Jones was required by the SEC to pay $20 million dollars for overcharging customers in municipal bond sales. Things like this should be a red flag that perhaps EJ is not the best business to invest money with. Also, FINRA sanctioned Edward Jones for 13 million for overcharging clients and charities on mutual funds.
Bond trades are a different beast and their sales credit was wrapped into the price and never disclosed in writing pretty much street wide. This still continues to this day however it was supposed to end sometime this year
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Going to EJ and having them select investments is like going to a car salesman, writing out a check, and telling him to select the car you are going to buy and drive. This makes no sense, as nobody would do this. So why let someone else pick your investments? Go to Fidelity or Schwab, get index funds, and self invest that way. Or use an adviser with Vanguard for only a 0.3% fee, instead of the 1.35% AUM fee that Jones charges.
This is how the vast majority of people handle their investments. Most people are too lazy to learn on their own and would benefit from an advisor per Vanguard's own research. People tend to make poor decision and paying 2%+ annually for your investments is typcially a bad one as well
How many times are you going to use the fee only guy? He or she is still selling their services just like anyone else
I can use him as often as I want, maybe twice a year. And you have still not explained what he is selling to me. All he is looking at my portfolio and making recommendations, giving options and let me choose it rather than churn / rebalance to fill his pockets.
I can use him as often as I want, maybe twice a year. And you have still not explained what he is selling to me. All he is looking at my portfolio and making recommendations, giving options and let me choose it rather than churn / rebalance to fill his pockets.
He or she is selling their service, how is that not clear to you?
He or she is selling their service, how is that not clear to you?
You have become so involved in defending EJ and other such companies that you are not able to see the other side. You defend their shady practices and use justifications as though the customers should have been aware of such snake oil salesman.
Selling a service??? That is a amount that I know up front and agree to it and get advice in return. No added on 5.75% load mutual funds with 1 % expense ratio that gets added on and churned and then I am told that I should be aware of it.
Thank God there are many people on this board that can see through your silly defense of such salesmen and are not afraid of calling you out on it.
You have become so involved in defending EJ and other such companies that you are not able to see the other side. You defend their shady practices and use justifications as though the customers should have been aware of such snake oil salesman.
I don't think I'm defending EJ at all.
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Selling a service??? That is a amount that I know up front and agree to it and get advice in return. No added on 5.75% load mutual funds with 1 % expense ratio that gets added on and churned and then I am told that I should be aware of it.
That doesn't change the fact they are salesmen too. But you should be aware of what you are paying for any service and if you aren't you are to blame unless someone lied or defrauded you
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Thank God there are many people on this board that can see through your silly defense of such salesmen and are not afraid of calling you out on it.
I haven't defended the salespeople rather it is ultimately the client's responsibility for understanding what's going on. You are attempting to call me out on something I am not doing
It's hard for clients to understand what's going on, when a lot is hidden from them.
It's not hidden it's in the mutual funds prospectus which most people do not bother to read much like closing paperwork on a mortgage. That's simply an excuse
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