survey shows Des Moines is losing people? (Cedar Rapids: work, illegal)

[WoodwardGirl]

Originally Posted by Stevie

RonnieJonez,

How can "illegal" immigrants keep Des Moines from falling under 190,000??? If they are "illegal" then they are not included in the census.

Besides, Iowa is welcoming "legal" immigrants not only to help save the population but to make Iowa more diverse.

That's another thing...illegals are not included in the demographics either.

Well... I don't think it strictly works that way. You and I might think it does, but remember the flap about census information in California and the idea that illegal immigrant population numbers were big enough to give California another House seat? Here's one article: Illegal immigrants likely to impact state census figures - The Business Journal of Phoenix:

and more: Should the Census Bureau Count Illegal Immigrants?

[mfrerkes]

Originally Posted by Stevie

RonnieJonez,

How can "illegal" immigrants keep Des Moines from falling under 190,000??? If they are "illegal" then they are not included in the census.

That is incorrect. Illegal aliens who fill out the census form or are interviewed by census takers ARE COUNTED in the final tally:

Count on it: non-citizens—even illegal aliens—are included in the Census. Think this affects the political system? National Review - Find Articles

Granted, many illegals do not fill out the forms due to fear of apprehension by authorities while others can't fill it out simply because of the language barrier. However, census takers counted 7,000,000 illegals during the last census in 2000.

60% of Iowa's population growth between 2000 and 2006 was the result of immigration:

FAIR: : Immigration Impact: Iowa

[Stevie]

Sorry bout that!

Thanks for the info.

[Plains10]

Most of the population growth is coming from immigration in the plains and midwest states. The only reason that states like Kansas are growing is because of legal immigration as well as illegal immigration which is not counted by the census bureau.
Kansas also holds the award for the fast declining county in terms of population. Lane County lost 16.6% of its total population in the last 6 years.

[mfrerkes]

Originally Posted by Plains10

Most of the population growth is coming from immigration in the plains and midwest states. The only reason that states like Kansas are growing is because of legal immigration as well as illegal immigration which is not counted by the census bureau.

Illegal immigration IS COUNTED by the census bureau. Please see the two links I posted above.

You are right about population growth and immigration, however. States like Iowa and Kansas would be losing residents if it wasn't for the illegals who take the place of dying old people/departing young people.

[Plains10]

Originally Posted by mfrerkes

Illegal immigration IS COUNTED by the census bureau. Please see the two links I posted above.

You are right about population growth and immigration, however. States like Iowa and Kansas would be losing residents if it wasn't for the illegals who take the place of dying old people/departing young people.

Sorry, I did not see the links. Thank you for the clarification.

[soothsayer1234]

Originally Posted by pepe1

Absolute jibberish.

The city of Des Moines makes up about 1/3 of the metro population. Hardly a majority.

Metro areas with a growing core city are exceptions, not the rule. Nearly every large city in the US loses population while subrbs gain (aging populations are a significant factor in this phenomenom). So, there really seems to be little evidence to support your growing core city - healthy metro area theory.

Chicago, hasn't gained in population since who knows when.
Same for Minneapolis, Kansas City, Milwaukee, and on and on and on...

The cities you quote are all in the midwest. Midwest metros are either declining or very slowing growing, per the twin cities and Chicago. The sunbelt, which by general consenses includes the lions share of the growing metros, grow in cities and burbs, with the cities annexing growth at certain points. The misnomer here is that the Des Moines growth is anything to write home about. Someone on here answered that question when they stated that Iowa is net losing people, and that any growth is just scavenged from dead small rural towns in central Iowa and unskilled hispanics. Just a re-shuffling of the cards, is all.

[soothsayer1234]

[quote=RonnieJonez;1903497]The only reason DSM's city population hasn't fallen under 190,000 is because of all the illegal immigrants that now populate the East Side.

It's interesting because so many people are against illegal immigration yet it is helping their cities sustain some of the urban core population, and in some instances, even grow. Truthfully, a lot of cities only care about proving their population numbers

Great point. Chicago also would be losing people net if it wasn't for the absolutly huge hispanic influx the last 10 years, even with the gentrification on the lakefront. Now they have a huge CTA crisis, and are paying for the quality of that growth. Influxes of hispanics, and I'm just being realistic here, carry a very large illegal element, which end up net taxing city services. In that case, many cities would indeed be better off losing population, and concentrating on quality, not quantity.

[soothsayer1234]

Originally Posted by Plains10

You think Iowa has problems with losing rural population? Kansas is losing rural population at a MUCH faster rate. In fact, many rural counties in Kansas have lost more than 10% of their population in the last 5 years alone! The problem with the Great Plains is that many areas were originally oversettled as a result of the Homestead Act in the 1860s. The area in the Great Plains was promoted as being very good for farming. Therefore, you ended up seeing a lot of in-migration into the rural areas at the end of the 19th century. When it was realized that drought conditions were very common and the soil wasn't that good in some places a lot of people started moving to the urban areas to seek jobs. That trend has been accelerating for over 100 years as farm machinery and technology has led to fewer people needed to run the farm, and the urban areas offered much more variety in terms of the type of jobs offered with usually much better wages. The rural areas in Kansas include many ghost towns these days with completely abandoned main streets, mostly vacant buildings, and many abandoned houses with windows completely missing and roofs caved in.

Maybe Hollywood can buy some of these ghost towns as movie sets. I say that only half in jest.

[soothsayer1234]

Originally Posted by Chicago60614

? Chicago gained roughly the entire population of Cedar Rapids from 1990 to 2000.

And they were almost 100% hispanic. At the same time, they lost as many blacks and anglos. The hispanics are the ONLY reason Chicago did not lose people that decade