How can we make Iowa more appealing (Des Moines, West Des Moines: real estate, crime rates)

[Chicago60614]

I agree, end of conversation, very random thread to be having it in, haha. For what it's worth I've spent my time here on Kedzie in Logan Square, Uptown, and a year on Diversey in Lincoln Park (which according to the zip in my screen name, must have been when I joined this forum).

[capitalcityguy]

Originally Posted by texastrigirl

I grew up in Sioux City and graduated from U of Iowa in Iowa City. I moved to Denver after college then on to Austin TX and now Seattle. I just can't ever see going back. It's a big big big world out there. Much of it for me is the weather and the lack of opportunity for my husband who is a big city kid (think LA, San Fran, NYC) and works in high tech. Also I would miss the mountains too much. My husband enjoys visiting Iowa City and Okoboji but beyond that he calls Iowa "the frozen tundra" as we have been snowed in far too many times with subzero temps when home for Christmas. I always think of Iowa as a great place to have a childhood but not an adulthood. But to each his own. A few of my friends who still live there adore it and have very happy lives.

What does this post add to the topic - How do we make Iowa more appealing? - other than contributing the same old tired commentary and stereotypes on life in Iowa? Maybe that was your goal and if so, mission accomplished and congratulations to you.

[texastrigirl]

By understanding why people leave, you might be able to understand how to make it more appealing to others who have never been there. My point is you can't change the topography, weather or climate which is what keeps many people away. That is just a fact and a matter of personal preference for most. You could potentially try to add jobs in high tech or some other fast growing industry. A good friend of mine works at the COC in SC and it is his mission daily to attract new businesses to the region. No small feat at all - esp. competing with the myriad of tax breaks offered by the State of South Dakota.

I posted on another thread titled "is SC all that bad?" and you will see that I have a lot of positive points about it and Iowans. I still wear my U of I sweatshirts proudly.

[IndiaLimaDelta]

I lived in Iowa for a few years about a decade ago. At my work back then, most of us were transplants from elsewhere -- the joke was "nobody comes to Iowa except because of jobs or family." I have fond memories of my time in Iowa, mostly.

Iowa has many wonderful things to offer such as low stress life, low cost of housing and living, low crime in most areas, etc. The quality of living as measured traditionally can be good in some parts of Iowa.

However, there are some significant tough sells about Iowa -- the already strongly entrenched reputation of a being a rural, agricultural state (despite the fact that service is the larger part of economy than agriculture), the sheer distance from most populated areas, tough winters and hot, humid summers and lack of urban amenities (or beautiful outdoor areas -- mountains or ocean -- for that matter). Nonetheless, these could be mitigated.

Des Moines could have been a very attractive urban magnet, but I believe a series of decisions made quite a while back to spread out development across the state has hurt its ability to be an urban magnet. For example, had Des Moines hosted a large university area the likes of Iowa City, its combination of urban work areas, "hip" university area and suburban developments could have been much more attractive.

More fundanmentally, however, I think Iowa's political and business leaders simply do not understand what attracts upscale, high-tech profesional work force in today's environment. Simple mathematics of high pay/low cost of living + decent schools + safety are no longer sufficient in attracting those who vote with their feet and move to places like Seattle, WA, Austin, Texas and Fairfax, VA.

Most educated population today seek -- in addition to those traditional factors -- a great lifestyle. This means interesting cultural and entertainment attractions, outdoor activities, varied and diverse ethnic restaurants, etc. Localities have to compete to attract these elements if they are to attract the people who follow them.

People forget, for example, that Seattle was, as someone described it, "a cow town" only a couple of decades ago. When the logging, port and aviation (Boeing) industries hit bad times, there were even bill boards asking the last person to leave Seattle to "please turn the lights off." Now it's not too difficult to spot Iowa car plates in the Pacific Northwest -- indeed there are thousands of transplants from Iowa there.

I am, of course, not suggesting that Des Moines could, or should, become Seattle, which has its own problems.

There is a certain autocatalytic relationship between these amenities and this kind of population that "bounce off each other" that is extremely difficult to establish. It takes a very strong, concerted and sustained effort to establish this trend. Either that or the area has to strike lottery-lucky with some random inventor/entrepreneur developing a multi-billion dollar business in the area.

More specifically, I think Iowa needs to do something drastic such as establishing Special Economic Zones (SEZs) like a number of Asian countries did a while back (only, instead of offering low cost labor, showcase highly educated and hard-working work force) and provide not only highly preferential tax and regulatory incentives, but also commitment to recruit and bring associated amenities, e.g. ethnic restaurants, upscale shopping, well-developed and high-tech housing etc.

These things must be done in addition to becoming far more business friendly -- justified or not, Iowa has a strong reputation of being anti-business, high-regulation and, some would say, anti-personal freedom.

[h20loo-iowa]

You will be reported for telling the truth.

[Dport7674]

Originally Posted by h20loo-iowa

You will be reported for telling the truth.

I thought you made a dramatic post/speech about leaving the forum?

[DMRyan]

It's hard to argue with IndiaLimaDelta's points. We can't do much about the weather or scenery and will always be at a natural disadvantage in comparison to sexier places. All we can do is keep focusing on a better quality of life and better job opportunities than some of the places with more beautiful locations can offer.

This will sound conceited, but I'm a firm believer that there is a pretty dramatic difference between Des Moines (and maybe a very select few other locations) and the rest of Iowa when it comes to everything from the economy to quality of life amenities to ethnic restaurants and better shopping--not to say that DSM doesn't have major room for improvement too, but in comparison to many parts of this state, this metro is a magnet.

Of course some would argue that what makes Iowa great isn't the amount of hip downtown restaurants or high end boutiques in a West Des Moines faux-urban strip mall.

[IndiaLimaDelta]

Originally Posted by DMRyan

This will sound conceited, but I'm a firm believer that there is a pretty dramatic difference between Des Moines (and maybe a very select few other locations) and the rest of Iowa when it comes to everything from the economy to quality of life amenities to ethnic restaurants and better shopping--not to say that DSM doesn't have major room for improvement too, but in comparison to many parts of this state, this metro is a magnet.

That is statistically true. The greater Des Moines area has been growing at the expense of the more rural areas of the state, which have experienced dramatic population outflow. However, Des Moines is not capturing all of that outflow -- the state as a whole is experiencing net out-migration.

One of the comments I hear from high income individuals with some ties to Iowa (usually family) is "What's the point about having more disposable income there -- there is nothing to do with the money."

That's of course unfair, but does capture the issue of good cost of living not making up for lack of lifestyle amenities.

[Sparks]

Originally Posted by IndiaLimaDelta

.

One of the comments I hear from high income individuals with some ties to Iowa (usually family) is "What's the point about having more disposable income there -- there is nothing to do with the money."

That's of course unfair, but does capture the issue of good cost of living not making up for lack of lifestyle amenities.

We are actively persuing a move to the DSM area next spring from the Washington DC area. You've just made it sound even better to me. We are sick of the congestion, traffic, crime, fast-paced life. I'm really hoping Iowa will slow me down We've looked at the areas around DSM and Iowa City and I found the job market in DSM more appealing. I would not consider it high-paying though. I'm anticipating my pay will be cut in half from DC to DSM.

[IndiaLimaDelta]

Originally Posted by Sparks

We are actively persuing a move to the DSM area next spring from the Washington DC area. You've just made it sound even better to me. We are sick of the congestion, traffic, crime, fast-paced life. I'm really hoping Iowa will slow me down We've looked at the areas around DSM and Iowa City and I found the job market in DSM more appealing. I would not consider it high-paying though. I'm anticipating my pay will be cut in half from DC to DSM.

"The Washington DC area" is a rather vague term. There is a world of difference from, say, Georgetown and Clarendon on the one hand and Ashburn and Centreville on the other hand.

Before you make such a drastic move, have you looked at outer areas, especially the exurbs, of Northern Virginia?

My wife often speaks of Ashburn as West Des Moines, only with more money, more expensive houses and more multi-ethnic residents.

Depending on where in the Des Moines area you go, you will also experience some traffic congestion or crime. And the more desirable areas of Des Moines suburbs are also not exactly cheap (though much less costly than desirable areas in larger metro areas). You probably should not expect any dramatic changes other than housing price difference and the ethnic makeup (and related issues like lack of ethnic dining).

A former colleague of mine moved from a safe area of SoCal to a very nice area of Iowa and had her house burglarized within months. She felt extremely violated and said to me "why the heck did I move here if I am going to experience worse crime than I ever experienced in SoCal!"

That's probably the exception rather than the norm, but people who expect some sort of suburban paradise can occasionally get a rude awakening in Des Moines. In point of fact, Des Moines has a higher crime index than the US national average.

As I wrote before, there are some good benefits to moving to the area, but you want to move their with your eyes wide open rather than based on limited, unrealistic expectation of significant differences from nicer parts of NoVA.

My wife is from there and she and I would make a lot more money there than we do in Northern Virginia (where we still do very well financially) due to scarcity there, but we decided in the end that the negatives were just too hard for us to overcome. These negatives included the lack of ethnic dining, no ultra modern shopping (no Trader Joe's, Wegmans, etc.), the insular attitude of many locals ("I never lived elsewhere and don't care about other places either"), surprisingly poor school quality (locals often speak highly of their schools, but they do rather below average compared to other highly desirable areas of the country) as well as hostility to home schooling (both of which we attribute to the militancy of the teachers union there) and so on.

We settled in Ashburn (although we might move to Hampton Roads shortly for work reasons) and we find the area extremely safe, commute time is only 15-20 minutes and very friendly neighbors as well as efficient, not fast-paced, way of life, not to mention all the benefits of being close to the Beltway like access to museums, shopping, food, etc., not to forget the highly educated, yet diverse nature of the population. It's a bonus that the state has a tolerant policy toward home schooling.