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Old 07-30-2010, 02:16 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,424,680 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eloy View Post
You say lies. Jews and religions based on their dogmas were the most severe murderers. And "West" is created on money of Jews. Between you there are no distinctions. Category:American serial killers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
There were no "Moslems" in 8 century.
What the heck does this have to do with anything? Category:American serial killers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There were Muslims in the 8th century.

September 24, 622 This migration, called Hijra in Arabic, started on September 24, 622. This marks the beginning of Islam, and the Muslim calendar starts with this date.

Christianity was in fact the most violent of religions historically. Its attempt to unify its church and the church heresy killed its own and then killed or exiled the Jews.

Islam has also been on the receiving end of the Christian violence historically and once again the Jews got caught in the violence because all along the way as the crusaders headed to take back Jerusalem from the Muslims they slaughtered Jews along the way.
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:02 PM
 
Location: Richardson, TX
8,701 posts, read 11,834,674 times
Reputation: 3727
Yes please for to say.
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:09 PM
 
5,906 posts, read 5,185,281 times
Reputation: 4536
Ok, let's try breaking this down, line by line...

Quote:
Originally Posted by eloy View Post
He has refused a film
Who is 'he'?

Quote:
...and has continued polemic.
As have we all.

Quote:
As. As.
W-what??

Quote:
Accept Islam and SHARIA .
No, thank you.

Quote:
Probably to you there will arrive mind.
No, I won't. (Are you asking if I'll accept Islam and Sharia???????)

Quote:
Yes... Myhamed (prophet) - pagan God.
No, Muhammed=A man.

Dionysus=Pagan God, Thor=Pagan God.

I'm sorry, I honestly cannot comprehend your posts.




Quote:
Originally Posted by PanTerra View Post
Yes please for to say.
A coconuts bunch lovely have I.



Anyone have a Tylenol? My head hurts from doing this -->
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Happy wherever I am - Florida now
3,359 posts, read 10,909,466 times
Reputation: 3838
Imanway, you still didn't answer my full questions -

1) If sharia is just for muslims, then why are non-muslims threatened with death for mocking mohammed?

2) If sharia was to become law for muslims within western countries, then are we non-muslims suppose to sit back if one of the punishments inflicted (such as cutting off a hand) is the sentence when it's against our morals and laws?
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:18 PM
 
Location: Planet Water
815 posts, read 1,376,150 times
Reputation: 199
Yes. Pagan Gods are people. There is one more God - Salavat , Ebun ...

"West" has forgotten the ancient roots and native moral values... They can pass any new law. Will not be worse. They do not wish to learn real history of mankind. They will see the bitter truth: "West" did not invent moral qualities. All their history - a bluff and errors from Skaliger chronology.Accept, accept sharia. Probably you awake to give rise to more children. You Barbarians - aggressive defenders of the moral values.

Last edited by eloy; 07-30-2010 at 04:30 PM..
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:26 PM
 
5,906 posts, read 5,185,281 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eloy View Post
Yes. Pagan Gods are people. There is one more God - Salavat , Ebun ...

"West" has forgotten the ancient roots and native moral values... They can pass any new law. Will not be worse.
So, what you are saying (possibly?) is that the 'west' would do better with sharia? because it's ancient? more moral, perhaps?

If that's not what you're saying, you're OFF-TOPIC AGAIN.

This thread is about SHARIA, not ancient roots in your country, or your native pagan moral values...or whatever it actually is you're trying to communicate to us.

I'm gonna go grab a drink, I can't cope.
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:43 PM
 
Location: Planet Water
815 posts, read 1,376,150 times
Reputation: 199
No. Islam = political party. It not moral values. SHARIA - this law created by the person. Natural Moral values are formed in a stream of thousand thousand years \ Moral values come from Gods . You saw the Divine laws?))) Sheriyat is an unreasonable child if to compare to precepts of ancient native gods.
How many laws at the Allah?
We had a choice. What religion to accept for New System of Public Safety. When We have looked in the Koran and in the Bible.... We were in a shock (Compulsion. Hatred kindling to other groups of people. Murder and parasitism propagation...)
. We have passed laws and foundations of our ancient "pagan" Gods - fathers. Without discussion.
Well. . Their way of life. The West is based on values from Abraams religion.

The argument was: at us link with our ancient foundations (Christianity and ProWestern politicians could not destroy) was not broken.
There is still an important factor - genes. Human genes enter the conflict (with another's way of life). Therefore it is impossible to look three hours of the preacher or to read the Koran and to shout: " "True, True! It is my God " ... Then it is possible to get to strong depression. As probably to destroy the nation. If to pass another's laws and Gods (Gods and Divine laws are created by each nation). Acceptance of another's laws, destroys the gene information. (The Christianity and political trends prove it) Such people become hostages of the Coca Cola and Tyrants.

Last edited by eloy; 07-30-2010 at 05:28 PM..
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Old 07-30-2010, 06:33 PM
 
365 posts, read 436,826 times
Reputation: 87
I read this webpage about Islam and Sharia Law and it shocked me.

http://www.muslimdangers.webege.com/
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Old 07-30-2010, 10:26 PM
 
Location: Somewhere out there
9,616 posts, read 11,369,507 times
Reputation: 3735
Quote:
Originally Posted by imanway View Post
lie? LOL,but Sites which broadcast false information and news is very silly as fabricate the truth, take a small part of it and add a hundred lies.


Almost, kill me,the ridiculous news


really, It seems that people will never kick Dead dog
So... we should disregard all the western news media stories about Islam? I understand thee's a lot of bias in the Western news, but don't you think there's also bias in the Middle Eastern news as well? Anti-American presentations for instance? We're told often that the majority of ME residents HATE Americans, and want us all dead. Every man, woman and child.

I look around at the everyday peace-loving citizens of my small town and hey don't look so blood-thirsty and hate-filled as your media paints them to be. Most of them just want to live in peace, and not live in constant fear of Islamic fanatics.

So... what's the truth on that point,
Quote:
Originally Posted by imanway View Post
yes Sgoldie sharia is not imposed on non-muslims as you know You can not control the reaction of others may be violent (Must not be violent) But I am surprised why non-Muslims do not respect our feelings when they are insult our religion

Well, for one thing, we didn't fly a plane into twin NYC towers, killing thousands of innocents.

So, Note that any Christian or Jew here Will never allow me to criticize her/his religion, I am surprised when I criticized America's war on Iraq, you will find many Americans to justify without conscience and I accuse me I am anti-American I wonder Only for their own state even though it assaulted on the freedom of other countries and destroyed.

Understand that your theocracy is homogenous. You yourself tell us that the religion is the state. So if the state wages war on another country, it supposedly has the approval of all it's citizens. (Of course, if you disagree, you go to a brutal jail, but not before the public floggings.... Nice!)

That's just not so in America. After all, we voted George W Bush and his war-mongering cronies out of office last time, and Prez. Obama is supposed to work to end those wars. The sooner the better in my opinion, and in the opinions of perhaps 45 to 55% of all Americans. So don't paint us all with the same brush!

Remember: our form of government allows us to openly express our feelings, without fear of disciplinary action. no public flogging or stonings for disagreeing with the government/church (though I'm sure the Christians would sorta like that one...)


Where democracy while I was assaulted and violated and exterminated the others.

Don't know. What country were you in?

look, any Americans justify here certainly he/she do not deserve respect certainly.

Agreed! We agree! Cruel and hostile Americans are not tolerated, but we don't stop them by brutal public humiliation either. We have a legal system that guarantees the rights of the innocent, and even of the guilty, against cruel and unusual punishment or false accusation. We don't operate by the Napoleonic Code on this side of the Atlantic!


Constitution that claims the democracy and adopts the war is never never respected nor Estimator ..

Actually, it's quite possible that George "W" violated the US Constitution. But remember: he's gone now.

if it was my country I wouldn't love her
We chose to correct the actions of bad politicians, and make amends to the victims of unjust actions. Proven many times in the past.

We're also not perfect, but for sure neither is Islam. Don't you agree?


Quote:
Originally Posted by imanway View Post
No, not for speech about the sharia but It came to my mind after Sgoldie's asking to me, Adopts America's war on Iraq makes me surprised when its people say we are the people of democracy and freedom

it provokes me as Sharia would be provoke you also how the Contradiction!
Let's address my OP again, shall we? Again: what advantage does sharia law offer the Est? You haven't addressed this singular question yet, you just defend Islam and denounce the American war(s) in the ME & Afghanistan. How about answering the specific question instead of political and religious proselytizing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rayneinspain View Post
As with most countries, the U.S. leaders are never elected in by 100% of the voters. There was never 100% American agreement for the Iraq war or any other, for that matter.

BINGO.

I've already told you in a DM what my feelings are regarding the wars, and that still stands. As an American it is my RIGHT to disagree with my government, and I do so within a secular society with secular laws.

I know that the subject is close to your heart because of your own location...however, the subject OF THIS THREAD is that of sharia, NOT the Iraq war.

BINGO II

That has nothing to do with democracy and freedom, but everything to do with the rules of this website.

So, back to the subject at hand:

Why would Westerners want or need Sharia?

The common message from us westerners is that we do NOT want or need it. We've shown you illustrations as to why we disagree with it.

Have you ever actually been to a Western/European country for any length of time?

Unlikely. She has apparently no real day-to-day experience living in America or Canada, else she'd realize we just want a peaceful world, but also we have the best possible political system as regards personal and religious freedom. She would have us give up those hard-won freedoms.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sgoldie View Post
Imanway, you still didn't answer my full questions -

1) If sharia is just for muslims, then why are non-muslims threatened with death for mocking mohammed?

2) If sharia was to become law for muslims within western countries, then are we non-muslims suppose to sit back if one of the punishments inflicted (such as cutting off a hand) is the sentence when it's against our morals and laws?
Very good point, Sgoldie. Reps to you! Silly us: we won't even allow let's say, a little "lite public flogging", where such reactions would be allowed even under partial sharia laws (In Canada [Winnipeg] they wanted to allow full sharia law, but only applied to Muslims!).

You know, those who fled their brutal theocratic regimes to the safety of Canada or America, only to have it revisited upon them by radical Muslims who want to return to the cruel and brutal chauvinism of "The Old Country"

Fat chance, huh?
________________________________

G'night all you freedom loving Westerners everywhere. And best wishes for some freedom in your futures, Muslims. Once you've tasted it, you won't want to go back!
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Old 07-31-2010, 06:42 PM
 
1,350 posts, read 3,620,301 times
Reputation: 1264
It is interesting that people who follow a particular religious dogma use that reasoning in their arguments against the views of those who don't subscribe to that dogma. It could be Islam or Christianity or paganism. It is an exercise in futility. How can the supposed benefits of Sharia law, based on precepts that are untenable to us, in any way advance the argument? We simply don't buy the original premise of such a condition--religious authority over a citizen's daily life.

What might be more to the point is how or should a secular society accomodate a group whose fundamental mores conflict with the traditional values and beliefs of the society. We can't keep out the world. Sharia law is the least of our worries.

Our early immigration was from countries with Judeo-Christian values and common aspirations and a desire to assimilate. With current immigration law people are arriving with far different outlooks, religious tenets, and cultural persuasions. Basic beliefs--egalitarianism, gender equality, rights of children, secular institutions, no cruel or inhumane punishment, civil rights, and even animal protection can all be undermined if accomodation is followed.

Yet, to not accomodate imposes other problems. We accomodate certain rites and practices of the Native Americans. What happens to the Somali cab driver who refuses to transport someone who has wine from the duty-free shop? Honor killings, child marriage, women clothed from head to toe in medieval garb----do you want this in your society? No--but how do you justify refusing them the freedom to live as they believe? France has decided to enact a law against the muslim veil to protect "its secular values". Is this the way to go? We better decide fast.
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