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Old 08-07-2010, 11:06 AM
 
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I am curious are there any muslims here who can talk about Islam honestly.
Many Christians and Jews are able to see the good and the bad in their religions. Because all religions ought to be striving to over come what is not good. But in order to do that we have to be honest with ourselves.

I am honestly curious....
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Old 08-07-2010, 11:35 AM
 
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I'm curious, too. I can appreciate that there is a language matter. English not being the primary language, discussion can be awkward but I'm willing to make it as simple as possible - if there are any who can discuss without just posting chunks of the Holy Book as 'Evidence'. but then, there's a lot of Christians who can't do that.
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Old 08-07-2010, 11:42 AM
 
Location: SW Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I am curious are there any muslims here who can talk about Islam honestly.
Many Christians and Jews are able to see the good and the bad in their religions. Because all religions ought to be striving to over come what is not good. But in order to do that we have to be honest with ourselves.

I am honestly curious....
I do not think that there is anything inherently bad about Christianity, Judaism or Islam.

The bad stuff begins when MEN start interpreting their beliefs for their own purposes - for their own agendas - for their own personal gain.

This is why Islam is an almost perfect religion. It is cut and dried. There are interpretations, to be sure, but usually they are philosophical they do not deal with personal gain.

The Imam discusses...."should hair be visible or not when wearing the Hijab" the Preacher preaches...."You have to be a good STEWARD to be a good Christian - You have to Witness to be a good Christian" (pass the offering plate please). We need a bigger Church to Worship God", We need MORE MONEY four our missionaries and minsitry.

You will never hear a Muslim cleric asking for money.

20yrsinBranson
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Old 08-07-2010, 11:50 AM
 
Location: Moving through this etheria
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 20yrsinBranson View Post
I do not think that there is anything inherently bad about Christianity, Judaism or Islam.

The bad stuff begins when MEN start interpreting their beliefs for their own purposes - for their own agendas - for their own personal gain.

This is why Islam is an almost perfect religion. It is cut and dried. There are interpretations, to be sure, but usually they are philosophical they do not deal with personal gain.

The Imam discusses...."should hair be visible or not when wearing the Hijab" the Preacher preaches...."You have to be a good STEWARD to be a good Christian - You have to Witness to be a good Christian" (pass the offering plate please). We need a bigger Church to Worship God", We need MORE MONEY four our missionaries and minsitry.

You will never hear a Muslim cleric asking for money.

20yrsinBranson
This line of thinking does remind me of that classic argument; how communism is the best form of government, in theory.

Trouble is, humans always interpret everything, and if there's an opportunity for greed and lust for power, it's always corrupt. As Winston Churchill said: capitalism is a horrible form of government, but it's better than all the rest.

I'd say this applies to Islam versus Christianity. Islam is based on a rather politically stupid congregation, a group quite willing to bow down to whatever the imans say. And therefore, given absolute power, those guys take and use it. As we see every day in the news.

I just heard about those 6 or 8 doctors that radical Islam slaughtered when they were on their way to a village to help with some injured kids. The claim was they were all spies for America. No trial, no proof, just murder.
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Old 08-07-2010, 12:40 PM
 
Location: SW Missouri
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Originally Posted by Shibumi View Post
This line of thinking does remind me of that classic argument; how communism is the best form of government, in theory.

Trouble is, humans always interpret everything, and if there's an opportunity for greed and lust for power, it's always corrupt. As Winston Churchill said: capitalism is a horrible form of government, but it's better than all the rest.

I'd say this applies to Islam versus Christianity. Islam is based on a rather politically stupid congregation, a group quite willing to bow down to whatever the imans say. And therefore, given absolute power, those guys take and use it. As we see every day in the news.

I just heard about those 6 or 8 doctors that radical Islam slaughtered when they were on their way to a village to help with some injured kids. The claim was they were all spies for America. No trial, no proof, just murder.
Unless you were there, you don't have a clue what the true circumstances were. You can't believe the nightly news.

Maybe they were trying to "convert" someone - or they were wearing inappropriate clothing or had Ipods for Gods sake.

Muslims take treats to their cultural identity very seriously, whether they are doctors or not.

20yrsinBranson
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Old 08-07-2010, 01:23 PM
 
44 posts, read 49,899 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I am curious are there any muslims here who can talk about Islam honestly.
Many Christians and Jews are able to see the good and the bad in their religions. Because all religions ought to be striving to over come what is not good. But in order to do that we have to be honest with ourselves.

I am honestly curious....
Chances are if they are "moderate", they are just like "liberal" Christians--they are in it for what the club provides but don't really believe.

If you're a real muslim, you believe it. It is a violent, evil religion that commands its followers to kill the infidel.
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Old 08-07-2010, 01:32 PM
 
Location: Out in the Badlands
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oxymoron?
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Old 08-07-2010, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Metromess
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Before this gets too far away from the original question, allow me to restate it: Where are the moderate Muslims?
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Old 08-07-2010, 07:59 PM
 
Location: 30-40N 90-100W
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I think a good deal of modern Ismailis are moderate. The current Aga Khan seems like an okay guy from what I've read. We had a couple Ismaili posters.

Mali and Senegal have problems, like female circumcision, but mostly they're fairly democratic societies with little in the way of terrorism. Senegal in particular seems to be a fairly secular state. Leaders seek blessings of heads of Sufi brotherhoods, but that might not be too much different than what Presidents here do. Albania, Kosovo, and Turkey have some moderate Muslims. Alevis are said to be almost liberal at times. Although some insist Alevis are not Muslim and in fairness I can see some justification to that.

Who are Alevis? What is Alevism?

The Ahmadiyya, also deemed non-Muslim by Muslims, oppose war except for defense and believe in religious toleration.

In Myanmar the Rohingyya Muslims are the victims, not the instigators, of religious discrimination.
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Old 08-08-2010, 09:52 AM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
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Originally Posted by catman View Post
Before this gets too far away from the original question, allow me to restate it: Where are the moderate Muslims?
Well, they have websites. I'll post something here, but I don't have much hope that anyone will take them seriously. The general consensus seems to be that if a Muslim appears to be moderate or to be criticizing other Muslims or to want to assimilate into American culture, it's all just a scam to get us to trust them so that they can kill us and/or impose Sharia law. Or something.

I know some that I've met through business. One of them, an engineer of Egyptian descent but born in Brooklyn says he has relatives in Egypt who constantly send him horrible pictures of what Americans do, but he just deletes them.

Additionally, at least in New Jersey, there are interfaith associations that sprung up after 9/11 to help foster communication between different religions, and for Muslims, Sikhs, Jews, and Christians to work together to tackle social issues, like feeding the homeless.

A Memo to American Muslim Leaders

ASMA SOCIETY | American Society for Muslim Advancement

Muslims Condemn Terrorist Attacks
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