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Old 12-13-2010, 09:11 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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You see, you do not understand there is no link. There is the Creator.
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Old 12-13-2010, 09:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
You see, you do not understand there is no link. There is the Creator.

i mean how do you know the way to worship him.
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Old 12-14-2010, 08:00 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
i mean how do you know the way to worship him.
I pray to him in whatever manner is comfortable for me. I do not need someone to tell me how to pray to my Creator. You will find that that is common among the native people of this land.
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Old 12-14-2010, 08:31 AM
 
Location: Eastern Kentucky
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Ptsum, could thoughts and actions not be considered prayer? If I extend a hand to someone in need, is that not prayer? If I choose to grind someone under my heel, is that not, in a way, a negative prayer? When I think good thoughts, is that not prayer? When I meditate, is that not prayer? When I try to understand how the world around me works, is that not prayer?
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Old 12-14-2010, 09:38 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Originally Posted by masonsdaughter View Post
Ptsum, could thoughts and actions not be considered prayer? If I extend a hand to someone in need, is that not prayer? If I choose to grind someone under my heel, is that not, in a way, a negative prayer? When I think good thoughts, is that not prayer? When I meditate, is that not prayer? When I try to understand how the world around me works, is that not prayer?
masonsdaughter, you make a good point, in my culture a prayer is whatever you want to make of it, the word prayer is just a terminology to give definition to, there are many different ways to pray and how you do so is your choice.
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Old 12-14-2010, 05:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
I pray to him in whatever manner is comfortable for me. I do not need someone to tell me how to pray to my Creator. You will find that that is common among the native people of this land.

Any religion created by human is full of mistakes and can be caught easily

Because the human is not perfect .

They establishes rules and principles and then they find out that the rules has a leak then they improve the rules and the rule might be perfect for a period of time

So they keep changing and improving and create new rules ..etc.

But the true religion from the creator is perfect and has no leaks .


You said "I pray to him in whatever manner is comfortable for me"

By applying your way some people would do crazy things and say they are praying to the creator because this the way that is comfortable for them.

But that of course is wrong .

But who can judge that this is wrong or right ?

The creator is the one who can judge.

But how would we know his judgment?

From his final book the Quran that has every thing about life

In Islam there are two rules or two condition not only for the prayer but for worshipping Allah in general .

If one of the rules is not applied then the worship is not accepted by Allah

The first rule is the worship must be loyal for Allah only .
The second rule is the worship must be compatible with the prophet teach.
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Old 12-14-2010, 05:52 PM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
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Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
Any religion created by human is full of mistakes and can be caught easily

every religion is created by man, your religion was created by your prophet Mohammed, was Muhammad not a man also?

Because the human is not perfect .

In my culture we know we are not perfect and our culture is evolving all the time and we know this and allow for this.

They establishes rules and principles and then they find out that the rules has a leak then they improve the rules and the rule might be perfect for a period of time

That is why in my culture we have no set rules on how to worship or pray to our Creator,it is left up to the individual to make that decision.

So they keep changing and improving and create new rules ..etc.

It's called evolving and improving and learning more to obtain knowledge.

But the true religion from the creator is perfect and has no leaks .

And who is the one that determines which religion is right when you said yourself that any religion created by human is full of mistakes and I believe that all religions are created a humans.


You said "I pray to him in whatever manner is comfortable for me"

By applying your way some people would do crazy things and say they are praying to the creator because this the way that is comfortable for them.

And who is to determine what is the right way and what isn't, nobody knows for sure, so how can one person determine what is right for another person when no two people think or act the same.

But that of course is wrong .

It is only wrong because you say so not because somebody else says so, who makes that determination.

But who can judge that this is wrong or right ?

Exactly my meaning.

The creator is the one who can judge.

But how would we know his judgment?

In my culture we make no judgment, it is not up to us to do that, that's up to the Creator.

From his final book the Quran that has every thing about life.

I do not believe in any sacred book that is written by man, my belief in my Creator is written upon my heart and spirit, not some man made book.

In Islam there are two rules or two condition not only for the prayer but for worshipping Allah in general .

My culture and belief has no rules towards worshiping the Creator, this is something that we choose to do ourselves of our own free will with honor and respect.

If one of the rules is not applied then the worship is not accepted by Allah

The first rule is the worship must be loyal for Allah only .
The second rule is the worship must be compatible with the prophet teach.

The belief that I have in my Creator does not require any rules for me to have to worship by, I have no restrictions or requirements in order to pray to my Creator, if that were the case, the prayers would be meaningless. I offer prayers to my Creator of my own free will and by doing so they have more meaning to both me and my Creator.osay
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Old 12-15-2010, 10:08 AM
 
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Originally Posted by ptsum View Post
The belief that I have in my Creator does not require any rules for me to have to worship by, I have no restrictions or requirements in order to pray to my Creator, if that were the case, the prayers would be meaningless. I offer prayers to my Creator of my own free will and by doing so they have more meaning to both me and my Creator.osay
in islam we have Quran and hadith as reference

what reference do you have for your believes?
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Old 12-15-2010, 10:50 AM
 
Location: Log home in the Appalachians
10,513 posts, read 10,337,863 times
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Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
in islam we have Quran and hadith as reference

what reference do you have for your believes?
I can see that you do not understand the concept of free will, the freedom to worship the Creator in whatever manner that is right for you or me whichever the case may be. As I said before I do not believe in any sacred book that was written by man and that includes your Qur"an or even the Christian sacred book or any supposedly sacred book written by man. These are man's words and opinions and are subject to all the fallacies of humankind. I need no references to believe in my Creator. Your religion is but an infant compared to my belief, yours is only 1500 years old, Christianity is but 2000 years old and Judaism is but 4000 years old, my belief is over 100,000 years old and it is written upon our hearts and spirit, I need no written word to pray to my Creator.
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Old 12-15-2010, 11:10 AM
 
6,039 posts, read 9,465,414 times
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Originally Posted by masonsdaughter View Post
Ptsum, could thoughts and actions not be considered prayer? If I extend a hand to someone in need, is that not prayer? If I choose to grind someone under my heel, is that not, in a way, a negative prayer? When I think good thoughts, is that not prayer? When I meditate, is that not prayer? When I try to understand how the world around me works, is that not prayer?
No.
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