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Old 12-19-2010, 09:12 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
31,021 posts, read 31,958,591 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
Prophet Muhammed peice and blessing be upon him didn't say I am bringing u a book that is from me.It is a book from the creator and whatever he heard from the creator,it is in the Quran.Also,the Quran and prophet Muhammed peice and blessing be upon him talked about everything good and treating others good.Never I should lie.Never I should steal.I should give and help the poor.All in the Quran and the Sunna.And there is no fallacies in the Quran.When a human write a book,u will find mistakes.But the Quran has no mistakes because it is from Allah.

Just wondering if u were right,why did the creator send prophets peice and blessing be upon them ?

There are many many mistakes and contradictions in the Quran because like other "holy books" it was written by men long ago.

Contradictions
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:13 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,448,509 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
Prophet Muhammed peice and blessing be upon him didn't say I am bringing u a book that is from me.It is a book from the creator and whatever he heard from the creator,it is in the Quran.Also,the Quran and prophet Muhammed peice and blessing be upon him talked about everything good and treating others good.Never I should lie.Never I should steal.I should give and help the poor.All in the Quran and the Sunna.And there is no fallacies in the Quran.When a human write a book,u will find mistakes.But the Quran has no mistakes because it is from Allah.

Just wondering if u were right,why did the creator send prophets peice and blessing be upon them ?
All the books were written down by man and thus 2nd hand. Muhammad got his revelation over a period of time and none of it was written down and codified until well after his death.

It was memorized by those around him and written down. After his death when there were many stories around and the companions were passing away and there was the worry that those who carried it orally would be lost and thus the revelation might be lost. This is when it was written down and the final version codified in what it is today.

It is not perfect, nor infallible because it has been written down by man.

The Qur'an has many mistakes as it does not even get the stories from the Tanakh and NT correct. It changes major stories.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:14 PM
 
118 posts, read 472,272 times
Reputation: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxcar Overkill View Post
What I find interesting is not that you disagree with non-muslims here.

What I find interesting is that you are unable to even imagine the position of a non-muslim.
The non-Muslim's seem to be doing an equally bad job, though, too.

According to Muslim22's belief, those who do not accept Allah in the Muslim sense, especially after being shown the truth, are making a huge error and will suffer for it on the day of judgement, so the fact that he is trying to bring us to Allah is a sign that he respects and cares about us not that he is judging us.

---

My understanding of Jesus in Islam is that the Koran says he was made by God, similar to the way Adam was made, and placed in Mary's womb. Not quite the same as "any other prophet" (except maybe for Adam, that is), but admittedly not at all an expression of God in the sense of the Trinity either. But then, it's obvious that Muslim ideas about Jesus are influenced by the later Gnostic forms of Christianty that were probably current in Arabia in the seventh century.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:18 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,448,509 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweater Fish View Post
The non-Muslim's seem to be doing an equally bad job, though, too.

According to Muslim22's belief, those who do not accept Allah in the Muslim sense, especially after being shown the truth, are making a huge error and will suffer for it on the day of judgement, so the fact that he is trying to bring us to Allah is a sign that he respects and cares about us not that he is judging us.

---

My understanding of Jesus in Islam is that the Koran says he was made by God, similar to the way Adam was made, and placed in Mary's womb. Not quite the same as "any other prophet" (except maybe for Adam, that is), but admittedly not at all an expression of God in the sense of the Trinity either. But then, it's obvious that Muslim ideas about Jesus are influenced by the later Gnostic forms of Christianty that were probably current in Arabia in the seventh century.

The Qur'an says that Jesus/Isa was born to Mary/Maryam. He was born of a virgin. She gave birth to him under a palm tree. He was not crucified but taken up before death. He was a prophet, not a god.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:40 PM
 
122 posts, read 127,363 times
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There is no contradiction in the Quran.The contradiction comes when u don't look for the right meaning.That is why we look at the prophet Sunna and his combanions.And when we have trouble we go to a relegious person who explain to us the meaning. U can do that in any text,just change the meaning the way u want to support your claim I said that many times in other threads and many other Muslims said it too
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:47 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,448,509 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
There is no contradiction in the Quran.The contradiction comes when u don't look for the right meaning.That is why we look at the prophet Sunna and his combanions.And when we have trouble we go to a relegious person who explain to us the meaning. U can do that in any text,just change the meaning the way u want to support your claim I said that many times in other threads and many other Muslims said it too

Yes there are contradictions...... But to get beyond that you just say that the book is perfect and others are corrupted.....

Christians do the same thing....

In order to say you have the only truth and you take from others you need to delegitimize the books you are taking your information from. You have to delegitimize other peoples religion.

Muslims and Christians have historically done that.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:53 PM
 
Location: OKC
5,426 posts, read 5,758,727 times
Reputation: 1770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweater Fish View Post
The non-Muslim's seem to be doing an equally bad job, though, too.
It's not just that he disagrees with non-Muslims, its that he has so taken for granted the truth of Islam, that he isn't even aware that his premises are subject to dispute.


As for me, it look like a tournament of myths. One guy likes Zeus, one guys pulling for Paul Bunyan, you god a Jesus backer over here, etc.
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Old 12-19-2010, 09:53 PM
 
122 posts, read 127,363 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Yes there are contradictions...... But to get beyond that you just say that the book is perfect and others are corrupted.....

Christians do the same thing....

In order to say you have the only truth and you take from others you need to delegitimize the books you are taking your information from. You have to delegitimize other peoples religion.

Muslims and Christians have historically done that.
For every claim there must be a proof AND evidence.When we are sick we go to a doctor to give us treatment and we don't go to a worker.Why? because the Dr knows what to does and he has more understanding than the worker in medicine.Apply the same thing here,and go to the right person.Don't go to a person because that is what u wanna hear.
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Old 12-19-2010, 10:03 PM
 
122 posts, read 127,363 times
Reputation: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweater Fish View Post
The non-Muslim's seem to be doing an equally bad job, though, too.

According to Muslim22's belief, those who do not accept Allah in the Muslim sense, especially after being shown the truth, are making a huge error and will suffer for it on the day of judgement, so the fact that he is trying to bring us to Allah is a sign that he respects and cares about us not that he is judging us.

---

My understanding of Jesus in Islam is that the Koran says he was made by God, similar to the way Adam was made, and placed in Mary's womb. Not quite the same as "any other prophet" (except maybe for Adam, that is), but admittedly not at all an expression of God in the sense of the Trinity either. But then, it's obvious that Muslim ideas about Jesus are influenced by the later Gnostic forms of Christianty that were probably current in Arabia in the seventh century.
Thank u for your understanding and may Allah guide all of us to the right path.
When Allah sent prophets,there were believers and disbelievers.People who look for the right path and truth without following their desires will find it.

I bear witness There is no god but Allah, and Muhammad is his final messenger
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Old 12-19-2010, 10:20 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,448,509 times
Reputation: 808
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muslim22 View Post
For every claim there must be a proof AND evidence.When we are sick we go to a doctor to give us treatment and we don't go to a worker.Why? because the Dr knows what to does and he has more understanding than the worker in medicine.Apply the same thing here,and go to the right person.Don't go to a person because that is what u wanna hear.
Here we go... The need for the eternal proof.... You and the Christians worry to much about proof. I just know my way is right for me.

I don't need proof......
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