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Old 05-02-2011, 10:44 PM
 
Location: Chicago Area
8,036 posts, read 4,202,918 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuminousTruth View Post
I don't knowww... "In God We Trust" & "One Nation Under God" and all the other laws that come from religious lobbying.

ground-breaking experiment without all the religious laws we currently have which I touched on above. All building should be taxed, since they have to be thankful for not being bombed currently. Their prayers sure isn't what is keeping those walls up. The Church Laws are basically run on a State basis, I do believe. My place of worship is MY HOUSE! yet it gets taxed.
It's a pretty weak argument. If you or I go to the middle east or elsewhere, you find the same thing on the money. But using money with Islamic symbols and on it doesn't automagically transform me into a Muslim. If you do not believe in God, join the Jehovah's Witnesses at the back of the room and simply don't say the pledge of allegiance. I remember there was one in my elementary school and nobody gave him any trouble about it. Besides, does anyone even say it anymore?

The great experiment of the United States of America happened largely by accident. There was too much religious diversity scattered across the 13 colonies that it would have been impractical to mix government and religion. So they opted out by making them separate. It's worked out pretty well actually.

In this country, a person can't be arrested or forced to pay a higher tax rate just because they're the wrong religion. If you happen to be an atheist or actually truly believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, in spite of the fact that you're vastly outnumbered by opposing views at a local, state and national level, nobody gets to tell you what you can or can't believe. From the start, the religious majority accepted this in exchange for the understanding that government would not meddle in religion. Yet how recently was this trust broken by the feds? The FLDS Church members had their children taken away from them. You or I might strongly disagree with what the believe and what they do -- and I do disagree quite strongly -- but this action violated that trust and the children had to be returned. Laws passed by local governments banning door to door proselyting by the Jehovah's Witnesses were also struck down, but those laws were in force for a time. JW's have seen more than their fair share of unofficial mistreatment in this nation -- and again though I disagree with them I have no right to say what they can or can't do as a religion. Jews have also been on the receiving end of a lot of unofficial mistreatment. If memory serves, the local and state governments were directly involved in driving the Mormons out of New York, Ohio, Missouri and Illinois. In the cases of Missouri and I think Illinois they were officially part of it -- one of the few cases of mass persecution of one religion was actually written into law and the federal government did absolutely nothing about it. Fun fact since the "Mormon Extermination Order" stayed on the books until 1976 - a great example of a stupid law though I couldn't tell you where I ran into it. But apparently prior to 1976, if you shot a Mormon dead, you were actually upholding and supporting the laws of Missouri.

So as it relates to the religious lobbyist groups and all things religion that are part of the US government -- it's true that religion hasn't stayed on their side of the fence, but government has been just as guilty of crossing the line as well.

In the end, while religious lobbyists have the right to represent their opinions just like anyone else, they don't get to do anything that mandates what anyone does or does not believe in.

 
Old 05-02-2011, 10:46 PM
 
Location: Back in the Southland
1,054 posts, read 1,550,300 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashkar View Post
why people dO taboo thing while ALLAH LOOK AT THEM IN EVERY PLACE EVERY TIME AND WITH YOU TWO ANGLES WRITE YOUR TALKING AND DOING WHY PEOPLE FORGET THERE IS HELL AFTER DEATH
what are you saying
 
Old 05-02-2011, 10:56 PM
 
Location: Chicago Area
8,036 posts, read 4,202,918 times
Reputation: 3039
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattClyde View Post
what are you saying

YouTube - Zero Wing-english audio: all your base are belong to us.

I think he's saying "All your base are belong to Islam!!" though he might be saying, "You have no chance to survive, make your time!!"

Seriously, I'd love to know what they meant because I've no clue.
 
Old 05-02-2011, 11:07 PM
 
Location: Back in the Southland
1,054 posts, read 1,550,300 times
Reputation: 585
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post

YouTube - Zero Wing-english audio: all your base are belong to us.

I think he's saying "All your base are belong to Islam!!" though he might be saying, "You have no chance to survive, make your time!!"

Seriously, I'd love to know what they meant because I've no clue.
that makes some sense but it still confuses me. I was looking through the threads here and this person has about 5 recent threads started in the past week
 
Old 05-02-2011, 11:38 PM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,743,081 times
Reputation: 1328
Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
It's a pretty weak argument. If you or I go to the middle east or elsewhere, you find the same thing on the money. But using money with Islamic symbols and on it doesn't automagically transform me into a Muslim. If you do not believe in God, join the Jehovah's Witnesses at the back of the room and simply don't say the pledge of allegiance. I remember there was one in my elementary school and nobody gave him any trouble about it. Besides, does anyone even say it anymore?
That is a complete non-argument. If I go to England, I find there a Queen. Here, ours wear black robes.
No, placating to the local custum of accepting only their own idolistic currency, does not automatically make you supposedly agree with all their views. However, it does make you "respect" them. As well as the fact that those are "OTHER COUNTRIES" that shun our original and revolutionary traditions; just like we allowed to happen here. You don't tell me what to do or what to think. How about YOU join the Jehovah's Witnesses at the back of the room; simply because JW don't like placating to Idols just like the non-religious doesn't have to mean we have to be as ignorant and submissive as them. I remember I actually care about my Country. And yes, you are right, no one even says it anymore exactly because it has NO honor.



Quote:
The great experiment of the United States of America happened largely by accident. There was too much religious diversity scattered across the 13 colonies that it would have been impractical to mix government and religion. So they opted out by making them separate. It's worked out pretty well actually.
Ouch. The Great experiment happened because Our Founders were agnostics and deists and actually LOVED freedom and inquiry.
religious diversity did have something to do with it, yes. I perfer to call it religious plurality, but they could have easily established simple Christianity, or monotheism yet didn't. Because they were intellegent.

Quote:
In this country, a person can't be arrested or forced to pay a higher tax rate just because they're the wrong religion. If you happen to be an atheist or actually truly believe in the Flying Spaghetti Monster, in spite of the fact that you're vastly outnumbered by opposing views at a local, state and national level, nobody gets to tell you what you can or can't believe.
But they can tell you which views to respect, mainly the monotheistic ones which allow creeping sharia.



Quote:
From the start, the religious majority accepted this in exchange for the understanding that government would not meddle in religion. Yet how recently was this trust broken by the feds? The FLDS Church members had their children taken away from them. You or I might strongly disagree with what the believe and what they do -- and I do disagree quite strongly -- but this action violated that trust and the children had to be returned.
Wrong. the anti-agnostic commonality accepted it because they couldn't agree with eachother on which ways to subjegate others. It was done with the complete understanding the the government is free to chose which religions to santifity against its written laws. The government does NOT have to placate to religious believes, be those Satanic dogmas, or THC related, or monotheistic, and Christian dogmas

Quote:
Laws passed by local governments banning door to door proselyting by the Jehovah's Witnesses were also struck down, but those laws were in force for a time. JW's have seen more than their fair share of unofficial mistreatment in this nation -- and again though I disagree with them I have no right to say what they can or can't do as a religion. Jews have also been on the receiving end of a lot of unofficial mistreatment.
Such laws should not have been struck down, door to door porselyting is very disruptive and annoying and indecent. JWs like Mennonites, are free to leave this country when they wish to not follow its laws. The Government has a complete right to allow and disallow whatever it sees fit. No religion sanctifies secular law breaking. May = National Jewish Heritage Months...do we even still HAVE Native Americans?





Quote:
If memory serves, the local and state governments were directly involved in driving the Mormons out of New York, Ohio, Missouri and Illinois. In the cases of Missouri and I think Illinois they were officially part of it -- one of the few cases of mass persecution of one religion was actually written into law and the federal government did absolutely nothing about it. Fun fact since the "Mormon Extermination Order" stayed on the books until 1976 - a great example of a stupid law though I couldn't tell you where I ran into it. But apparently prior to 1976, if you shot a Mormon dead, you were actually upholding and supporting the laws of Missouri.
I think they were driven out because of their illegal practices...mainly polygamy and indecent treasure hunting. Mormons were trying to establish an American Religion which would completely remake this country into a self-righteous theocracy. Many States STILL have laws disallowing atheists, agnostics and nonChristian to serve in office. Mormons are almost completely overtly Polytheist and thus other Christians used everything in their power to persecute them. Much like most Christians use everything in their power to persecute Doukhobors. The Federal Government and Native Americans gave them a WHOLE entire state. "Mormon Extermination Order" you should read up more on why the order was given, mainly being the CHRISTIANHOOD of their State Government and the broken LAWS and OUTRAGE, It seems it was the followers of Moroni who started the war...acording to another Christian ofcourse. As If the same wouldn't happen today to a Left-Hand Path movement.



Quote:
So as it relates to the religious lobbyist groups and all things religion that are part of the US government -- it's true that religion hasn't stayed on their side of the fence, but government has been just as guilty of crossing the line as well.
State governments mind you, Which were in the greedy hands of the religionists already.

Quote:
In the end, while religious lobbyists have the right to represent their opinions just like anyone else, they don't get to do anything that mandates what anyone does or does not believe in.
especially my lobbyists... moneyed interests. Except of course how the Mormons ATTACKED their neighbors, and How our government mandates swearing upon idol scriptures(The Bibles)! We are surely deserved of Punishment!

Last edited by LuminousTruth; 05-03-2011 at 12:03 AM..
 
Old 05-03-2011, 01:37 AM
 
Location: Chicago Area
8,036 posts, read 4,202,918 times
Reputation: 3039
LuminousTruth I just want to point something very important out. The thread started out ... confusing as all hell. Now it's at least an interesting and stimulating discussion.

Incidentally (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but polygamy was not actually illegal until about 1863 -- way after the Mormons had been kicked out of New York, Ohio, Missouri and Illinois. Likely nobody had figured anyone needed to create any laws on the matter. Now the FLDS fiasco just a few years ago, you'd be right - they were breaking the laws against polygamy. Not the same religion at all though. Oddly enough, nobody actually tries to enforce those laws anymore ...

Now about indecent treasure hunting ... What on earth is that? Are you telling me it is or was standard Mormon practice to pan for gold in the nude?

One thing is certain. There is the hated trinity of religions: Jews, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses. Especially in the past, people WANT to believe even the worst things they hear about all three groups. This has always puzzled me. At the end of the day, I think we can agree that there's a lot of idiots out there, but why these three? I know a case where a Mormon kid was asked by their schoolteacher if they (Mormons) really do have horns. The child said, "Yes but mine aren't really coming in yet. But my older brother has a really good set growing in." Then they went home, took some chicken spurs (the back claw of the chicken's foot) and glued them to the older brother's head. Then they introduced him to the teacher the next day. That teacher freaked of course. Apparently she refused to believe that it was all a joke never gave up believing the Mormons really do have horns. I'm leaning towards the Mormons not actually breaking any actual laws in the vast majority of cases ... call me crazy. That or ridiculous over-reactionism. You know, a guy gets caught shoplifting so you kill him, his wife, children, mother, father and all siblings. That sort of thing.

With JW's it's mind control conspiracies. I wouldn't mind if JW's couldn't knock on my door at 9AM Saturday morning ... but they never do for some reason. I think they know who I am and know that they don't want to talk to me ... not sure why. Apparently I'm a lost cause.

I normally could think of some really awesome stupid myths about Jews but I'm starting to fall asleep in my chair and I just can't think of them.
 
Old 05-03-2011, 02:57 AM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,743,081 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by godofthunder9010 View Post
LuminousTruth, I just want to point something very important out. The thread started out ... confusing as all hell. Now it's at least an interesting and stimulating discussion.
Thanks, It took your post to make this worth while.

Quote:
Incidentally (and please correct me if I'm wrong) but polygamy was not actually illegal until about 1863 -- way after the Mormons had been kicked out of New York, Ohio, Missouri and Illinois. Likely nobody had figured anyone needed to create any laws on the matter. Now the FLDS fiasco just a few years ago, you'd be right - they were breaking the laws against polygamy. Not the same religion at all though. Oddly enough, nobody actually tries to enforce those laws anymore ...
States had their own marriage laws. Most were explicitly monoheterosexual, I'm sure. Europeans considered polygamy to be pretty barbaric. No one enforces the anti-sodomy laws either.
Quote:
Now about indecent treasure hunting ... What on earth is that? Are you telling me it is or was standard Mormon practice to pan for gold in the nude?
Public Disruption and Failure to give treasures to the State Museum.

Quote:
One thing is certain. There is the hated trinity of religions: Jews, Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses. Especially in the past, people WANT to believe even the worst things they hear about all three groups. This has always puzzled me. At the end of the day, I think we can agree that there's a lot of idiots out there, but why these three?
Jews are very powerhungry(no anti-semetism intended), Mormons are extremely odd, and Jehovah's Witnesses are extremely public? Mostly though, I think it has to do with the fact that they like to faction away from society and stand against it.


Quote:
I know a case where a Mormon kid was asked by their schoolteacher if they (Mormons) really do have horns. The child said, "Yes but mine aren't really coming in yet. But my older brother has a really good set growing in." Then they went home, took some chicken spurs (the back claw of the chicken's foot) and glued them to the older brother's head. Then they introduced him to the teacher the next day. That teacher freaked of course. Apparently she refused to believe that it was all a joke never gave up believing the Mormons really do have horns.
She was probably a Christian, probably takes the story that Moses sprouted horns from his head after being in the presence of Yahweh litterally.

Quote:
I'm leaning towards the Mormons not actually breaking any actual laws in the vast majority of cases ... call me crazy. That or ridiculous over-reactionism. You know, a guy gets caught shoplifting so you kill him, his wife, children, mother, father and all siblings. That sort of thing.
I am leaning towards that they didn't act anything like they do now, now that the lesson was learned. Supposedly, the Whole Mormon neighborhood decended against the other neighborhood to punish them for their crimes... w.e. those might have been.


Quote:
With JW's it's mind control conspiracies. I wouldn't mind if JW's couldn't knock on my door at 9AM Saturday morning ... but they never do for some reason. I think they know who I am and know that they don't want to talk to me ... not sure why. Apparently I'm a lost cause.
They probably don't want to talk in general. When they came to my door they refused to do anything except ask if I knew who Jesus was and hand me a pamphlet inviting me to their easter service...I should have said I had never heard of such a name

Quote:

I normally could think of some really awesome stupid myths about Jews but I'm starting to fall asleep in my chair and I just can't think of them.
Blood Libel?
 
Old 05-03-2011, 07:48 AM
 
Location: Brooklyn
40,056 posts, read 30,536,331 times
Reputation: 10490
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattClyde View Post
I was looking through the threads here and this person has about 5 recent threads started in the past week
These things run in cycles. The screen names change, but the threads remain the same.
 
Old 05-03-2011, 08:08 AM
 
48 posts, read 45,384 times
Reputation: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by MattClyde View Post
what are you saying
MUSLUM DID NOT WORSHIP JESUS WE WORSHIP WHO CREATE JESUS WE WORSHIP ONE GOD ISLAM IS THE TRUE IN KORAN ALLAH TELL PEOPLE WHY HE CREATE THEM AND WHAT YOU MUST TO DO TO ENTER THE PARADISE AND ALLAH TELL US WHO WILL ENTER THE HELL FOREVER ALLAH GIVE US THE TRUE STORY ABOUT ALL PROPHETS AND STORY OF JESUS AND HIS MOTHER MARY PEACE BE UPON THEM AND ALLAH TELL US ABOUT SATAN AND WHY ALLAH SEND DISASTER ALL THIS THING IN KORAN JESUS NOT MORE THAN PROPHET ALLAH SENT HIM TO LEARN PEOPLE THE PATH OF GOD BUT PEOPLE WORSHIP HIM INSTEAD THEY WILL ENTER HELL FOREVER GOD DID NOT FORGIVE IF PEOPLE WORSHIP ANY ONE BESIDE HIM OR WORSHIP Fetish
 
Old 05-03-2011, 08:21 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,884 posts, read 31,773,106 times
Reputation: 12629
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashkar View Post
MUSLUM DID NOT WORSHIP JESUS WE WORSHIP WHO CREATE JESUS WE WORSHIP ONE GOD ISLAM IS THE TRUE IN KORAN ALLAH TELL PEOPLE WHY HE CREATE THEM AND WHAT YOU MUST TO DO TO ENTER THE PARADISE AND ALLAH TELL US WHO WILL ENTER THE HELL FOREVER ALLAH GIVE US THE TRUE STORY ABOUT ALL PROPHETS AND STORY OF JESUS AND HIS MOTHER MARY PEACE BE UPON THEM AND ALLAH TELL US ABOUT SATAN AND WHY ALLAH SEND DISASTER ALL THIS THING IN KORAN JESUS NOT MORE THAN PROPHET ALLAH SENT HIM TO LEARN PEOPLE THE PATH OF GOD BUT PEOPLE WORSHIP HIM INSTEAD THEY WILL ENTER HELL FOREVER GOD DID NOT FORGIVE IF PEOPLE WORSHIP ANY ONE BESIDE HIM OR WORSHIP Fetish
Sheesh...Stop your damned YELLING!
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