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Old 03-01-2016, 01:02 PM
 
3,166 posts, read 1,036,278 times
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Some people prefer getting ill.

Despite being warned recently that no amount of alcohol is safe amount to drink, people are still drinking alcohol and doing damage to their livers.

Someone certainly knew it all 1400 years ago and banned it altogether.

Why should the taxpayers pay heavy price for stupidity of the others even in this day and age?.
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Old 03-01-2016, 01:17 PM
 
1,601 posts, read 750,644 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
What about some other pieces of modern day scientific knowledge that was documented thousands of years ago - How do you explain that?

for example, the formation of embryo and the stages it goes through. There wasn't any x-ray or ultra sound machines available then.
It was all wrong. The location where sperm comes from was wrong. Sperm comes from the testicles, not:
"Proceeding from between the backbone and the ribs:" S. 86:5-7

There's really no reason to go on. A 'creator of the universe' would certainly know to say that: "Sperm is produced in the testicles, which are found in the *******."

Explanation of embryological development in the Quran is equally wrong. Muslims try their best to obfuscate and lie and reword and twist, but to no avail. The nonsense is there for all to read.

And here it is:
"We created you from clay, then from a sperm-drop, then from a clinging clot, and then from a lump of flesh, formed and unformed - that We may show you. And We settle in the wombs whom We will for a specified term, then We bring you out as a child,"

Nope, not from clay.
Clay is a fine-grained hydrous aluminum phyllosilicate; carbon, which is the element to consider in organic chemistry, is present as a contaminant, but the primary elements are aluminum and silicon. It’s nothing like the composition of the human body.

Clinging clot? Lump of flesh?
I could call the embryo a sticky blob, too, and stretch and twist the words to match it in the vaguest possible way to a technical description, too…but it doesn’t make it a technical description, and it doesn’t make it informative. Try this instead: A single sperm and the mother's egg cell meet in the Fallopian tube. When the single sperm enters the egg, conception occurs. The combined sperm and egg is called a zygote.
The zygote contains all of the genetic information (DNA) needed to become a baby. Half the DNA comes from the mother's egg and half from the father's sperm.
The zygote spends the next few days traveling down the Fallopian tube. During this time, it divides to form a ball of cells called a blastocyst.
A blastocyst is made up of an inner group of cells with an outer shell.
The inner group of cells will become the embryo. The embryo is what will develop into your baby.
The outer group of cells will become structures, called membranes, which nourish and protect the embryo.
Once the blastocyst reaches the uterus, it buries itself in the uterine wall.
At this point in the mother's menstrual cycle, the lining of the uterus is thick with blood and ready to support a baby.
The blastocyst sticks tightly to the wall of the uterus and receives nourishment from the mother's blood.
Week 5 is the start of the "embryonic period." This is when all the baby's major systems and structures develop.
The embryo's cells multiply and start to take on specific functions. This is called differentiation.
Blood cells, kidney cells, and nerve cells all develop.
The embryo grows rapidly, and the baby's external features begin to form.
Your baby's brain, spinal cord, and heart begin to develop.
Baby's gastrointestinal tract starts to form.
It's during this time in the first trimester that the baby is most at risk for damage from things that may cause birth defects. This includes certain medications, illegal drug use, heavy alcohol use, infections such as rubella, and other factors.
Arm and leg buds start to grow.
Your baby's brain forms into five different areas. Some cranial nerves are visible.
Eyes and ears begin to form.
Tissue grows that will become your baby's spine and other bones.
Baby's heart continues to grow and now beats at a regular rhythm.
Blood pumps through the main vessels.
And so on.....

Hopefully, you get the idea. Except that you won't because Muslims have been taught how to be irrational and unthinking.
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Old 03-01-2016, 01:30 PM
 
1,601 posts, read 750,644 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
Some people prefer getting ill.

Despite being warned recently that no amount of alcohol is safe amount to drink, people are still drinking alcohol and doing damage to their livers.

Someone certainly knew it all 1400 years ago and banned it altogether.

Why should the taxpayers pay heavy price for stupidity of the others even in this day and age?.
Please provide evidence that no amount of alcohol is safe to drink.

Actually, the drinking of alcohol is an excellent example of contradictions in Islam.

2:219 "They ask you concerning alcoholic drink and gambling. Say: "In them is a great sin and benefit for men, but the sin of them is greater than their benefit."

So, the first verse says that drinking and gambling could provide a benefit and also have bad effects. There was no forbidding, just warning that the bad would outweigh the good.
Next, another ayah was revealed that forbade the Muslims to come to prayer drunk, Surah 4:43. Drinking wine was not uncommon among Muslims at that point.
"O you who believe! do not go near prayer when you are Intoxicated until you know (well) what you say,"

So you could go to prayer after drinking as long as you have some ability to know what you say.

Now we come to Surah 5:93 - the demand to stop drinking wine.
O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling..... are an abomination, of Satan’s handiwork: Eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper.

Drinking is now completely forbidden.

Which is it? Can muslims drink sometimes? Maybe just not before praying? Does drinking have a benefit? Why would 'allah' change his mind? Isn't he all-knowing? Do muslims get to pick the verse they like best? So can muslims drink if not before or during prayer? What benefit did drinking have and what happened to that benefit?
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Old 03-01-2016, 01:33 PM
 
1,601 posts, read 750,644 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post

Why should the taxpayers pay heavy price for stupidity of the others even in this day and age?.
An excellent question and Muslim immigrants had better think this over. Masses of Muslims come to Western countries and demand the unearned....well, not the unearned, but what was earned by others.
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Old 03-01-2016, 02:07 PM
 
Location: Log "cabin" west of Bangor
5,676 posts, read 6,770,929 times
Reputation: 10242
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
What about some other pieces of modern day scientific knowledge that was documented thousands of years ago - How do you explain that?

for example, the formation of embryo and the stages it goes through. There wasn't any x-ray or ultra sound machines available then.

How about the mention of Pulsars ?

or how about the coming up with the fact that iron is an alien element that is not a product of planet earth,?

How about, "water being the major component that every living thing is made with"?

or Mountains being pegged in the ground?

or the continuous expansion of the Universe?

Do some research and see if it's all truth, as this was all mentioned 1400 years ago. And then ask yourself this question, "Aren't these the signs?"
What in the name of Jimminy Cricket is all this stuff you are going on at me about? And just what do you expect me to explain about it? And why?

"Do some research"? Why?

I did not mention any of these things, I did not talk about any of these things. For what insane reason are you poking these questions at me?

I wrote one simple possible explanation for a particular 'rule' dating from Mosaic law, and how it might have come about. Did you fail to comprehend that?

I responded to a particular question about that particular subject in a polite and non-judgmental manner, and was very careful to not make any implications that could be construed as argumentative. I did not discuss any other subject.

And yet, here you are, chucking all of this other stuff at me like you are *looking* for an argument. I have no idea what or why you are going on about these things, or whatever other bees you might have buzzing around in your bonnet, but if you *are* looking for some sort of argument about them you will have to look elsewhere. I don't have a clue what you are talking about. What the heck is wrong with you?

Sheesh.
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Old 03-01-2016, 02:33 PM
 
3,166 posts, read 1,036,278 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
An excellent question and Muslim immigrants had better think this over. Masses of Muslims come to Western countries and demand the unearned....well, not the unearned, but what was earned by others.
I have never demanded unearned. I have always paid my taxes and am paying even now. My grown up children are paying a lot more than I do.

As for Muslim immigrants/refugees, most of them were rich in their countries with thriving businesses but Western bombs have destroyed their homes and cities. Now it looks like bombing is going to be rather expensive business even for me, the non-guilty.
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Old 03-01-2016, 02:37 PM
 
4,409 posts, read 1,639,451 times
Reputation: 1528
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zymer View Post
What in the name of Jimminy Cricket is all this stuff you are going on at me about? And just what do you expect me to explain about it? And why?

"Do some research"? Why?

I did not mention any of these things, I did not talk about any of these things. For what insane reason are you poking these questions at me?

I wrote one simple possible explanation for a particular 'rule' dating from Mosaic law, and how it might have come about. Did you fail to comprehend that?

I responded to a particular question about that particular subject in a polite and non-judgmental manner, and was very careful to not make any implications that could be construed as argumentative. I did not discuss any other subject.

And yet, here you are, chucking all of this other stuff at me like you are *looking* for an argument. I have no idea what or why you are going on about these things, or whatever other bees you might have buzzing around in your bonnet, but if you *are* looking for some sort of argument about them you will have to look elsewhere. I don't have a clue what you are talking about. What the heck is wrong with you?

Sheesh.
So if you are telling me that you have found the ultimate truth and your search is over, then yes indeed, ignore what I said.
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Old 03-01-2016, 03:01 PM
 
1,601 posts, read 750,644 times
Reputation: 435
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khalif View Post
I have never demanded unearned. I have always paid my taxes and am paying even now. My grown up children are paying a lot more than I do.

As for Muslim immigrants/refugees, most of them were rich in their countries with thriving businesses but Western bombs have destroyed their homes and cities. Now it looks like bombing is going to be rather expensive business even for me, the non-guilty.
"USA: Muslim “refugees” – 91.4% on food stamps, 68.3% on Cash Welfare"

"CHART: More Than 90% Of Recent Middle Eastern Refugees On Food Stamps, Almost 70% On Cash Welfare"

"Sweden: Ten times higher welfare dependency among 16.5% foreign born – an increase of 82%"

"80% OF TURKISH MUSLIM SETTLERS IN GERMANY LIVE OFF WELFARE"

"Only 33% of Muslims in India work"

"In 2008, the Toronto Sun reported that “hundreds of [Greater Toronto Area] Muslim men in polygamous marriages — some with a harem of wives — are receiving welfare and social benefits for each of their spouses, thanks to the city and province, Muslim leaders say.”

"Muslim immigrants in Denmark “constitute five percent of the population but consume upwards of 40 percent of the welfare spending.”
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Old 03-01-2016, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Log "cabin" west of Bangor
5,676 posts, read 6,770,929 times
Reputation: 10242
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoCardinals View Post
So if you are telling me that you have found the ultimate truth and your search is over, then yes indeed, ignore what I said.
I have no idea what you're talking about. I said nothing about 'ultimate truth', nor anything about a search for any 'ultimate truth'.

I made a simple, narrow response to a specific isolated question.

That's it, and that's all.

These other things about which you are blathering on do not seem to have any relation to the topic, which pertains solely to the prohibition of pork. Whatever else you have going on in your head about whatever these other things are, is going on solely in your head. I didn't bring them up, I didn't address them, and I have no intention of addressing them. I can think of no sane reason why you are attempting to provoke me into a discussion of them.

If you have such a burning desire to discuss these other things with someone, whatever they are and for whatever reason, perhaps you should start a separate thread about them, with some sort of rational context to explain the position you are taking regarding them and what it is about them that you would like to discuss, and see if anyone bites. Frankly, I am clueless as to why you are bringing them up, particularly to me, and just what they might (in your mind) have to do with the discussion of pork.
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Old 03-01-2016, 04:24 PM
 
3,166 posts, read 1,036,278 times
Reputation: 289
Quote:
Originally Posted by juju33312 View Post
Please provide evidence that no amount of alcohol is safe to drink.
International Business Times 8th January 2016. UK medical experts warned that no amount of regular drinking of alcohol is safe amount.

Quote:
Actually, the drinking of alcohol is an excellent example of contradictions in Islam.
Really?

Let's go into it then!

Quote:
2:219 "They ask you concerning alcoholic drink and gambling. Say: "In them is a great sin and benefit for men, but the sin of them is greater than their benefit."

So, the first verse says that drinking and gambling could provide a benefit and also have bad effects. There was no forbidding, just warning that the bad would outweigh the good.
The contents of the verse still apply even today. There is more of sin/harm than good in them, there is more loss than profit/gain in them. That is the first warning so get prepared for things to come.

Quote:
Next, another ayah was revealed that forbade the Muslims to come to prayer drunk, Surah 4:43. Drinking wine was not uncommon among Muslims at that point.
"O you who believe! do not go near prayer when you are Intoxicated until you know (well) what you say,"

So you could go to prayer after drinking as long as you have some ability to know what you say.
Here comes the ignorance of the reader when his mind is closed to the Qur'an: The verse says don't do something before the prayer but the ignorant reader misreads it as if s/he can do something before the prayer. It doesn't say "do" but it says "do not".

So the part prohibition after the first warning. One still can't go near the prayer drunk. The ruling still applies.

Quote:
Now we come to Surah 5:93 - the demand to stop drinking wine.
O ye who believe! Intoxicants and gambling..... are an abomination, of Satan’s handiwork: Eschew such (abomination), that ye may prosper.

Drinking is now completely forbidden.
BINGO!

Each ruling still applies. (1) No amount of alcohol is more profit than loss. (2) One can't go for prayer if drunk. (3) Don't drink alcohol.

Quote:
Which is it?
Each one of them.

Quote:
Can muslims drink sometimes?
No. None of the verse say Muslims can drink alcohol.
Quote:
Maybe just not before praying?
Definitely not before prayer.

[b]Does drinking have a benefit?[quote] Not unless you have blinkers on and can't see the opposite of benefit which is greater nullifying any benefit.
Quote:
Why would 'allah' change his mind?
Allah did not change His mind. Allah was very clever to deal with alcoholic people. He made them stop drinking alcohol gradually.
Quote:
Isn't he all-knowing?
Certainly all-knowing. He knew that sudden prohibition of alcohol will not work on those Arabs of the time.
Quote:
Do muslims get to pick the verse they like best?
Yes. But can't reject any of them.
Quote:
So can muslims drink if not before or during prayer?
No, because no verse says that you can drink at any time.
Quote:
What benefit did drinking have and what happened to that benefit?
Reading all the verses and using the brain (when not drunk), anyone can understand from these verse that benefit is eradicated by the damage, loss or hurt.

Having dealt with the questions, drinking alcohol is banned for good. But, there is no ban on its use for medical purposes. So after all there IS some benefit in it. Happy?
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