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Old 06-11-2011, 09:06 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,436,243 times
Reputation: 807

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nawary View Post
>>>>>>>>>>>
Also Muslim does not want to live under Western rule
I hope that attacking stops from both sides

Funny not to want to live with democracy and freedom of religion....

Have you ever lived under democracy? Have you ever lived in a place where no matter your beliefs you are free to practice them...

Where churches, mosques, synagogues are everywhere and people are openly free to follow their faith.

I am safe in my country but I would not be safe in a Muslim country because I am a Jew.

Where atheists are free to not have a religion.

Where no matter your sexual orientation you don't have to be afraid of being executed for them.

its amazing to me to think anyone would not want to live in freedom...

In most Islamic countries non Muslims have good reason to be afraid...

People are killed for being gay...

Women are arrested and charged for being raped, not the rapist...

The leaders are not elected so if you don't like your government, Oh well I guess you are out of luck..

Now we see what happens when the people in Islamic countries with autocratic governments or monarchies are going through to have freedoms..

Syria, Yemen, Lybia are massacring its citizens for taking to the streets to demand freedoms.

The other countries that aren't dealing with open revolt to their authoritarian governments may soon be dealing with the open revolts.

Last edited by Jazzymom; 06-11-2011 at 09:15 AM..
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Old 06-11-2011, 09:13 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
616 posts, read 592,638 times
Reputation: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
An animal defends itself against a foe standing in front of him wanting to kill him.

He does not fly airplanes into buildings, strap bombs on his body and walk into buildings filled with people, nor shoot rockets into civilian areas filled with people going about their everyday lives....

Big difference......

Animals do not agree to be beated, Try when you come to their house or shelter and attack them and kill Do you think are they accept!! ..

What if we came to the barn and shoot rocket on them do you think are they accept!!!


WHY I said this ? It's instinct

The animal world is Beautiful we can take the lessons of them too
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Old 06-11-2011, 09:18 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
616 posts, read 592,638 times
Reputation: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Funny not to want to live with democracy and freedom of religion....

Have you ever lived under democracy? Have you ever lived in a place where no matter your beliefs you are free to practice them...

Where churches, mosques, synagogues are everywhere and people are openly free to follow their faith.

I am safe in my country but I would not be safe in a Muslim country because I am a Jew.

Where atheists are free to not have a religion.

Where no matter your sexual orientation you don't have to be afraid of being executed for them.

its amazing to me to think anyone would not want to live in freedom...

In most Islamic countries non Muslims have good reason to be afraid...

People are killed for being gay...

Women are arrested and charged for being raped, not the rapist...

The leaders are not elected so if you don't like your government, Oh well I guess you are out of luck..

Now we see what happens when the people in Islamic countries with autocratic governments or monarchies are going through to have freedoms..

Syria, Yemen, Lybia are massacring its citizens for taking to the streets to demand freedoms.

The other countries that aren't dealing with open revolt to their authoritarian governments may soon be dealing with the open revolts.


Where be God is my freedom
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Old 06-11-2011, 09:23 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,436,243 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
Animals do not agree to be beated, Try when you come to their house or shelter and attack them and kill Do you think they accept!! ..

What if we came to the barn and shoot rocket on them do you think they accept!!!


WHY I said this ? It's instinct

The animal world is Beautiful we can take the lessons of them too

Sorry but Israel is no longer in Gaza, they left years ago.... Yet Hamas still sends rockets into Southern Israel...

The folks they are attacking are villages of civilians going about their daily lives.......

That is not self defense.....

Israel is having to place the iron dome rocket defense system to protect civilians against the rocket attacks.....

A defensive move so the rockets are destroyed in the air before they reach their targets...

That does not sound like Gaza is defending itself, it is a very offensive move to send rockets into civilian areas, killing men, women and children who are not attacking you...

Animals attack for survival and food...
Animals attack a foe in front of him wanting to kill him... Not an enemy 100s of miles away.

Animals attack for food, again the animal is in close proximity..... Not 100s of miles away...


There is a blockade agains Gaza for this very reason..... Rockets

When rockets stop going into Israel, the blockade will end because there will not be a need to stop weapons from being smuggled into Gaza for Hamas to use...

When Gaza is not being run by Hamas a terrorist organization who wants nothing other then the destruction of Israel then the blockade will end...
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Old 06-11-2011, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,339,951 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Funny not to want to live with democracy and freedom of religion....

Have you ever lived under democracy? Have you ever lived in a place where no matter your beliefs you are free to practice them...

Where churches, mosques, synagogues are everywhere and people are openly free to follow their faith.

I am safe in my country but I would not be safe in a Muslim country because I am a Jew.

Where atheists are free to not have a religion.

Where no matter your sexual orientation you don't have to be afraid of being executed for them.

its amazing to me to think anyone would not want to live in freedom...

In most Islamic countries non Muslims have good reason to be afraid...

People are killed for being gay...

Women are arrested and charged for being raped, not the rapist...

The leaders are not elected so if you don't like your government, Oh well I guess you are out of luck..

Now we see what happens when the people in Islamic countries with autocratic governments or monarchies are going through to have freedoms..

Syria, Yemen, Lybia are massacring its citizens for taking to the streets to demand freedoms.

The other countries that aren't dealing with open revolt to their authoritarian governments may soon be dealing with the open revolts.
Even under a democracy, freedom is only what the majority determines to be freedom. there can not be full freedom in a civilized world. One person's rights end where another person's rights begin. Lhis requires the implimentation and enforcement of laws. Laws are limitations and bars to freedoms. It is good some freedoms are forbidden. The only people who can live in full freedom, live alone on uninhabited Islands, but even then they are limited by the laws of physics.

We humans have very few free choices in life. We either obey the laws of the nation we live in or leave the nation. the laws of any nation will always be based upon the majority of the citizens. Dictatorships and monarchies may come, but the second the leader, becomes unbearable or shows a weakness, revolt will be inevitable. Democracy can only exist when the majority desire it, Shariah can only last when the majority desire and follow it. But Sharia is a moot point as to have true Shariah it has to be under a Kalifah, and there will be no Kalifah until the return of Jesus(as) and the birth of the Mehdi.

Our only real freedom any of us has is depended upon our ability to move to a Nation whose laws we agree with. If we can not do that our freedom is limited to how we can worship if we choose to worship.
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:25 AM
 
9,573 posts, read 4,896,791 times
Reputation: 3897
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Even under a democracy, freedom is only what the majority determines to be freedom. there can not be full freedom in a civilized world. One person's rights end where another person's rights begin. Lhis requires the implimentation and enforcement of laws. Laws are limitations and bars to freedoms. It is good some freedoms are forbidden. The only people who can live in full freedom, live alone on uninhabited Islands, but even then they are limited by the laws of physics.

We humans have very few free choices in life. We either obey the laws of the nation we live in or leave the nation. the laws of any nation will always be based upon the majority of the citizens. Dictatorships and monarchies may come, but the second the leader, becomes unbearable or shows a weakness, revolt will be inevitable. Democracy can only exist when the majority desire it, Shariah can only last when the majority desire and follow it. But Sharia is a moot point as to have true Shariah it has to be under a Kalifah, and there will be no Kalifah until the return of Jesus(as) and the birth of the Mehdi.

Our only real freedom any of us has is depended upon our ability to move to a Nation whose laws we agree with. If we can not do that our freedom is limited to how we can worship if we choose to worship.
Let me deal with only two of your gross generalities.

First, we have a court system that restrains what the majority determines to be freedom and force laws upon the minority.

Second, Sharia [or any other system] can last for a long time if the rulers have sufficient force to impose its will. It doesn't take a majority to desire Sharia.

As to your comment that --- "We humans have very few free choices in life." --- I think we in the U.S have many free choices in life. From the big ones: our religion if any, whether and who to marry, which gov't. policies to oppose, where to live, etc., to the small ones.
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:28 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,339,951 times
Reputation: 7407
Come live alongside me on the rez and see just how much freedom we have here in the good old US of A
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:46 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,436,243 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by weaam View Post
Where be God is my freedom

??? Your comment makes no sense.....

So you are saying unless you live under Muslim rule and under sharia law you have the freedom of Allah?

I guess all the Muslims who live in my country and have democracy, freedom of religion and are free to practice their religion don't have freedom?
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:49 AM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,436,243 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Come live alongside me on the rez and see just how much freedom we have here in the good old US of A

As has been noted before you are not a native american, but are married to a native american and no one forces you to live on a reservation.....

You are making a choice that you had freedom to make...

And you were free to choose your religion and to practice it freely without fear of death....

If you chose to leave Islam you would not have to fear death for being an apostate....

You live in a country with courts and laws and democracy...

This country is not perfect but it is heaven compared to what most Muslims live with in other countries with absolute dictatorships, monarchies, and then you have countries like Iran that are run by Mullahs....

The USA may not be perfect but it is heaven compared to many places....
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Old 06-11-2011, 10:54 AM
 
Location: Saudi Arabia
616 posts, read 592,638 times
Reputation: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Sorry but Israel is no longer in Gaza, they left years ago.... Yet Hamas still sends rockets into Southern Israel...

The folks they are attacking are villages of civilians going about their daily lives.......

That is not self defense.....

Israel is having to place the iron dome rocket defense system to protect civilians against the rocket attacks.....

A defensive move so the rockets are destroyed in the air before they reach their targets...

That does not sound like Gaza is defending itself, it is a very offensive move to send rockets into civilian areas, killing men, women and children who are not attacking you...

Animals attack for survival and food...
Animals attack a foe in front of him wanting to kill him... Not an enemy 100s of miles away.

Animals attack for food, again the animal is in close proximity..... Not 100s of miles away...


There is a blockade agains Gaza for this very reason..... Rockets

When rockets stop going into Israel, the blockade will end because there will not be a need to stop weapons from being smuggled into Gaza for Hamas to use...

When Gaza is not being run by Hamas a terrorist organization who wants nothing other then the destruction of Israel then the blockade will end...



This is Israeli Zionism's justification, Continuous Israeli crimes before he was born Hamas...

Let's go back before the war on Gaza..

First Israel is occupying their land for decades now and putting them under siege for a very long time.(the history of the conflict is too long to discuss here)


On 19 June 2008, a six-month Egyptian-brokered cease-fire agreement went into effect between Hamas and Israel.

On June 24, 2008 Israel raided Nablus (West Bank) killing two Palestinians, including a commander of Islamic Jihad (an organization independent of Hamas). Later, on the same day, three Qassam rockets were fired into Sderot, Israel, causing two minor injuries. Islamic Jihad, claimed responsibility, stating that this action was in response to the Israeli raid. Hamas subsequently pressured the group into abiding by the ceasefire. On 26 June, rockets were fired by Fatah, a Hamas rival, elements of which sometimes collaborate with Israel.


On 26 June, Hamas warned Israel that its closure of the Gaza border was seen as a major cease-fire violation. Nonetheless, Hamas called on other Palestinian factions to abide by the truce. Rocket and mortar attacks continued, at a rate of several rockets per month, with no one taking responsibility.

On 4 November 2008, Israeli troops raided the Gaza Strip and killed six Hamas gunmen. The Israeli military claimed that the target of the raid was a tunnel that Hamas was planning to use to capture Israeli soldiers. Hamas termed this raid a "massive breach of the truce".

On 13 December 2008, Israel announced that it was in favor of extending the cease-fire, provided Hamas adhered to its conditions. Having previously asserted that an end to the truce would carry huge popular support and that there are daily Israeli attacks, on 20 December Hamas officially announced that they would not be extending the cease-fire, citing Israeli border closures as the primary reason, and resumed its shelling of the western Negev. Hamas blamed Israel for the end of the ceasefire, saying it had not respected its terms, including the lifting of the blockade, under which little more than humanitarian aid has been allowed into Gaza. Israel said it initially began easing the blockade, but resumed it when Hamas failed to fulfill the agreed conditions, including ending all rocket fire and halting weapons smuggling.


Although Israel accuses the Hamas government in Gaza of breaking the truce, the Palestinian Center for Human Rights documented hundreds of truce violations by the Israeli military, including three violations on the very day the truce began on June 19th, 2008.


Source(s):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008%E2%80%

Israel violation of ceasefire on 4th Nov
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/nov (broken link)

graph showing firing rockets
http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas (broken link)

Palestinian Center for Human Rights
Palestinian Center for Human Rights

Hamas announce end of the truce after repeated Israeli violations (195 violations)
http://www.alsumaria.tv/en/World-News/2-

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