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Old 07-19-2011, 07:38 AM
 
Location: Missouri, USA
4,348 posts, read 2,975,717 times
Reputation: 2030

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reverend1111 View Post
How about we continue where we left off from here and go to a place that is fitted for our souls condition. Meaning, how much love we have for God and each other. If no love, darkness (hell). If alot of love and overflowing for each other, light (heaven). "Let there be light" because the light of God is Love. Darkness is merely the absense of any love.
This is a much, much better argument than Pascal's Wager. Thank you.

I still think that God probably does not want to be discovered, if there is one, because of all the different religions in existence, but I'm liking religions which tell that something along the lines of the above is true quite a bit more now.

Last edited by Clintone; 07-19-2011 at 07:47 AM..

 
Old 07-19-2011, 05:19 PM
 
439 posts, read 482,247 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by agnostic soldier View Post
Option 4: There is a god and an afterlife, but not the one you believed in and therefore you will be tortured forever.

.

Allah is the only god

not Jesus peace be upon him

not any thing else
 
Old 07-19-2011, 05:31 PM
 
439 posts, read 482,247 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbancharlotte View Post
Let's look at this from a "what if God exists" angle. Wouldn't an omniscient/omnipotent being know the difference between those that believe in him because he is in their hearts; vs. those that ONLY "believe" in him as a safety net out of Hell's fire?

With that said, why are you asking atheists to break one of your God's commandments (ya know, the one about lying).
Moderator cut: delete
the believe can be very big and can be very small and can between that
the most important thing is to believe in the one who created you (ALLAH)
and believe in his messenger (MUHAMMED)



.

Last edited by Miss Blue; 07-19-2011 at 09:49 PM.. Reason: snippet and link only
 
Old 07-19-2011, 05:46 PM
 
Location: Ohio
13,900 posts, read 10,784,978 times
Reputation: 7242
Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
it is a foolish thing to bet on hell.

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let us look at this matter in a logical and wise angle
if we apply this rule then the only way for someone to know that hell and paradise exist or do not exist is after he die .

then he will be in one of this three
1- he is finished and resting for ever with any joy or pain with no hell and no paradise
2- he is in paradise having fun he never taste before
3- he is in hell for ever and continous painful torture
in summary
a- the believer might get option 1 or option 2 but for sure he would not get option 3

b- the athiest might get option 1 and also might get option 3

now
from logic and wise angle
the objective for any person with tiny intelligence to reach result in part a summary
I think its quite presumptuous to assume what God will do with everyone according to what they do or do not believe, if anything at all! Just because someone is a believer DOES NOT mean that they will be rewarded in an afterlife, if there even is one. And, just because someone is an atheist DOES NOT mean that they will not be rewarded in an afterlife.

My personal belief is that IF there is a God, then he/she/it will reward or punish you according to what is in your heart as a person and how you lived your life IF infact it is his/her/its will to do so.
 
Old 07-19-2011, 05:47 PM
 
Location: Richland, Washington
4,144 posts, read 5,107,746 times
Reputation: 2539
Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
Allah is the only god

not Jesus peace be upon him

not any thing else
Wrong god finalmessage. I am the one and only god. Bow before me and worship my great and awesome glory. Do it not and you shall be cast into the depths of hell to burn in excruciating pain for eternity. It would be foolish of you to bet that I am not god when clearly the only logical option here is for you to praise and worship me or else.

Last edited by agnostic soldier; 07-19-2011 at 05:59 PM..
 
Old 07-19-2011, 06:30 PM
 
439 posts, read 482,247 times
Reputation: 31
Bethink thee of him who had an argument with Abraham about his Lord, because Allah had given him the kingdom; how, when Abraham said: My Lord is He Who giveth life and causeth death,
he answered: I give life and cause death.
Abraham said: Lo! Allah causeth the sun to rise in the East, so do thou cause it to come up from the West. Thus was the disbeliever abashed.
And Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk. The Noble Quran.
 
Old 07-19-2011, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Golden, CO
2,108 posts, read 2,498,425 times
Reputation: 1018
finalmessage: dude, you started this thread claiming to make a rational argument for following god, but then you refuse to engage with us in a rational discussion about whether your argument is really rational. Instead you just claim Allah is the only God and then quote more scripture at us.

Look, we blew your argument to hell and back. And just because you and others claim Allah is the only god doesn't make it so, nor is it the only possibility one has to entertain when considering whether it is wise to gamble on him as opposed to all the other possible gods.

This is a discussion board. Discuss with us. Don't just quote scripture.
 
Old 07-19-2011, 07:01 PM
 
439 posts, read 482,247 times
Reputation: 31
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueffenhardt View Post
This is a discussion board. Discuss with us. Don't just quote scripture.

i am discussing using the translations of the verses of the Quran.
because they are very affective
 
Old 07-19-2011, 07:48 PM
 
Location: Albuquerque, NM
13,293 posts, read 12,794,076 times
Reputation: 6636
This video does a pretty good job of blasting Pascal's Wager out of the water


‪Betting on infinity‬‏ - YouTube
 
Old 07-19-2011, 08:27 PM
 
Location: around the way
656 posts, read 932,411 times
Reputation: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
i am discussing using the translations of the verses of the Quran.
because they are very affective
Considering that nobody in this thread is buying it, I'd say they're anything but effective.


Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmessage View Post
Bethink thee of him who had an argument with Abraham about his Lord, because Allah had given him the kingdom; how, when Abraham said: My Lord is He Who giveth life and causeth death,
he answered: I give life and cause death.
Abraham said: Lo! Allah causeth the sun to rise in the East, so do thou cause it to come up from the West. Thus was the disbeliever abashed.
And Allah guideth not wrongdoing folk. The Noble Quran.
OK, great. Two guys have an argument that boils down to:
"My god is awesome"
"Me too"
"No you're not."
"Yeah I know lol"

Exactly what does this have to do with the issue at hand? How is this supposed to convince anybody of anything?
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