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Old 09-16-2012, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRage View Post
RedRage is because I attend UH and our school's color is red and the rage is to symbolize football prowess (which we lack right now).

I don't think its so much that Sunni's don't believe in development as much as historical events (e.g. post-colonialism, lack of leadership in the Arab world), economic crises, and a rise in power of fundamentalism via Saudi backing that contributes to the savagery we see.
Sadly I have to agree with you. Some members of the al-Saud family do misuse their power.

Out of curiosity is there any difficulty for Shi'a to do Hajj?
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Old 09-16-2012, 11:34 AM
 
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Sadly I have to agree with you. Some members of the al-Saud family do misuse their power.

Out of curiosity is there any difficulty for Shi'a to do Hajj?
I'm not sure but on YouTube I saw a documentary which examined the Hajj and how blacks from Africa were treated as second-class citizens and it also showed the disparity between the poor (who took refuge in mosques and under trees) and the wealthy (who had AC in tents for example).
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Old 09-16-2012, 12:30 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,299,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedRage View Post
I'm not sure but on YouTube I saw a documentary which examined the Hajj and how blacks from Africa were treated as second-class citizens and it also showed the disparity between the poor (who took refuge in mosques and under trees) and the wealthy (who had AC in tents for example).
Up until the 1920s or so all Pilgrims stayed in their own tents they brought with them. Nobody had any luxuries. Perhaps the building of hotels and the like is proving to be a bad thing. all Muslims should be treated equal with equal accommodations while on Hajj. The richest should have no better than the poorest. Just my opinion astagfirullah
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Old 09-16-2012, 01:43 PM
 
Location: Northern CA
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Are you enemies or allies? I'm referring to Sunni vs Shia. Don't the Sunni's believe Shia are bad Muslims and visa versa? The Saudi hate Iran.

If Iran or Syria is attacked, would you not want to come together to help eachother against the western powers that will kill many Muslims, as they are now? I say we are now, because we are supplying and training the foreign rebels (also Muslims, Brotherhood and others) to bring regime change, as we did in Libya.

For a religion of peace, you don't seem to have any problem killing eachother and others.
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Old 09-16-2012, 01:45 PM
 
Location: Northern CA
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RedRage, Woodrow told us that taqqiya is mostly attributed to Shia - is that correct?
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Old 09-16-2012, 01:56 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,299,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudhopper View Post
Are you enemies or allies? I'm referring to Sunni vs Shia. Don't the Sunni's believe Shia are bad Muslims and visa versa? The Saudi hate Iran.

If Iran or Syria is attacked, would you not want to come together to help eachother against the western powers that will kill many Muslims, as they are now? I say we are now, because we are supplying and training the foreign rebels (also Muslims, Brotherhood and others) to bring regime change, as we did in Libya.

For a religion of peace, you don't seem to have any problem killing eachother and others.
While there are considerable differences between us. Most of us accept each other as being Muslim. The unrest between Shi'a and Sunni in the mideast is more political than religious. The Majority of Shi'a are Iranian and the Majority of Arabs are Sunni. This is really an Arab/Iranian issue and not a religious one. Outside the Mideast Shi'a and Sunni coexist and often live side by side. It is not uncommon for us to pray in each other's Mosques. at prayer time we usually just look for the nearest Mosque and pay no attention as to if it is Shi'a or Sunni or Sufi.

You are correct there is political hatred between Iran and Saudi. But that is more of a hatred of each other's government. We all go to Mecca for Hajj and during Hajj are to treat each other as equals.

On a Side note. My oldest daughter is Shi'a, My youngest is Sunni. So far they haven't killed each other.
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Old 09-16-2012, 02:19 PM
 
Location: Northern CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
While there are considerable differences between us. Most of us accept each other as being Muslim. The unrest between Shi'a and Sunni in the mideast is more political than religious. The Majority of Shi'a are Iranian and the Majority of Arabs are Sunni. This is really an Arab/Iranian issue and not a religious one. Outside the Mideast Shi'a and Sunni coexist and often live side by side. It is not uncommon for us to pray in each other's Mosques. at prayer time we usually just look for the nearest Mosque and pay no attention as to if it is Shi'a or Sunni or Sufi.

You are correct there is political hatred between Iran and Saudi. But that is more of a hatred of each other's government. We all go to Mecca for Hajj and during Hajj are to treat each other as equals.

On a Side note. My oldest daughter is Shi'a, My youngest is Sunni. So far they haven't killed each other.
Interesting that you attempt to separate their government from their religion, they are one and the same, are they not?
Can you help me understand why the Saudi hate Iran? Am I to understand they hate Syria too?
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Old 09-16-2012, 02:53 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,299,862 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudhopper View Post
Interesting that you attempt to separate their government from their religion, they are one and the same, are they not?
Can you help me understand why the Saudi hate Iran? Am I to understand they hate Syria too?
The Hatred between Saudi and Iran goes back many centuries and is the result as to which race will rule the Mideast. Iranians are Aryans and Arabs are Semitic. This same hatred appeared in Germany with the hatred between Aryan Germans and Semitic Jews

Saudi is a Monarchy and not a theocracy. Iran and Vatican City are the only 2 Nations that are theocracies. SOURCE

All things we do in life are part of our De'en. For us there is no separation of government and religion. Even for those living in the USA how we follow the government is a reflection of how well or how badly we follow Islam. We can not seperate our life (De'en) and the government we follow is part of our De'en (Life). The word for life and religion is the same word in Arabic that being the word De'en.

I am not too certain about the hatred of Syria. From what I see the Saudi government has some hostilities towards Syria.

I did find this:

Quote:
Ever since the formation of the modern nation-states of Syria and Saudi Arabia, the relationship has always been turbulent. In the grand geopolitical power struggle, both countries commonly found themselves on opposing sides, each representing diametrically opposing ideologies that clashed within their borders or through proxies in Lebanon, Palestine, and elsewhere.
Syria prides itself as a secular republic and a bastion of Arab nationalism, with close ties to Russia. On the other hand, Saudi Arabia is a reactionary monarchy and embodies itself as a caretaker of Islam, while having an extensive bond with the US and Western Europe. True, the rhetoric of the two countries may not correspond with their practice, but the ideological narratives they superficially embrace are in conflict, and much of their foreign policy aims have been at odds.
SOURCE
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Old 09-17-2012, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Northern CA
12,770 posts, read 9,850,497 times
Reputation: 4243
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
The Hatred between Saudi and Iran goes back many centuries and is the result as to which race will rule the Mideast. Iranians are Aryans and Arabs are Semitic. This same hatred appeared in Germany with the hatred between Aryan Germans and Semitic Jews

Saudi is a Monarchy and not a theocracy. Iran and Vatican City are the only 2 Nations that are theocracies. SOURCE

All things we do in life are part of our De'en. For us there is no separation of government and religion. Even for those living in the USA how we follow the government is a reflection of how well or how badly we follow Islam. We can not seperate our life (De'en) and the government we follow is part of our De'en (Life). The word for life and religion is the same word in Arabic that being the word De'en.

I am not too certain about the hatred of Syria. From what I see the Saudi government has some hostilities towards Syria.

I did find this:

SOURCE
I am quite surprised that your source is so objective. That was an excellent article and does clarify the rivalry. It is obvious to me that Saudi Arabia is the problem. For Muslims, divine law is superior to rule by an individual or royal family, especially one so closely aligned to the west. Such irony to claim they want democracy in Syria, when the Saudi rule their own population so harshly.
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Old 09-17-2012, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,299,862 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by claudhopper View Post
I am quite surprised that your source is so objective. That was an excellent article and does clarify the rivalry. It is obvious to me that Saudi Arabia is the problem. For Muslims, divine law is superior to rule by an individual or royal family, especially one so closely aligned to the west. Such irony to claim they want democracy in Syria, when the Saudi rule their own population so harshly.
You will find many of us are dissatisfied with the Saudi Government.
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