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Old 08-15-2011, 12:25 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,363,589 times
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What is probably the most frequently asked question I get is:

"Why don't Muslim do anything about the terrorists?"


My first reply is "Why dosen't the media ever acknowledge our efforts?"

Nearly ever Imam worldwide makes it a point to denounce terrorism at every friday Jummah. But you only hear about the few that encourage terrorism. Almost daily noted Islamic Scholars issue fatwahs condemning terrorism, but you only hear about the occasional "madman" who issues a fatwah demanding the killing of a cartoonist or the like.

A few examples of what is really happening world wide.

















In addition there are almost daily protest marches by Muslims condemning terrorism. Terrorism is one of the biggest threats any Muslim faces. It is not just non-Muslims who are targeted, so are we. More Muslims have died at the hands of terrorists than any other group of people.

The difficulty is most of us do not know who or where the terrorists are until after they act. It is like asking Americans to stop serial killers in Brasil since both are Christian majority countries.

It is difficult to reach them as Islam has no central leader or ordained clergy. There is no one person or even group that speaks for all of Islam. It has to be a one on one, Muslim to Muslim effort to be effective. but we are out there and we do speak against terrorism. We do point out Terrorists are not martyrs, they are criminals and not following Islam; The next video was one of the first directed to the Islamic communities in English speaking countries. It was distributed free in nearly every Mosque. Nearly every English speaking Muslim has seen this:

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Old 08-15-2011, 03:26 PM
 
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I know the Qur'an has some verses that condemn homosexuality, just as the Bible does. But there are many Christians that in their hearts believe that God and Jesus love and accept homosexuals and homosexuality just as He does heterosexuals and heterosexuality. My question is: despite the verses in the Qur'an that condemn homosexuality, are there Muslim communities or methods of practice that involve accepting homosexuality? Are there any mosques or Muslim-affiliated organizations that accept gay/bi members? Is it mostly a function of how strict a specific mosque or community is, much like with Christianity?
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Old 08-15-2011, 03:45 PM
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
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When I meantion that the Qur'an contains explicit calls to the killing and/or punishment of non believers and to wage jihad, my Muslim friends tell me I take them out of context, or that they are being misinterpreted.

I'va been looking for the context everywhere but can't find it. Can you help me provide the context and the correct interpretation of the following verses?

Quote:
"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. But you may hate a thing although it is good for you, and love a thing although it is bad for you. God knows, but you know not" (2:216).


Quote:
If ye go not forth He will afflict you with a painful doom, and will choose instead of you a folk other than you. Ye cannot harm Him at all. Allah is Able to do all things.


Quote:
"[T]hose that deny Our revelations shall be punished for their misdeeds" (6:49).


Quote:
Slay them wherever you find them. Drive them out of the places from which they drove you. Idolatry is worse than carnage


Thanks a bunch!
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Old 08-15-2011, 03:58 PM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimchimpsky View Post
I know the Qur'an has some verses that condemn homosexuality, just as the Bible does. But there are many Christians that in their hearts believe that God and Jesus love and accept homosexuals and homosexuality just as He does heterosexuals and heterosexuality. My question is: despite the verses in the Qur'an that condemn homosexuality, are there Muslim communities or methods of practice that involve accepting homosexuality? Are there any mosques or Muslim-affiliated organizations that accept gay/bi members? Is it mostly a function of how strict a specific mosque or community is, much like with Christianity?
The Old Testatment condems male homosexuality and heterosexual sodomy. I'm not sure there is anything said about female homosexuality, other than that women must submit to men.
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Old 08-15-2011, 04:03 PM
 
Location: City-Data Forum
7,945 posts, read 4,772,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collective View Post
When I meantion that the Qur'an contains explicit calls to the killing and/or punishment of non believers and to wage jihad, my Muslim friends tell me I take them out of context, or that they are being misinterpreted.

I'va been looking for the context everywhere but can't find it. Can you help me provide the context and the correct interpretation of the following verses?

[/i]







Thanks a bunch!
Not a Muslim here but I could interpret them kindly:
1. Muslims must fight back when attacked even if they don’t want to.
2. If Muslims give up they will be punished. And other people will be chosen.
3. Those that deny the truth punish themselves.
4. Idolatry is the most horrible sin other than associating God with any equals, or things that also deserve worship.
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Old 08-15-2011, 04:06 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,363,589 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nimchimpsky View Post
I know the Qur'an has some verses that condemn homosexuality, just as the Bible does. But there are many Christians that in their hearts believe that God and Jesus love and accept homosexuals and homosexuality just as He does heterosexuals and heterosexuality. My question is: despite the verses in the Qur'an that condemn homosexuality, are there Muslim communities or methods of practice that involve accepting homosexuality? Are there any mosques or Muslim-affiliated organizations that accept gay/bi members? Is it mostly a function of how strict a specific mosque or community is, much like with Christianity?
It is homosexual acts that are condemned, not the person. As long as a person is not openly and publicly engaging in a sexual act, nobody is going to condemn them. That actually goes for any sexual act.

However, you will find communities in which if a person is even suspected of homosexuality they will be ostracized for it. While in Islam, homosexuality is considered a crime and the maximum penalty is death. Muslims have to abide by the laws of the nation they are in. Very few countries beside Iran enforce death for gay people. Even in strict Islamic nations such as Iran, It is rare for a homosexual to be convicted except in the extremest of cases and that is when the person is blatantly and publicly engaging in sex acts along with promoting homosexuality publicly.

There are growing numbers of support groups for gay Muslims. I do not know of any Mosque that would not allow a person in because the person may be gay. Actually if a person is a practicing Muslim, nobody would ever know if the person is or is not gay. We keep our sex lives very private.
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Old 08-15-2011, 04:38 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,363,589 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Collective View Post
When I meantion that the Qur'an contains explicit calls to the killing and/or punishment of non believers and to wage jihad, my Muslim friends tell me I take them out of context, or that they are being misinterpreted.

I'va been looking for the context everywhere but can't find it. Can you help me provide the context and the correct interpretation of the following verses?

[/i]







Thanks a bunch!
Luminous Truth did a pretty good job at explaining. I will simply go into a little more detail. By putting them in with the ayyats that precede and follow each of the ayyats you quoted. They make more sense when you see what is being spoken of.

Quote:
Quote:
"Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you dislike it. But you may hate a thing although it is good for you, and love a thing although it is bad for you. God knows, but you know not" (2:216).
213. Mankind was one single nation, and Allah sent Messengers with glad tidings and warnings; and with them He sent the Book in truth, to judge between people in matters wherein they differed; but the People of the Book, after the clear Signs came to them, did not differ among themselves, except through selfish contumacy. Allah by His Grace Guided the believers to the Truth, concerning that wherein they differed. For Allah guided whom He will to a path that is straight.
214. Or do ye think that ye shall enter the Garden (of bliss) without such (trials) as came to those who passed away before you? they encountered suffering and adversity, and were so shaken in spirit that even the Messenger and those of faith who were with him cried: "When (will come) the help of Allah." Ah! Verily, the help of Allah is (always) near!
215. They ask thee what they should spend (In charity). Say: Whatever ye spend that is good, is for parents and kindred and orphans and those in want and for wayfarers. And whatever ye do that is good, -(Allah) knoweth it well.
216. Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not.
217. They ask thee concerning fighting in the Prohibited Month. Say: "Fighting therein is a grave (offence); but graver is it in the sight of Allah to prevent access to the path of Allah, to deny Him, to prevent access to the Sacred Mosque, and drive out its members." Tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter. Nor will they cease fighting you until they turn you back from your faith if they can. And if any of you Turn back from their faith and die in unbelief, their works will bear no fruit in this life and in the Hereafter; they will be companions of the Fire and will abide therein.
218. Those who believed and those who suffered exile and fought (and strove and struggled) in the path of Allah,- they have the hope of the Mercy of Allah. And Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.








Quote:
Quote:
If ye go not forth He will afflict you with a painful doom, and will choose instead of you a folk other than you. Ye cannot harm Him at all. Allah is Able to do all things.
9:36 Lo! the number of the months with Allah is twelve months by Allah's ordinance in the day that He created the heavens and the earth. Four of them are sacred: that is the right religion. So wrong not yourselves in them. And wage war on all of the idolaters as they are waging war on all of you. And know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him).
9:37 Postponement (of a sacred month) is only an excess of disbelief whereby those who disbelieve are misled; they allow it one year and forbid it (another) year, that they may make up the number of the months which Allah hath hallowed, so that they allow that which Allah hath forbidden. The evil of their deeds is made fairseeming unto them. Allah guideth not the disbelieving folk.

9:38 O ye who believe! What aileth you that when it is said unto you: Go forth in the way of Allah, ye are bowed down to the ground with heaviness. Take ye pleasure in the life of the world rather than in the Hereafter ? The comfort of the life of the world is but little in the Hereafter.


9:39 If ye go not forth He will afflict you with a painful doom, and will choose instead of you a folk other than you. Ye cannot harm Him at all. Allah is Able to do all things.

9:40 If ye help him not, still Allah helped him when those who disbelieve drove him forth, the second of two; when they two were in the cave, when he said unto his comrade: Grieve not. Lo! Allah is with us. Then Allah caused His peace of reassurance to descend upon him and supported him with hosts ye cannot see, and made the word of those who disbelieved the nethermost, while Allah's Word it was that became the uppermost. Allah is Mighty, Wise.

(9:41)
"Strive with your wealth and your lives in the way of Allah!"
Fight for Allah with your wealth and whatever weapons are available to you.


(9:42) "They verily are liars."
Those who refuse to fight for Allah (claiming they are unable) are liars who have destroyed their souls.
Quote:

Quote:
"[T]hose that deny Our revelations shall be punished for their misdeeds" (6:49).
44. But when they forgot the warning they had received, We opened to them the gates of all (good) things, until, in the midst of their enjoyment of Our gifts, on a sudden, We called them to account, when lo! they were plunged in despair!
45. Of the wrong-doers the last remnant was cut off. Praise be to Allah, the Cherisher of the worlds.
46. Say: "Think ye, if Allah took away your hearing and your sight, and sealed up your hearts, who - a god other than Allah - could restore them to you?" See how We explain the signs by various (symbols); yet they turn aside.
47. Say: "Think ye, if the punishment of Allah comes to you, whether suddenly or openly, will any be destroyed except those who do wrong?
48. We send the apostles only to give good news and to warn: so those who believe and mend (their lives),- upon them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
49. But those who reject our signs,- them shall punishment touch, for that they ceased not from transgressing.
50. Say: "I tell you not that with me are the treasures of Allah, nor do I know what is hidden, nor do I tell you I am an angel. I but follow what is revealed to me." Say: "can the blind be held equal to the seeing?" Will ye then consider not?
51. Give this warning to those in whose (hearts) is the fear that they will be brought (to judgment) before their Lord: except for Him they will have no protector nor intercessor: that they may guard (against evil).
52. Send not away those who call on their Lord morning and evening, seeking His face. In naught art thou accountable for them, and in naught are they accountable for thee, that thou shouldst turn them away, and thus be (one) of the unjust.




Quote:
Slay them wherever you find them. Drive them out of the places from which they drove you. Idolatry is worse than carnage
187. Permitted to you, on the night of the fasts, is the approach to your wives. They are your garments and ye are their garments. Allah knoweth what ye used to do secretly among yourselves; but He turned to you and forgave you; so now associate with them, and seek what Allah Hath ordained for you, and eat and drink, until the white thread of dawn appear to you distinct from its black thread; then complete your fast Till the night appears; but do not associate with your wives while ye are in retreat in the mosques. Those are Limits (set by) Allah. Approach not nigh thereto. Thus doth Allah make clear His Signs to men: that they may learn self-restraint.
188. And do not eat up your property among yourselves for vanities, nor use it as bait for the judges, with intent that ye may eat up wrongfully and knowingly a little of (other) people's property.
189. They ask thee concerning the New Moons. Say: They are but signs to mark fixed periods of time in (the affairs of) men, and for Pilgrimage. It is no virtue if ye enter your houses from the back: It is virtue if ye fear Allah. Enter houses through the proper doors: And fear Allah. That ye may prosper.
190. Fight in the cause of Allah those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for Allah loveth not transgressors.
191. And slay them wherever ye catch them, and turn them out from where they have Turned you out; for tumult and oppression are worse than slaughter; but fight them not at the Sacred Mosque, unless they (first) fight you there; but if they fight you, slay them. Such is the reward of those who suppress faith.
192. But if they cease, Allah is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.
193. And fight them on until there is no more Tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah. but if they cease, Let there be no hostility except to those who practise oppression.
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Old 08-16-2011, 03:39 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,363,589 times
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Who are the Sufi?

Rather than to describe their beliefs I will simply say we do accept them as being Muslim. In Arabic they are called Tasawwuf

The Sufi, unlike most Muslims do not follow any madhab. However they do claim sufi to be a madhab. some Islamic Scholars do have the opinion they should be accepted as a valid Madhab.

They are a bit of a mystical group often into things like fortune telling. They also are noted for their Music and poetry. They first appeared in about the 8th century Persia (now Iran). they often shun material things and are typically very pacifistic. they have become well known for their Dances, Music, Poetry, and Artwork. they also have a reputation of being fortune tellers, spiritualists and deeply involved in mysticism.

Some believe they predate Muhammad(PBUH) and are an offshoot of Buddhism and/or Taoism that adapted to Islam.Sufi'ism has subdivided into munerous division some of which are Ba 'Alawiyya, Chishti, Naqshbandi, Nimatullahi, Oveyssi, Qadiria Boutshishia, Qadiriyyah, Qalandariyya, Sarwari Qadiri, Shadhliyya and Suhrawardiyya

Overall they are very spiritual and some believe they represent the non-Material aspect of Islam.

Videos are worth a thousand word:

Keep in mind we Muslims consider any form of instruement music to be sinful



The Rumi Poetry is the best known form of Sufi poetry.




We also consider dancing with those of the opposite gender to be sinful



Meditation and prayer are a major part of Sufi life:







A shrine to 2 Sufi saints in Kashmir


Last edited by Woodrow LI; 08-16-2011 at 05:08 PM..
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Old 08-16-2011, 06:44 PM
 
Location: Coastal New Jersey
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Woodrow: "Why don't Muslim do anything about the terrorists?"

My first reply is "Why dosen't the media ever acknowledge our efforts?"

Sorry, I didn't want to quote that entire post.

A better question might be "why don't people pay attention when the media does cover those efforts?" I've read quite a few articles by Muslims condemning terrorism, especially right after 9/11, unless it's just that I'm in the NY metro area and it truly isn't covered in other parts of the country.

Right after 9/11, in New York and in a number of the communities in NJ where there are many Muslims, we saw the formation of interfaith groups who reacted to the terrorism by reaching out to foster understanding.
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Old 08-16-2011, 07:00 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Thank You MQ801

The NY NJ area does do a better job of reporting the truth about us. Possibly because it has long been home to many Muslims.

The Newark/Prospect Park area has a large Sufi population. It could be that because the people in NY/NJ have had years of contact with peace loving Muslims they are more receptive to news that we are anti-Terrorism
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