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Old 09-13-2011, 01:09 PM
 
591 posts, read 561,328 times
Reputation: 66

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Ok speaking as one who does not believe in a literal interpretation of the Hebrew Bible. I will say here that it is debatable that the wholesale genocide happened as it is written about. I will also say that aggression of the Bible is not to get rid of sin and evil but to settle in the land and to do that the folks who lived there were in the way.

It is a pattern of what has happened historically through out history. A new people migrates and those already there fight off the invaders.

It is the history of the United States when the Europeans settled this land and the Native Americans were massacred, exiled and put on reservations.

It happened in Australia to the Aborigine, and it happened in the middle east all through history.

The Bible is not a history book.
The Qur'an is simply a revelation and I believe it has much of what Muhammad thought and his attitudes about Jews and Christians. It also over time changes as his relationships with these groups did not go the way he wanted.

He expected the Jews and Christians to become part of Islam and to accept him, when they didn't he changed the direction of prayer from Jerusalem to Mecca and at that time he becomes much more negative towards Christians and Jews.

You need to understand the context of these writings and what was happening when they were revealed. One can not ever just take a sentence or 2 and really understand why and what it means.

You're still not getting it, though. The God of the OT has been fighting Satan's influence this whole time. Satan taught that there is not a God who would care if you decided to go against God and sin.

He was a fraud. They knew it then and rejected him rightiously. If we don't stand peacefully against the oppression of the Koran, then we enable it.
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Old 09-13-2011, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,390 posts, read 4,223,081 times
Reputation: 2662
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
As a Christian don't you believe all non Christians are going to go to hell?
Well for starters
"Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother."
I think the keyword is "anyone"
"anyone" could be a Christian, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist etc. and yes even someone with no religion.

I'm not looking to debate this point, I know some would disagree and that is fine, you can believe what you want.
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Old 09-13-2011, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,390 posts, read 4,223,081 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boxcar Overkill View Post
New Testiment Jesus doesn't sound so nice after all!



So you have to hate your family to be a Christian?

Quote:
If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple. (Luke 14:26)



That doesn't sound like Jesus loved the Canaanites too awful much.
I believe Jesus was trying to make a point, he knew the people were not really getting it about the seriousness of his message and what it meant to follow him, much like many of us today, if we did there would be world peace and there would be no one starving in Africa.
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Old 09-13-2011, 04:14 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,428,603 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ball Pean View Post
You're still not getting it, though. The God of the OT has been fighting Satan's influence this whole time. Satan taught that there is not a God who would care if you decided to go against God and sin.

He was a fraud. They knew it then and rejected him rightiously. If we don't stand peacefully against the oppression of the Koran, then we enable it.

I understand and I see you and others like you as not much better then the extremist Muslims.

You both spew hate and stand behind your book and attack the others book.

Both the Bible and Qur'an are filled with violent writings.

If you had been born in a Muslim country you would have been screaming against the infidel, but you were born in a Christian country so you are screaming Christian hatred against the other.
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Old 09-13-2011, 04:15 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,428,603 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post
Well for starters
"Anyone who does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother."
I think the keyword is "anyone"
"anyone" could be a Christian, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist etc. and yes even someone with no religion.

I'm not looking to debate this point, I know some would disagree and that is fine, you can believe what you want.

Good because I was directing the question to Ball Pean.
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Old 09-13-2011, 04:29 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,299,862 times
Reputation: 7407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I understand and I see you and others like you as not much better then the extremist Muslims.

You both spew hate and stand behind your book and attack the others book.

Both the Bible and Qur'an are filled with violent writings.

If you had been born in a Muslim country you would have been screaming against the infidel, but you were born in a Christian country so you are screaming Christian hatred against the other.
Every group has it's share of extremists. They are all the same they hide behind the name of Muslim, Christian, Jew, Agnostic, Spiritualist, Hindu, Buddhist etc. Same language, same words, just different faces.
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Old 09-13-2011, 05:16 PM
 
591 posts, read 561,328 times
Reputation: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I understand and I see you and others like you as not much better then the extremist Muslims.

You both spew hate and stand behind your book and attack the others book.

Both the Bible and Qur'an are filled with violent writings.

If you had been born in a Muslim country you would have been screaming against the infidel, but you were born in a Christian country so you are screaming Christian hatred against the other.

There is a huge, antisemite movement that teaches intolerance towards all Jews, and basically everything Holy and good, and all you can do is assume anyone who stands up against that monster and his evil, oppressive doctrine, religious or not, is just as evil and deserving of Hell as Satan himself. Thanks for your support. You are just as oppressing towards Jews as Islam with that attitude.
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Old 09-13-2011, 05:21 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,428,603 times
Reputation: 807
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ball Pean View Post
There is a huge, antisemite movement that teaches intolerance towards all Jews, and basically everything Holy and good, and all you can do is assume anyone who stands up against that monster and his evil, oppressive doctrine, religious or not, is just as evil and deserving of Hell as Satan himself. Thanks for your support. You are just as oppressing towards Jews as Islam with that attitude.

So since you can't convince me of your being right you resort to insults??

No I am not, but I am a JEW... and I understand what it is like to be hated because I am a Jew and I don't want to be the kind of person who hates someone simply because of their religion. I don't want to paint an entire group of people because of the extremists.

I also see hatred coming from not only Muslims, but Christians too.

Last edited by Jazzymom; 09-13-2011 at 05:37 PM..
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Old 09-13-2011, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Northern Va. from N.J.
4,390 posts, read 4,223,081 times
Reputation: 2662
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Good because I was directing the question to Ball Pean.
I know but thought I would chime in
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Old 09-13-2011, 06:53 PM
 
Location: Sitting beside Walden Pond
4,609 posts, read 4,117,121 times
Reputation: 1399
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
I also see hatred coming from not only Muslims, but Christians too.
Jazzy, if you were a Muslim living in the Gaza Strip or in the West Bank area, would you feel there was hatred toward you coming from the Jews in Israel?
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