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Old 09-17-2011, 01:23 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
It is all a matter of perspective as to who is a terrorist and who is a defender.

To the residents of Afghanistan and Iraq the USA aircraft are aggressors and terrorists, to the American public they are noble defenders of democracy fighting terrorism.

Those who fight the foreigners on the soil of Iraq and Afghanistan are seen as freedoms fighters and defenders of their nation by the people living there, but to the Foreign troops they are seen as terrorists.

Point of view is the difference between who is a terrorist and who is a defender and protector.

Iraq was a country we had no right to go into, but Afghanistan is another story. They were being run by the Taliban and had given al queda safe haven.

I believe there are plenty of Afghanis who were happy to see the taliban leave and I suspect many many women will suffer if they come back.

There are freedom fighters and there are terrorists and there is a difference. Killing on purpose innocent men women and children just to make a statement is not freedom fighting it is terrorism.
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Old 09-17-2011, 01:32 PM
 
Location: NC, USA
7,088 posts, read 13,044,384 times
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How do Americans treat Muslims

The same way I treat any religious person, as long as they do not preach at me, I ignore the religion and treat them with the same dignity as I would want any human being to treat me.
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Old 09-18-2011, 02:23 PM
 
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
Iraq was a country we had no right to go into, but Afghanistan is another story. They were being run by the Taliban and had given al queda safe haven.

I believe there are plenty of Afghanis who were happy to see the taliban leave and I suspect many many women will suffer if they come back.

There are freedom fighters and there are terrorists and there is a difference. Killing on purpose innocent men women and children just to make a statement is not freedom fighting it is terrorism.
Right on as usual.

The question I posed and Woodrow responded to had nothing to do with terrorist or the USA being in Iraq or Afghanistan. I only asked why so people who identify their selves as Muslim are killing each other (Recent history, Iran Iraq war). I'm not even talking about Muslim attacks on non-Muslims. The typical response is one saying the USA is violent and points out examples of what some other nations has done and not why people who say they of the same book and messenger are killing each other?

I had this conversation on Friday with a former Muslim friend of mine who has turned away from Islam. I asked the exact same question: "If Islam is all its cut out to be as a modern peaceful religion why is there so much Muslim on Muslim Violence?"
The responses were the same as what I've heard here; 1) "Islam is a religion of personal choice, with no leader, so its up to the individual to decide how they follow the teachings" 2) The Middle Eastern Countries that are engaging in violence and are killing each other over tribal differences and would be at war with each other regardless of religion.

Last edited by LS Jaun; 09-18-2011 at 02:42 PM..
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun View Post
Right on as usual.

The question I posed and Woodrow responded to had nothing to do with terrorist or the USA being in Iraq or Afghanistan. I only asked why so people who identify their selves as Muslim are killing each other (Recent history, Iran Iraq war). I'm not even talking about Muslim attacks on non-Muslims. The typical response is one saying the USA is violent and points out examples of what some other nations has done and not why people who say they of the same book and messenger are killing each other?

I had this conversation on Friday with a former Muslim friend of mine who has turned away from Islam. I asked the exact same question: "If Islam is all its cut out to be as a modern peaceful religion why is there so much Muslim on Muslim Violence?"
The responses were the same as what I've heard here; 1) "Islam is a religion of personal choice, with no leader, so its up to the individual to decide how they follow the teachings" 2) The Middle Eastern Countries that are engaging in violence and are killing each other over tribal differences and would be at war with each other regardless of religion.
Just as in WW2 The majority of the countries were all Christian Nations yet the largest war to date was fought amongst them. If memory serves me correctly every predominately Christian Nation on earth was engaged in war with each other at that time. War has no respect for religion.

No matter what excuses are given for wars, the main goals seem to be
material gains and power.
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Old 09-18-2011, 07:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Just as in WW2 The majority of the countries were all Christian Nations yet the largest war to date was fought amongst them. If memory serves me correctly every predominately Christian Nation on earth was engaged in war with each other at that time. War has no respect for religion.

No matter what excuses are given for wars, the main goals seem to be
material gains and power.

The Nazi movement had NOTHING to do with Christianity. ALl the Islam terrorism and inter-Islammic violence is in the name of "Allah".
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Old 09-18-2011, 08:15 PM
 
Location: USA
19,724 posts, read 14,694,776 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Just as in WW2 The majority of the countries were all Christian Nations yet the largest war to date was fought amongst them. If memory serves me correctly every predominately Christian Nation on earth was engaged in war with each other at that time. War has no respect for religion.

No matter what excuses are given for wars, the main goals seem to be
material gains and power.

I'm not talking about Christianity which I expect violence from. Islam appears not better and worse in many respects as much of the violence is based on how one group worships: Sunni vs Shia vs Suffi.
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Old 09-18-2011, 08:36 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chakraman View Post
The Nazi movement had NOTHING to do with Christianity. ALl the Islam terrorism and inter-Islammic violence is in the name of "Allah".
No the Nazi, movement had nothing to do with Christianity. but those following it were predominatly Christian.

The same is true with Muslim terrorists, because they commit evil does not mean they are following Islam.

A Muslim does everything in the name of Allaah(swt) We begin all thoughts and actions with the words "Bismillah ir Rahman ir Raheem"(In the Name of God, the Provider, the mosdt Merciful) By doing so we are fully aware Allaah(swt) knows every thought, word and action we have. we can not offer the excuse we did not know. We are publicly stating we take full responsibility for our actions.

If a person believes in God(swt) all they do is in the name of God(swt) even if they refuse to acknowledge it as being so.

The issue is if we are pleasing Allaah(swt) or angering Him. The Qur'an is very clear we are not to be aggressors and to fight only in defence.
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Old 09-20-2011, 09:41 PM
 
330 posts, read 497,840 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
No the Nazi, movement had nothing to do with Christianity. but those following it were predominatly Christian.

The same is true with Muslim terrorists, because they commit evil does not mean they are following Islam.

A Muslim does everything in the name of Allaah(swt) We begin all thoughts and actions with the words "Bismillah ir Rahman ir Raheem"(In the Name of God, the Provider, the mosdt Merciful) By doing so we are fully aware Allaah(swt) knows every thought, word and action we have. we can not offer the excuse we did not know. We are publicly stating we take full responsibility for our actions.

If a person believes in God(swt) all they do is in the name of God(swt) even if they refuse to acknowledge it as being so.

The issue is if we are pleasing Allaah(swt) or angering Him. The Qur'an is very clear we are not to be aggressors and to fight only in defence.
actuall ww2 was not a war about religion, catholics and prodistants did not kill each other and bomb eachothers churches. Muslims have religious wars with eachother, the sunni vs the shia. BIG difference.
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Old 09-20-2011, 09:52 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,284,120 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the-writer-guy View Post
actuall ww2 was not a war about religion, catholics and prodistants did not kill each other and bomb eachothers churches. Muslims have religious wars with eachother, the sunni vs the shia. BIG difference.
Sunni = Most of the world's Muslims

Shi'i=Iran, almost all of the world's Shi'i live in Iran or are of Iranian ancestry.

You have oil wealth added in and it becomes Iran vs the Arab world for the oil contracts. add to it that the Iranians are Aryans unrelated to the Arabs and much closer to Germany in race and Language. Prejudice becomes another factor. The shi'i- sunni disputes all boil down to national power, oil wealth and national identity, not of religion.
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Old 09-20-2011, 10:39 PM
 
52 posts, read 47,778 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
No the Nazi, movement had nothing to do with Christianity. but those following it were predominatly Christian.

The same is true with Muslim terrorists, because they commit evil does not mean they are following Islam.

A Muslim does everything in the name of Allaah(swt) We begin all thoughts and actions with the words "Bismillah ir Rahman ir Raheem"(In the Name of God, the Provider, the mosdt Merciful) By doing so we are fully aware Allaah(swt) knows every thought, word and action we have. we can not offer the excuse we did not know. We are publicly stating we take full responsibility for our actions.

If a person believes in God(swt) all they do is in the name of God(swt) even if they refuse to acknowledge it as being so.

The issue is if we are pleasing Allaah(swt) or angering Him. The Qur'an is very clear we are not to be aggressors and to fight only in defence.

The Koran as hate speech, teaches to fight against all non believers until there are none left in the world. Muhammad committed genocide,rape, and slavery against "non believers". You're not fooling anyone.
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