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Old 10-26-2011, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
30,883 posts, read 31,765,340 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reed067 View Post
So then why do they want to pass laws that violate the sepration of chruch & state? And have.
They have? What laws are those?
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Old 10-27-2011, 12:51 AM
 
Location: Gone
1,011 posts, read 1,077,942 times
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This is what they want from Finland also....

I rather chooce to die free than live like a way of muslims. Their way to live is like a horror movie and they keep that as a perfect way to live... How about muslims first stop abusing and violence against creatures of the Earth ? How about starting change of yourselves? Christians did this same thing, traveled trough the world, killed, abused, destroyed cultures and now when Christians finally stopped killing and forcing it is muslims which are doing this same thing??? I mean reaaally???

Why every each religion have to do this same **** all over again? Why every each nation have to do this all over again? Why everyone just do not stop fighting, damnet. People has fought 10 000 years, dont you ever get enough

How about next 10 000 years you try to control and judge only yourself.. If you want to cut arms, cut your own arm. If you want to cover heads, cover your own head, if you want to slap, slap yourself....

This is not just about muslimity, lol, but everything... Just stop fighting... Go to your corners and stay there as long as you can play nice with each others .
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Old 10-28-2011, 03:41 AM
 
Location: The Netherlands
8,567 posts, read 14,804,653 times
Reputation: 1573
Originally Posted by Boxcar Overkill
Quote:
Let me put it this way: I want America to be MORE libertarian. In many respects, this means being more like The Netherlands, a country I've visted, enjoyed, and think is right about many things.

I just don't see how promoting the adoption of Sharia law gets us closer to that goal. We have enough trouble managing our Christian fundementalist without bringing in more from the outside.
And do you now why The Netherlands is libertarian?
That is because religion (or lack of religion) is not a big thing here.
The Netherlands were a kingdom, then a republic and then a kingdom again.
Not because of ideology or religion, but simply out of pragmatism.
We realised that we can't let our nation be destroyed because of a few powerful families fighting for control, so we became a monarchy again after having tried to be a republic.

The Dutch Muslims (even with Wilders and his party being anti-Islam) don't want (or need) their own Muslim party simply because the other existing 'native' political parties already meet their needs.
Most Dutch Muslims already realise that the freedom a democracy brings (from pluriformity) outweighs the false security a sharia offers.
They know that they already posses the freedom & democracy most Muslims in the Arab nation are fighting for.
Heck, we even have imams who preach in Dutch instead of Arabic.
In short if Muslims want to adopt Sharia law in The Netherlands and they want to achieve it through the democratic system then they should be able to try. I doubt they'll achieve but they certainly have the democratic right to try.


Originally Posted by RiippaKiwi
Quote:
Why every each religion have to do this same **** all over again? Why every each nation have to do this all over again? Why everyone just do not stop fighting, damnet. People has fought 10 000 years, dont you ever get enough
Each culture has to go through the same phase for the same reason each individual goes through puberty growing up.
I mean regardless of religion every child goes through the phase where he believes that his father is superior to all other fathers.
How else could a child believe that he is safe?
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Old 10-28-2011, 03:44 AM
 
Location: Harrisonburg, VA
994 posts, read 1,464,155 times
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All I hear in that video is BLA BLA BLA BLA
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Old 10-28-2011, 03:44 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,282,205 times
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An interesting view. In the UK when Muslims attempt to instill Islamic morality in a predominantly Pakistani Muslim community it is called imposing shariah on the British. At every Muslim in the world gets condemned for it.

However, when The Guardian Angels restores Christian Morality to a Baltimore Neighborhood, it is called "Taking Back the Neighborhood" and they get praised for it.



What is the difference between the OP's video and this one? Why is one condemned and the other praised?
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Old 10-28-2011, 06:04 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,425,900 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
An interesting view. In the UK when Muslims attempt to instill Islamic morality in a predominantly Pakistani Muslim community it is called imposing shariah on the British. At every Muslim in the world gets condemned for it.

However, when The Guardian Angels restores Christian Morality to a Baltimore Neighborhood, it is called "Taking Back the Neighborhood" and they get praised for it.



What is the difference between the OP's video and this one? Why is one condemned and the other praised?

The Alliance of Guardian Angels

Guardian Angels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There is difference in muslims imposing sharia law in a muslim neighborhood in England or any other democratic society. If they want to live in an Islamic society then they need to move to a Muslim country.

England is having trouble with Muslim neighborhoods imposing sharia law on its inhabitants and that is not ok.

The Guardian angels are not trying to impose Christian law.

All who live in democratic societies need to fight the imposition of sharia law in their countries. When you immigrate to a country you live under the laws of that land.

Last edited by Jazzymom; 10-28-2011 at 06:17 PM..
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:15 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,282,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post
The Alliance of Guardian Angels

Guardian Angels - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There is difference in muslims imposing sharia law in a muslim neighborhood in England or any other democratic society. If they want to live in an Islamic society then they need to move to a Muslim country.

England is having trouble with Muslim neighborhoods imposing sharia law on its inhabitants and that is not ok.

The Guardian angels are not trying to impose Christian law.

All who live in democratic societies need to fight the imposition of sharia law in their countries. When you immigrate to a country you live under the laws of that land.
Except here in the USA most of the Muslims have lived in the USA for their entire lives and have family roots that go back many generations. There were American Muslim fighting the British in the Revolutionary war. And in every war the USA has ever been involved in.

And in spite of what you may have read, very few if any Muslims have any desire to enforce Sharia(Religious) law upon Non-Muslims. Just as the Judaic laws do not apply to non-Jews, shariah law can not be applied for non-Muslims. We have never asked for more than the right to civil law under Shariah for civil matters concerning only Muslims. The very same thing the Jews have in every US State.

You may also want to read about the Pakistan Muslims in the UK and how, why and when they came to the UK. As hard as is to believe, many if not most are from families that fought for the UK against the Hindus in colonial India and the families were granted full British Hereditary citizenship and were guaranteed, Land, income and knighthoods for all descendants that migrated to the UK. When they first started coming into the UK in 1947 they came as kighted roals with the rights and privilages of knights. the attitude changed in the 196-s-1980s when the British "Teddy-boy" gangs formed and began attacking the Pakistani Neighborhoods. do a Google Search for "Teddy Boys" and "Paki-Bashing". The Pakistanis in the UK want there neighborhoods back to how they were prior to the 1980s and the arrival of prostitution, liquor sales and night clubs in what was their home area granted to them by Queen Victoria.
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:24 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,282,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Except here in the USA most of the Muslims have lived in the USA for their entire lives and have family roots that go back many generations. There were American Muslim fighting the British in the Revolutionary war. And in every war the USA has ever been involved in.

And in spite of what you may have read, very few if any Muslims have any desire to enforce Sharia(Religious) law upon Non-Muslims. Just as the Judaic laws do not apply to non-Jews, shariah law can not be applied for non-Muslims. We have never asked for more than the right to civil law under Shariah for civil matters concerning only Muslims. The very same thing the Jews have in every US State.

You may also want to read about the Pakistan Muslims in the UK and how, why and when they came to the UK. As hard as is to believe, many if not most are from families that fought for the UK against the Hindus in colonial India and the families were granted full British Hereditary citizenship and were guaranteed, Land, income and knighthoods for all descendants that migrated to the UK. When they first started coming into the UK in 1947 they came as kighted roals with the rights and privilages of knights. the attitude changed in the 196-s-1980s when the British "Teddy-boy" gangs formed and began attacking the Pakistani Neighborhoods. do a Google Search for "Teddy Boys" and "Paki-Bashing". The Pakistanis in the UK want there neighborhoods back to how they were prior to the 1980s and the arrival of prostitution, liquor sales and night clubs in what was their home area granted to them by Queen Victoria.
to get everybody headed in the right direction, start with this wiki article: HERE
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Old 10-28-2011, 07:26 PM
 
4,083 posts, read 4,425,900 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodrow LI View Post
Except here in the USA most of the Muslims have lived in the USA for their entire lives and have family roots that go back many generations. There were American Muslim fighting the British in the Revolutionary war. And in every war the USA has ever been involved in.

And in spite of what you may have read, very few if any Muslims have any desire to enforce Sharia(Religious) law upon Non-Muslims. Just as the Judaic laws do not apply to non-Jews, shariah law can not be applied for non-Muslims. We have never asked for more than the right to civil law under Shariah for civil matters concerning only Muslims. The very same thing the Jews have in every US State.

You may also want to read about the Pakistan Muslims in the UK and how, why and when they came to the UK. As hard as is to believe, many if not most are from families that fought for the UK against the Hindus in colonial India and the families were granted full British Hereditary citizenship and were guaranteed, Land, income and knighthoods for all descendants that migrated to the UK. When they first started coming into the UK in 1947 they came as kighted roals with the rights and privilages of knights. the attitude changed in the 196-s-1980s when the British "Teddy-boy" gangs formed and began attacking the Pakistani Neighborhoods. do a Google Search for "Teddy Boys" and "Paki-Bashing". The Pakistanis in the UK want there neighborhoods back to how they were prior to the 1980s and the arrival of prostitution, liquor sales and night clubs in what was their home area granted to them by Queen Victoria.
Woodrow if folks want to live under sharia law they need to go to a muslim country. You cannot have different types of laws for different groups.

Sharia law is not like Judaic law.

I do not live under Judaic law I live under US law in a democracy.

When you live in a country you live by the laws of that land. I don't care how long folks live in a country, when they want to change its laws to reflect their religious law then there is a problem.

Again I won't argue. I feel very strongly that those who want to live under Islamic law need to move to a country with forms of Islamic law.

Countries should fight being torn apart by having different laws for different people.
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Old 10-28-2011, 08:03 PM
 
Location: Logan Township, Minnesota
15,511 posts, read 13,282,205 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jazzymom View Post

Countries should fight being torn apart by having different laws for different people.
True, but remember Civil law is not about criminal laws. Crimes need to be under identical law and apply equally to all people.

Here in the USA there are already 4 sets of civil law in use with no problems. Native American Tribal Law enforced on the reservations. Napoleonic Law (Catholic Laws) in Louisiana (Which applies to all citizens, not just Catholics) Judaic Law for Civil cases involving only Jews. And State civil Law applicable for those who do not desire any religious law (ie civil marriages and church marriages)

Some states are beginning to allow shariah for civil matters involving only Muslims. Nearly every State recognizes Church Marriages, as being as valid as civil marriages. Why can't an Islamic Marriage under shariah be just as legal as a Protestant, Jewish or Catholic Marriage. Why can't an Islamic divorce be just as legal as a Catholic annulment?

Being forbidden to have Islamic civil matters handled by an Islamic Agreement, prevents Muslims the right to any civil suits that involve only Muslims. Muslims are forbidden to have a will, yet in order for property to not be confiscated by the State we have to sin in our belief and write wills. We are not permitted to adopt Children, but in order to take care of a deceased relative's children, we have to adopt, committing what we see as a sin. Many other matters between Muslims and other Muslims can not be handled by state civil law and since we can not use an Islamic court, many civil suits can not be enforced in cases that involve only Muslims.

Civil suits are supposed to be non criminal and strictly between the people involved. why can't we handle our personal non-Criminal matters among ourselves, without state interference?
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