U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 06-09-2014, 11:22 AM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
1,687 posts, read 2,058,594 times
Reputation: 2132

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by devotee View Post
My point being that the Zionist want Muslims to attack and kill each other, which is happening at this present time. And, your question is?
My question is: Do you speak for all Muslims when you make that statement?

 
Old 06-10-2014, 12:24 PM
 
352 posts, read 308,370 times
Reputation: 54
Bismillaah ir Rahmaan ir Rahiim In The Name of Allah, The All Compassionate, The All Merciful. As salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuh; The peace be upon you, and The Mercy of Allah and HIS Blessings.




Quote:
Originally Posted by usuario View Post
My question is: Do you even know what a Zionist is?

Did you know that there is no central Zionist organization? That speaking of a Zionist plot is a lot like saying there is an Islamic plot. Who is the person or organization who speaks for Islam? There are hundreds of Zionist groups, some big, some small, and many of them hate each other. Some are completely secular and want to replace Israel with a socialist atheist state, while others are extreme religious Zionism where only religious Jews will have power, and non-religious Jews and Muslims would have to accept their rule or leave. When some crazy Middle Eastern conspiracy theorist blames something on the Zionists, it would be great if he or she could specify WHICH Zionist group poisoned the well, put lasers on sharks, or is sending out brainwashing electromagnetic waves.

Oh, and by the way, by certain definitions, I am a Zionist. If you believe that there should be a land of some kind, somewhere, for all or some Jews, then you are a Zionist.
Thanks for the info. It really doesn't matter that there are any number of zionist groups. Most people, including real Jews, see Israel, as the Zionist entity. Many, real Jews, have left Israel. I think you may be behind the times, concerning Zionism.

Jew Watch - Jewish Atrocities - Israel's Nuclear Blackmail - Samson Option The Jew Watch Project Is The Internet's Largest Scholarly Collection of Articles on Zionist History


3. True or False: The great majority of rabbis welcomed Zionism at the turn of the 19th century.

False. Zionism “was among other things a rebellion against Judaism.” (Theodor Herzl and almost all the other Zionist Founding Fathers were convinced atheists.) When Herzl began his quest for a Jewish homeland, “almost all East European Jews were still living in a ghetto-like Orthodox atmosphere, ruled by the rabbis. All these rabbis, almost without exception, saw Zionism as the great enemy…And not without reason. The Zionists were nationalists – adherents of the new European doctrine that human collectives are based primarily on ethnic origin, language and territory, not on religion. It was the opposite of the Jewish belief that Jews are the people of God, united by the obedience to his commandments….[And,] As everybody knows, God exiled his Chosen People from their land because of their sins. Some day God will forgive them and send the Messiah, who will lead the Jews, including the dead, back to Jerusalem. The Zionists, in their crazy desire to do so themselves, were not only committing a deadly sin, but actually rebelling against the Almighty who had expressly forbidden his people to enter the holy country en masse.” http://palestinechronicle.com/view_a...s.php?id=19327
In contrast, the Orthodox are “the offspring of the tiny minority of religious Jews who did join the Zionists right from the beginning. They are now a large community. Not only are they ardent Zionists, but they are…leading the settlement enterprise and violent right-wing Zionism. They don’t just accept the state and the army – they aspire to lead both, and have made considerable progress in that direction. Yet in religious affairs…they are becoming more and more extreme, approaching the [ultra-] Orthodox.” http://palestinechronicle.com/view_a...s.php?id=19327
In the first half of the 20th century, Palestine, like America, was a place where many “young people left the [religious] fold under the influence of secular surroundings. Ultra-Orthodox rabbis discouraged emigration from Eastern Europe—with catastrophic consequences during the Holocaust.” (Gorenberg 2011, 38.)

Israeli Ultra-Orthodox Quiz | Detailed Political Quizzes



Wassalaam. devotee
 
Old 06-10-2014, 12:30 PM
 
352 posts, read 308,370 times
Reputation: 54
Bismillaah ir Rahmaan ir Rahiim In The Name of Allah, The All Compassionate, The All Merciful. As salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuh; The peace be upon you, and The Mercy of Allah and HIS Blessings.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaser199 View Post
My question is: Do you speak for all Muslims when you make that statement?


Certainly not. Although there are Muslims with the same view, I can speak only for myself. Wassalaam. devotee
 
Old 06-10-2014, 04:21 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
1,687 posts, read 2,058,594 times
Reputation: 2132
Quote:
Originally Posted by devotee View Post
Certainly not. Although there are Muslims with the same view, I can speak only for myself.
But you believe that all Zionists want Muslims to fight and kill each other? First, from where do you derive that fact? Second, given the fact that most Jews support Israel and therefore can be labeled as Zionists, do you believe that these Jews also support Muslims killing one another? Aren't you painting with a broad brush? Why even did you inject politics into this thread?
 
Old 06-11-2014, 08:26 AM
 
352 posts, read 308,370 times
Reputation: 54
Bismillaah ir Rahmaan ir Rahiim In The Name of Allah, The All Compassionate, The All Merciful. As salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuh; The peace be upon you, and The Mercy of Allah and HIS Blessings.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaser199 View Post
But you believe that all Zionists want Muslims to fight and kill each other? First, from where do you derive that fact? Second, given the fact that most Jews support Israel and therefore can be labeled as Zionists, do you believe that these Jews also support Muslims killing one another? Aren't you painting with a broad brush? Why even did you inject politics into this thread?

Salaam. You have not comprehended my replies in the above posts. Please read the above posts again. Wassalaam. devotee
 
Old 06-11-2014, 12:20 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
939 posts, read 1,261,717 times
Reputation: 760
To devotee:

What is YOUR definition of a Zionist?

There are Zionists who are non-Jews, ultra-Orthodox Jewish "Zionists" who believe that Israel's land should be returned to the Palestinians until the masih comes, and even Muslim Zionists.

When you say "Zionists did ...", which group of Zionists are you talking about? The Israeli government?

"Jew Watch" is an openly anti-Semitic website. To the author's eyes, there is no difference between a Jew and a Zionist, they are the same thing. Whenever a Jewish person does something bad, Jew Watch reports it as a Zionist crime. Is this what you believe?
 
Old 06-11-2014, 12:49 PM
 
Location: Long Island, NY
1,687 posts, read 2,058,594 times
Reputation: 2132
Quote:
Originally Posted by devotee View Post
You have not comprehended my replies in the above posts. Please read the above posts again.
My reading comprehension is quite good. I don't understand why you injected "Zionists" into your thread which was posted in a religious forum. Plus, as usuario pointed out, you quote from anti-Semitic sources such as "Jew Watch." Was this way of appealing for peace among the warring Islamic sects?
 
Old 06-11-2014, 03:39 PM
 
352 posts, read 308,370 times
Reputation: 54
Bismillaah ir Rahmaan ir Rahiim In The Name of Allah, The All Compassionate, The All Merciful. As salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuh; The peace be upon you, and The Mercy of Allah and HIS Blessings.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaser199 View Post
My reading comprehension is quite good. I don't understand why you injected "Zionists" into your thread which was posted in a religious forum. Plus, as usuario pointed out, you quote from anti-Semitic sources such as "Jew Watch." Was this way of appealing for peace among the warring Islamic sects?

Salaam. Perhaps your reading comprehension is quite good, but you've missed the following:

Quote:
It really doesn't matter that there are any number of zionist groups. Most people, including real Jews, see Israel, as the Zionist entity.
I mentioned 'Zionist' in a previous post, which contained a news article. I was responding to that article because Israel, was bombing Syria, and preparing to send in troops. Of course they would prefer to see Muslims killing each other.

The articles by Jews, cannot be anti-Semitic. This is similar to the problem some people have with Arabs. Arabs are Semites too. Re: "The Jew Watch Project Is The Internet's Largest Scholarly Collection of Articles on Zionist History."

As for posting in a religious forum, Islam can also be looked upon as a religion. There are Muslims fighting in Syria.

I think that the following videos will make thing clearer, concerning who is, and who isn't a Jew:



Jews protest against Israel and Zionism. - YouTube Jews protest against Israel and Zionism.


Jews Against Zionism - YouTube Jews Against Zionism


Jews United Against Zionism, United Nations, January 4, 2009 - YouTube Jews United Against Zionism, United Nations, January 4, 2009


Jewish Rabbis Against Zionism - YouTube Jewish Rabbis Against Zionism



Wassalaam. devotee
 
Old 06-11-2014, 09:44 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA
939 posts, read 1,261,717 times
Reputation: 760
Answer the question, devotee. What is YOUR definition of a Zionist?

People can be Semites and be anti-Semitic, I don't know where you got the idea that people can't hate the ethnic group or race they belong to, whether or not they identify with that ethnic group or race is another story.
 
Old 06-12-2014, 04:01 AM
 
352 posts, read 308,370 times
Reputation: 54
Bismillaah ir Rahmaan ir Rahiim In The Name of Allah, The All Compassionate, The All Merciful. As salaamu alaykum wa rahmatullaahi wa barakaatuh; The peace be upon you, and The Mercy of Allah and HIS Blessings.

Salaam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by usuario View Post
Answer the question, devotee. What is YOUR definition of a Zionist?

People can be Semites and be anti-Semitic, I don't know where you got the idea that people can't hate the ethnic group or race they belong to, whether or not they identify with that ethnic group or race is another story.

Sick people will hate and discriminate against their own ethnicity. And, why must I have a particular definition for zionism?

Antisemitism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Antisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism) is prejudice, hatred of, or discrimination against Jews as a national, ethnic, religious or racial group.[1] A person who holds such positions is called an "antisemite". As Jews are an ethnoreligious group, antisemitism is generally considered a form of racism.


A Definition of Zionism | Jewish Virtual Library


Abroad, critics of Israel use Zionism as a kind of poisonous potion to exacerbate every accusation against the state. Many critics believe that the solution to Israel’s future lies in the de-Zionization of its identity. Among Israel’s sworn enemies, “Zionist” is a demonic epithet, a term of denunciation that replaces the word “Israeli” or “Jew.” Hamas members speak of the captured Zionist soldier, and Hezbollah and Iran speak of the criminal Zionist entity, not about Israel. *Advertisement
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Religion and Spirituality > Islam
Follow City-Data.com founder on our Forum or

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2019, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35 - Top